Who really gets £500+ weekly state benefits?

[vivizone]

I find this shit so hard to believe. Reading the media, you would think this was a common figure on life on benefits.

Yesterday and today's Metro newspaper - people writing in saying they agree with the cap of £500 and why should people be sat on their arse and be rewarded by £500 per week. . Why should they earn £200 per week working and people are getting £500 a week doing nothing.

Seriously, who gets this £500 per week that is being peddled out of the media? I spent 7 months out of work after redundancy and I could not live on the pittance I received for me and my children. I do not know how people do it. I really don't. I had a decent redundancy package and that was the only way I could make it.

How many people do you know (forget the newspaper stories) that are RECEIVING £500 or more every week? I thought so.

How come if life is/was that cushy on benefits, not enough people are/were packing in their jobs to join a life of riley?

We have been had. Life on benefits is HARD and DEMORALISING. I have tried it and I can tell you you get PEANUTS.

The reason why stories run on people living in million dollar homes/getting thousands a week in benefits is because it is RARE. It is SO rare, that it gets reported on.

No expat it'll be my long term investment paid off, £200 will be nothing in 20 years when the house has been paid for.

I'm really not suggesting it's on a par with benefits claimants at all, I actually think the rise in housing benefit caused the priced of property to spiral out of control. Both rental and purchased housing. Hopefully the cuts will push down heh prices for those receiving HB and those who don't.

my brother in law is a security gaurd his wife is a sahm, they have six kids and own 2 houses

i just thought u know while we are sharing personal anecdotes

my mum is a teacher, single mum, bought her council flat, for 40k, sold it for 60k and bought our house for 85k.....

Young people will be fine, what you're really complaining about is those who are in mid to late 40's who've had every opportunity and blown it or wasted it one way or another and now the golden goose has stopped laying.

I don't understand what you mean by that. Do you mean that house prices have been allowed to disproportionately increase way out of line with income and anyone who didn't buy 10 years ago is shafted, hence the golden goose phrase? High house prices never were a golden goose. The only people they benefit are the people who bought them cheaply, or should I say at a realistic price. They do not benefit anyone else, certainly not the renters who can't save for a deposit, not the government who have to pay out housing benefits to cover high rents and not the economy, as everyone else has less money to spend. Oh but never mind, as long as property investors are ok eh?

I actually think the rise in housing benefit caused the priced of property to spiral out of control

WHAT?!!!

I'm going to regret this. Mosman:-

those who are in mid to late 40's who've had every opportunity and blown it or wasted it one way or another and now the golden goose has stopped laying

Actually I'm a decade older, but this is one perspective on my story. I got sick. I misjudged my predicament; assumed I'd get better in a year or so, and didn't. Lost everything, eventually became homeless and now am a tenant 'scrounger'.

You think you'd have made better decisions in my situation. Does that disqualify me from deserving help to maintain my life and health? People become sick from poverty. What about the large amounts my 'golden goose' paid into the social security system? It's not a personal savings fund - my contributions paid for Mumsnetters' education and their children's healthcare, for example - but I've still not had as much back as I've paid.

How, exactly, do you distinguish 'deserving' from 'scrounger'? And what do you propose for those you label scroungers?

You think the rise in housing benefit caused the priced of property to spiral out of control??

Fine grasp of economics you have there.

mosman why don?t you start your own thread to lament the distress of losing equity in your property portfolio, and stop derailing this one?

Any one with any sense knows full well that ridiculously high house prices are not good news for anyone. I do sense a feeling of entitlement with multiple property owners. They refuse to acknowledge that their 'investment' is not worth what they think it is, they always argue why house prices will never come down and then when they try and sell and can't, they always come up with phrases like "I'm not giving it away you know". I'd like to know how many of these property owners could afford to buy their houses now with their current incomes. I'm prepared to bet not many.

Housing benefit sets the lowest price of rentals in an area, this pushed up the prices for the private renters and the property investors took the housing benefit rental they could command and worked backwards in terms of whether it was worth buying houses.
Terraces that cost £30,000 could suddenly command a yield of £6,000 a year and suddenly they were worth £120,000 pricing out the first time buyers who now probably don't even get HB but are competing for homes with those that do.

The poster up thread who asked about the tapered disregard. Sorry I didn't notice the question at first.

Basicly this will make not a jot of a difference to you if you already claim wtc,

Have a brief look at this. www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/ucpbn-14-disregards-tapers.pdf

It's mainly designed to make a difference to those already out of work who start work until they get to hour earnings that would make them entitled to wtc as it stands now.

From what I can work out a person currently working lets say a lone parent with 3 kids who has always worked but does 16 hours with uc will be worse off than she/ he is now, but its hard to work that out compleatly as the only uc calc I can find is set up for a very different reason than customer information. So working out is done only in my head using the different rules.

Out of interest has anybody Sussed out that not only will there be massive homeless issues for tenants with homelessness being at a all time high but there are going to be all these landlords who end up with empty houses that cannot fill them due to the rules with hb.

