to think that feminism should have thought about the consequences and set some rules.

[TulisaLover]

I've been chatting with DP this evening and mentioned a post that's been doing the rounds on facebook. It's from a lady sending a message to This Morning about the cost of childcare - on the surface it's a powerful post.

To cut it down:

'I am looking to return to work next year and child care will cost 810 every 4wks - this is more than our mortage!!. The government should help with child care costs.'

DP and I agree with it's sentiment - that child care costs are crippling families, but not necessarily with helping for the costs - he said:

"This is why feminism should have laid down some rules. Both parents earning an income meant banks salivated and started lending for homes based on both. This has forced up prices to cover this as house prices are a function of the amount being lent. Society as a whole loses, bankers win. What should have happened is when you have kids, both parents should be encouraged to work part time so that childcare is shared - or failing that the higher earner whichever gender should have been the one to work. Problems like this wouldn't have happened."

It struck a chord with me - what do you ladies think?

The 'choice' for a mother to work has become a necessity.

I think we can blame capitalism not feminism. You can't say because someone took advantage (capitalism) of a larger income and therefore borrowing that you can blame the people who wanted equality.

And Feminists have had to play the long game, one small step at a time. Would everyone rather that women didn't work?

not true Charlotte,as so many precious moments mamas attest they don't want/need to work
there is no necessity or compulsion to work,can be housewife if so desires
there's no govt squad dragging the housewives out their front rooms to work

What the unions wanted, Posie, was parental rights for both parents and compulsory childcare provision. This would, however, have held back wage increases - or so it could be argued. Much better for the banks to have millions of young couples signing over their futures on the promise of increased returns on property. The fact that most have to live in the property, therefore it's only an asset in terms of continued borrowing capacity, wasn't something they wanted to think about. Good news for banks, though.

Ah I love my precious moments, they are so precious.

But they asked and did not get, right? Should they have settled in hindsight? (genuine not arsy question)

And the fact is that because prices are set at the margin, if just one couple takes up the offer of lending based on two full time incomes, then that sets a new precedent. Thus even those couples who want to share childcare are forced to also pay the new price if they want to get on the mythical 'ladder'. People are very quick to sign up to their own slavery unfortunately.

precious moments mamas attest they don't want/need to work

They have to be attached to the Bank Of Penis, though, generally speaking. If they are in London, they need a rather large account with him.

XH1 and I needed to be in London for our careers. It was not possible to find a place - for rent or mortgage - that was affordable on just one of our salaries. In fact, we squatted for the first six months in hopes of being able to achieve this (we couldn't, so we bought). I know this was a long time ago but am pretty sure it's the same now, or worse.

So what is the answer to people who actually want, and can afford, to spend time with their own children? As I did, the thought of someone else spending the day with my child whilst I worked was something I couldn't imagine. Why is that wrong? Do I get more than one chance to see my child grow? No. And I am not saying if you work you don't see your child, but obviosuly not as much!

Posie - @ precious moments. This was all happening at the same time as Thatcher came into office. We all know how she dealt with the unions, and whether she prioritised banks above people ... ! We didn't even get guaranteed maternity leave until 1994, remember.

YY, Tulisa, re precedent and market developments.

The privilege of choosing exactly what to do for a living is afforded to relatively few. If you "want and can afford" to raise your children personally, that's your choice and your good fortune. I've never been able to afford what I wanted - I may prefer to write novels all day, but that doesn't confer the right to.

What do you mean, "what's the answer" to you?

I think I was responding to your Bank of Penis!!

It's a whole other thread, I guess. But I would love to know, aside from Xenia who was able to have uber uber choices, how does a low paid or even medium paid woman make the necessary financial arrangements to be able to stay at home without then getting trapped as 'wifey' types.

Don't worry it is a whole other thread.

This is the thread that keeps on giving.

"you just have to look at the iPad salivation to see that all the lumpenproletariat want is their Jobsian Kool-Aid." OP - this is such a great line that I think I might steal it and use it as my own. Hope your DP doesn't mind.

He says feel free. I may actually turn my hand to writing at some point, it's the one area which my considerable talents haven't been commercially exploited. If only I could master the use of the apostrophe.

do stop yapping on dp.you're like an earnest school girl
compose posts in 1st person,stop being the gushy girlfriend
you're an accomplished lawyer (soon to be linklater partner),pole dancer,chess master.you dont need to habitually define self by man your boffing

Wow!!!! a soon to be Linklaters Partner really... that's quite scary that someone would post that level of person info now-a-days.

I was unfortunate enough to have a mother who broke the glass ceiling in private investment banking in the 80's. She made a massive mistake in giving out some person info at one point and the fella (a potential client) stalked her from London, to Boston and finally to Geneva when she managed to get the Swiss Cops involved.

Part of my multitasking today has been damage mitigation. I've already made the necessary arrangements regarding the circumstances surrounding my online out-ing, and anything that is said is off recordum.

I have friends who handle my Swiss affairs - I've worked closely with the SNB in the past and it's well understood that it offers a truly safe haven for me if there is any funny business.

"Trust me, he isn't you subordinate. He will lol at that, well smirk.

And it wasn't him perving, trust me."

Pamela, I'm wondering if your DBro's best friend is my DBro...?!

but it is on record and the damage has been done... betcha there's a few Linklaters staff who are MNers plus consider Joe Nutter picks up on this thread and other stuff you've said and follows though with the next female linklaters partner (that's not you) to be appointed - how would you repair that? That's would be an interesting conundrum especially given that this is now in the public domain I'd better set up a hashtag for this when it hits the press.

Only read OP. I think it is a very good point quoted in the OP. Two wages has just increased house prices and the need to both work. I agree that IF both parents do work it should be both part time rather than having to both work full time to pay the basics. What is next, both work 24 hours a day.. I am a SAHM and very happy but have worked in the past. I don't care what extreme feminists think of that because they often don't make sense to me anyway. Playing down the differences and importance of mothers tends to be their game. Yet where are all the female builders/roofers etc if men and women want the same things? If you think about it deep enough it doesn't add up.

in fairness this is so camp and daft it's clearly made up.tulisa a great raconteur
let's face it tulisa hardly besmirching the magic circle or linklater good name
i do believe even solicitors have a funny gland.Susan calman was solicitor

If you are trying to scare me into saying I'm a wind up merchant, then consider yourself victorious! I am a writer who utilises forums to stimulate creativity, and nothing more than that. I apologise for any offence or misdirection. I'm also penniless, hence I spend my evenings scouring the shelves of supermarkets for cheap food. Erm - that's on the record!

Hope you all had fun and once again, apologies for any offence caused.

tulisa you've been a fine sport,and no it was never credible,but was v funny
I think warning you off is bit deluded.no don't see linklaters sending in the heavies
v v funny.of course we all knew was good laugh.I enjoyed your riposte

Oh tulisa hq will have a sense of humour fail and delete now.

You are genius

< you ROF don't you? You must do>