For thinking this was very sexist, and for interrupting a meeting to point it out?

[TangoPurple]

I'm a trainee Girl Guide leader, and was at a division meeting a few evenings ago.

It came up about volunteers, and how to distinguish between Leader and Young Leader. Anyway, the definition of each term specified FEMALE - between the ages of 18-65 (or something like that).

So I raised my hand and interrupted the speaker, asking if a male could ever be a Brownie/Guide leader. The room was full of ten other women, and they all looked at me like I was an alien!

The speaker was a bit flustered, saying she's not entirely sure as a man has never volunteered and she'd have to look it up properly. I then asked if women were allowed to volunteer to be Boys' Brigade/Scout/Beavers leaders, and she said yes, of course. I pointed out that I found this quite sexist and unfair.

But it started a little mini convo where one of the women said, 'Let's be serious, would you send your little girl to brownies if a man was in charge?' I was so shocked, I actually burst out laughing. I said that my dd used to go to a male childminder and his wife when she was younger, and I'd actually choose a Brownies group with male leader over a female if one existed. (They never asked my reasons, but here they are in case you're interested: I think it's important for dd to see males in 'typical female roles' and vice versa; She has no father figure/male teachers at school so I think it would be good for her to be around a male in an authoritive position).

I'm just so shocked by this. Does anyone actually know the rules regarding males running Guides/Brownies, as I don't think i can wait 'til next week to find out from my commisioner.

So, AIBU to find this attitude sexist, and was IBU to point it out?

In that case Tailtwister, I suggest you start a Male-only movement. :)

Doe my opinion annoy you Gribbet? If so, why?

I'm sorry, I didn't mean that to come across as snarky.

I do find it annoying that people are so happy to criticize the decisions that members make for these volunteer-run movements, without actually being willing to do anything about it.

So many people complain that their local units are badly run or what have you, but you don't see them volunteering to do a better job.

Round of applause to gribbet and felicity for putting it beautifully

Op how on earth have you got this far in guiding, or indeed why, without figuring this out and feeling it's unjust??

Gribbet: There certainly is in my local units! And in other areas I've lived in! The brownies/guides groups spend a significant amount of time indoors compared to the scout groups, they have fewer camping trips (though roughly the same amount of trips, they just spend more of them sleeping indoors) and do less hetic activities. Games seem to be roughly the same though.

RE female only spaces, fair enough, I agree that these should be available and can understand from the religious POV as to why and pointed out that they do still exist in the form of Girls and Boy Brigade, however, why are boys not offered the same courtesy to have more male only spaces?

Confused that's a good and valid point. I think boys should be allowed a male only environment but the Scouting movement decided to open itself up because not enough boys were going. Which is a shame.

Similarly the boys groups always had female volunteers as it was either that or no volunteers!

GGUK has more members than the scouts and is growing. It does not need input from men.

Felicity, I think I agree with you (I'm a bloke). My daughter belongs to a BGIFC group (Guides for overseas families)

I have, on several occasions, been asked to help out when the usual helpers are unable to attend.

However I have not been asked to actually 'input'. Just to be there as another adult.

P.S. I think any Guides or Brownies leaders need to be treated as godesses. My DD's love attending and gain so much from being a part of the organisation. And all this is provided by VOLUNTEERS.

Boys'/Girls' Brigades are quite different to the Scouting and Guiding movements, I'm very surprised your mentor thinks they're the same. As others have said, men can be unit helpers, just not guiders or leaders. Most areas have mixed Scout groups if you feel that's more appropriate for you or your dd, but there's a lot to be said for girl-only spaces too.

Thank you Mrskeith and complex!

It is very irritating when GGUK is misrepresented in the press/or on here, it happens so frequently.

BGIFC is an amazing branch of GGUK and I'm pleased your daughter is getting so much from it Complex.

I do think there is a place for male volunteers and it sounds like you are getting stuck in there! But a place where women run the shop and it isn't unusual, questioned or anything other than normal and expected is a powerful powerful message to send to young impressionable girls.