to think nursery staff shouldn't be shouting so much?

[FeistyLass]

Ds has just turned 4 and started nursery in August. Prior to that he was at home. We had initial settling in problems at the nursery and then everything was fine. However for last 3 weeks, he has been saying he doesn't want to go to nursery because they shout at him a lot. He gets very upset.
Now although he's not been at nursery before he has always been to groups like Mini Kickers, Little Tiger Cubs, street dance. There has never been an issue with his behaviour before and none of those teachers felt the need to shout at him. The nursery is a tiny private one with 1 teacher for every 4 pupils. I'm struggling with why they would need to shout so much. Am I just out of touch?
Also, when we had his parent's night a few weeks ago they said he rarely writes at nursery and just does scribbles. At home, he can write some short words unaided. It seems to me that he just isn't engaging with the nursery staff at all and despite the ratio of teachers to pupils they're not really spending any time trying to get him to engage. Am I expecting too much? Or are these signs that he's really unhappy and we should think about a new nursery?

No that's not on. Staff at ds's nursery never shout, they would be disciplined for that. Need to look for new one I think

Is there a way you can find out how much shouting is going on? (Arrive early to pick up? Drop in during the day?).

Staff may need to shout if there is imminent hazard, or just to cut across a noisy room. If those are the reasons, then your DS needs reassurance, and the staff need to be aware that he is currently sensitive to raised voices, and one hopes it will resolve from that.

If however there is more shouting than that, you may want to consider talking to the management and explaining the detrimental effect. If they do not seem willing to take it seriously, then find another nursery, and tell the existing one that is why you are leaving (and tell anyone else who enquires about the reason for the change, not to be bitchy but simply so they are aware of potential issues should they be considering a place there).

DD's private nursery never shout at a child. The model positive behaviour.

The state school nursery that DD now goes to the teacher does sometimes shout. However there is a ratio of 1 to 10 and shouting is still rare. DD told me about an incident when a child bit another child so hard that he drew blood. Apparently the teacher shouted at the biter, which I suppose is understandable.

I think you should look at other nurseries. What you are describing is not typical.

Def shouldn't be shouting, but to give them benefit of the doubt does your son mean staff shout in a way to get attention/give instructions or even if giving a child a row they are maybe speaking sternly in slightly raised tones? (Work in early years and sometimes children say staff are shouting when they actually aren't!)

However even if staff are not shouting AT a child, it doesn't sound a particularly calm nurturing environment! As for the writing, what resources do they provide & how is it generally encouraged? If its a harsh shouty environment with no nice pens paper etc and/or not encouraged in a context eg role play, and for real purposes such as writing name on picture, them I can see why he wouldn't be writing at nursery. Either way I'd look into what goes on a bit more, but yes staff shouldnt be telling at children all the time!

Thanks, everyone.
EdithWeston, that's a good idea. I'll try to pop up one afternoon and see what's going on.
Bonbonchance, yes, I see what you mean. He might be confusing stern talking with shouting. I know they have a writing table but I don't know if they have nice pens, pencils, etc. At the parent's night, the teacher said even if we do dotted letters he doesn't join them up but then a few days later ds' key worker said we haven't tried dotted letters with him (are they just expecting him to write freehand at 4?!)
Dh is dyslexic and nursery are aware that means there is a chance ds could be, so they had assured us they would give him more support.
I really need to find out more about what's going on. I'll start by popping up during the day.

There shouldn't be shouting, but some raised voices to get attention, or a 'cross voice' to convey that behaviour is not acceptable is ok IMO. That is very different from shouting though. I would try to find out how much shouting goes on, maybe spend some time there to see how they deal with behaviour and discipline, or turn up early and watch if you can.

I don't think that the writing is a problem. Many nurseries focus on 'learning through play' and you have to remember that nursery is not school. They will not be teaching children how to read and write, although they can do phonics or number sessions and encourage children who can to write their own name on things. I wouldn't think that just because a child isn't working words at nursery that the staff aren't engaging, they could well be. It is easy for parents to get hung up on the formal a academic type learning while forgetting about all the other things that children learn while at nursery.

You could ask to spend a couple of mornings at the nursery with your ds and at the same time have a good look through his profile and the observations they will have done on him. That might help give you a better idea of what goes on when you aren't there.

I feel ver sad for you and your little boy that he feels unwelcome and frightened. That's not how it should be at all. The priority should always be the child's well being and sense of belonging. This is key to their learning and development.

Could you ask the manager for a meeting and explain what he is saying and how he is behaving, and ask them for ideas on helping him to settle. This should be their paramount concern. If they do not respond positively to your approach, I would be inclined to consider moving him.