If you have say 5000 housed people in an area in private rented houses whose housing support comes to an end. It's not house dependant there support ends these are the same tenants who would be rerenting a new house but can't.

Rising HB and widespread HMOs did indeed influence property prices mosman is right. I work in property and many BTL landlords base what they will pay for a house on what 'per room' rental they can achieve eg students or local HB rates thus setting local prices according what will cover their mortgage. It is a nightmare for local people trying to buy and sell in areas with big uni communities like where I live in brighton.

i wasnt going to engage further but i cant help myself

there is an important difference between influence and cause noddy

just for starters...

since when can uni students claim hb?

so basically if my husband works and i dont we get wtc we will be worse off? lol

Noddy and Mosman. Housing benefit is set at the lowest 25% of the rental market. The percentage has gone down recently, but the principle is the same - this cannot push prices up, because it's determined by current prices.

there are going to be all these landlords who end up with empty houses

Sock, this is the one thing I hope might change the policy. If they enact this rule next April, then April 2015 will put hundreds of thousands off housing benefit and cause a massive hole in the market.

Alternatively, they might enact it retrospectively but that will only bring the problem forward to next year.

The next elections are May 2015, aren't they? All any party would have to do to win is rehome all the people who've just been kicked out ... and I wonder if the condems have some wheeze in store for that very scenario.

I didn't say they could I am talking about house prices in general being influenced by externals. I work in property so I am aware of how it works. I am not agreeing with mosman in general but on this she is right. It is a cause not a law maybe but any agent in this town will calculate prices in cheaper areas according to HB figures and no of rooms that can be let individually.

Well I'm sorry you aren't agreeing with me generally because the only bloody point in trying to make us that landlords aren't all monopoly board players hoovering up all the pieces, some of us are justvtryingvto hold on to what we spent years saving for and due to circumstances can't live in and hold onto jobs.
Oh the irony if somebody on housing benefit gets to enjoy all the literally benefit of our hard work. You do wonder why you bother at times.

If you're saying they all set their rents according to current HB rates, they will drive prices down. I'm sure that isn't happening.

Say there are 100 1-bed rentals in your area. They go from £500 a week to £50 a week. Starting at the bottom, the 25th rent up is £100. A single aged 30+ or a couple would get up to £100 housing benefit this month.

Your clients all set their rentals according to maximum HB. Now half the 1-beds in your area are £100. The top flat is still £500, but the £50 flat is re-marketed at £100. The only people to suffer this month are the ratepayers, as the LA pays £100 rent for the crappy flats that were charging less.

However, there's a glut of 1-bed flats for rent at £100 because you - their agent - have marketed them all at that price. Landlords are either going to have to improve their properties to command higher rents from a different kind of tenant, or reduce the rent to keep them filled.

It's easier to cut the rent, so half of them drop to £90. Now the bottom 25 rents are all £90 so this will be next month's housing benefit rate.

You say all the landlords in that market will set their rents at HB. So now they all have to drop to £90. And the same thing will happen again.

Since this isn't how it's working out in real life, Noddy, I fear your comprehension of your market is a little too simplistic?

'Oh the irony if somebody on housing benefit gets to enjoy all the literally benefit of our hard work.'

Eh? You keep the asset after they leave. The house is yours after the mortgage is paid up, and, as 80% of those in receipt of HB are working, chances are, they worked quite hard to help you pay that mortgage.

Rents are dropping or at least not increasing with inflation. They certainly haven't risen in the last 5 years which in real terms means they are dropping because housing benefit isn't increasing. I think they will drop further, landlords that are geared towards the housing benefit market aren't suddenly going to just leave their property empty they will take what they can get and top up the difference themselves. Supply and demand works both ways and those who work and are competing with HB will benefit directly, maybe they can then save for their deposits.

I know expat it's my lookout eh
The tenants pay their rent and get to enjoy the benefit of living in a house they didn't need to put down £30,000 of their savings as a deposit and they get to enjoy a roof over their heads, hardly doing me a favour dear. And I don't pretend to be doing them one, it's a business arrangement like any other.

'The tenants pay their rent and get to enjoy the benefit of living in a house they didn't need to put down £30,000 of their savings as a deposit and they get to enjoy a roof over their heads, hardly doing me a favour dear.'

Enjoy a roof over their heads? They're paying you money for a basic commodity, shelter, dear. Maybe they're low-earners who don't have a chance in hell of saving £30,000 for a deposit, how is this 'enjoying your hard work'? They're paying to rent the space. If you're unhappy with the arrangement, you can sell the house and invest the procedes to buy something else when you return to the UK. You still have the asset, they don't.

I don't think so garlic. I know the local market inside out and have made a good living and am thankfully comfortable and financially solvent so it is not simplistic at all.(hides thread)

its making me feel a little bit sick mosman to hear you talk about this situation in the way you do

'HB calimants benefiting from all your hard work'???

all the market analysis aye?

some people just want a home for their family