to think it is not really racist to call someone an Australian - is it?

[5Foot5]

I have just read a story in our local newspaper about a woman in court accused of, along with other things, racist abuse. It seems that in a drunken row with another woman she called the other woman "a drunken, fat Australian". The other woman is actually a New Zealander and took exception to this.

In court the attending officers confirmed that they had heard the word "Australian" being used and prosecution argues that it was clearly used in a racist manner. The magistrates obviously agreed and the woman was found guilty of racially abusive public disorder.

Now, from the rest of the report it does sound like this woman was behaving like a toal arse and deserved to end up in court and charged with something. But is it really racist to call someone an Australian? I wonder if it still would have been racist if she had correctly identifed the accent as being from New Zealand?

ha. I think it was the fact that the woman's nationality came into play at all, that was the racist part...

1. Australian isn't a race.
2. I've never known 'Australian' used in a perjorative sense.
3. A lot of magistrates are pretty thick.

Bit weird I don't think I'd find it racist if someone called me a fat Norwegian, I'd just be like "err no I'm not"

I'm impressed that she could pronounce the phrase 'drunken fat Australian' when pissed. :) Sounds quite polite, in fact. Suspect what was actually said was rather fruitier and more sweary....

I'm assuming that its more the fact it was used to insult, than the actual word itself being a problem.

As MrsBethel points out, nationalities aren't races, so it can't be racist to call her that. She might have been irritated in the way my DH is irritated when people assume he's English (he's Scots) but it's not racist. Things like this make me sigh.

she called the other woman "a drunken, fat Australian". The other woman is actually a New Zealander and took exception to this
She didn't take exception to being called drunken and fat, then?

Do Australia and New Zealand have an England/Wales thing?

Even so it seems a bit much to say it's racist. I have been asked if I'm English many a time and simply answered "no". I'd be more upset at being called fat than English.

I get mistaken for being Polish fairly regularly. When I worked in a supermarket a smack head came in asking for tinfoil,didn't understand what he was saying and he shouted to my colleague "oh mate,is she one of them fucking Polish who can't speak English?". I was a bit about that. Not offended that he thought I was Polish but a bit taken aback at how he spoke about Polish people given he thought I was one!

Flimflammery Wed 21-Nov-12 13:56:22
she called the other woman "a drunken, fat Australian". The other woman is actually a New Zealander and took exception to this
She didn't take exception to being called drunken and fat, then?

I know!! That's what I thought.

Elsewhere in the report it says that she threatened to kill the other woman's dog and then blew raspberries at her. Clearly a nasty piece of work. I am just bemused that they seem to have focussed on what I thought to be the least offensive bit of the whole tirade to make an issue from.

So the full offensive tirade was 'I'll kill your dog you drunken, fat Australian..... ' And that gets you sent down?

Normally I don't post but I had to here.

I beleive nationality in itself is not racist (i.e. Racism is usually defined as views, practices and actions reflecting the belief that humanity is divided into distinct biological groups called races and that members of a certain race share certain attributes which make that group as a whole less desirable, more desirable, inferior).

It is a generalisation and in this instance used to infer inferiority, less desireable characteristics. It is also used as a derogatory term.

Yes, some feel that there is a Australia/New Zealand issue like Wales/Scotland/England. For others it isn't.

I have a general explanation for people when they don't understand that a common term could cause offense I use the following:

When I ask some one to do something I say 'please'. However, I can make someone feel like shit (for want of a better word) by saying 'PLLLEEEASSSEE!!!!!' as if they were scum. I can also turn to someone and look them up and down distainfully and then say 'PLEASE!!!!'

In all of these instances I have technically said 'please' the outcome is very different. (I'm sure you get the idea despite my bad examples).

It is the 'way you say' the word/phrase.

welcome but if someone called me Irish (I'm not, I'm English) that isn't racist.

As others have said, I'd have been far more offended at the "fat, drunken" bit myself!!

So would it be ok to call her a drunken fat kiwi?
Most Brits can't hear the difference between an Australian and new Zealand accent, the person probably thought she was Australian.

Won't it have been racially abusive aggravated public disorder she was convicted of ?

ie her threatening to kill the victim's dog is the main bit and her calling the victim an Australian is a secondary issue.
She still would have been convicted of public disorder, absent her use of the A-word.

In terms of the Equality Act race does include nationality. And there have been reported cases on racism against Australians in an employment context. And French as well, but no direct precedent to guide us regarding a box of frogs.

Perhaps she was called a drunken, fat Austrian and misheard? Was she wearing lederhosen and eating Torten at the time?