To ask a question about Christmas, and celebrating it....

[mcrvamp]

Right! Over the last couple of months I have read many threads slating Christians and how spreading the word of God and Jesus is wrong, I hate religon..... etc, etc.

So I would like to ask a question to those of you that feel this way.

Why do you celebrate Chritmas, when it is so clearly a religous festival?

Isn't it alla bit hypocritical (sp?)

Christmas would probably have existed even if Paganism didn't, ethelb, although it would have looked very different and almost certainly wouldn't have been in December.

Christian's have had a delightful habit of making it a crime not to believe in & worship their god for many centuries - so yes, Christmas in some form, would still be around in the traditional sense today.

But I bet it would be more of a small, religious service type deal and most of the rest of us wouldn't give a shit about it. The fact that it's almost universally enjoyed by people in this country is because, in reality, it's got feck all to do with Jesus or God - and hasn't had for quite a long time.

We are Christians and don't actually celebrate Christmas in that way.

We give presents and do Christmas dinner and enjoy the time spent with family, but we don't celebrate it as a Christian festival. Nowhere in the Bible are we commanded to commemorate Christ's birth; it's a man-made festival.

I don't want to sound like a killjoy though as I realise that it is important to some many Christians - and I have to admit I do enjoy many of the trappings of Christmas; Christmas Carols, Salvation Army Bands, It's A Wonderful Life etc etc!

This is interesting. I didn't know this (from wiki)
The Mishna and Talmud (Avodah Zara 8a) describe a pagan festival called Saturna which occurs 8 days before the winter solstice. It is followed 8 days after the solstice with a festival called Kalenda. The Talmud ascribes the origins of this festival to Adam, who saw that the days were getting shorter and thought it was punishment for his sin. He was afraid that the world was returning to the chaos and emptiness that existed before creation. He sat and fasted for 8 days. Once he saw that the days were getting longer again he realized that this was the natural cycle of the world, so made 8 days of celebration. The Talmud states that this festival was later turned into a pagan festival.[80][81]

Who cares really?
It's about no work, winding the kids up to a frenzy over Santa, and having Cava for breakfast. Let's be honest.

OP -

If some non-believer you worked with, parent at school etc... pulled their kids out of all school xmas related activities, did not partake in works xmas do, put xmas cards straight into the bin, did not acknowledge the season in any way etc... would you think they were being admirably non-hypocritical or making a point/being a bit miserable?

I am agnostic.

I love Christmas.

I intend to raise my child to understand the Christian meaning of Christmas even if we don't practice the faith. Otherwise it's all just about presents and food. I intend to tell him about the deeper roots of Christianity in other older faiths. And other faiths around the world who celebrate in other ways. And that people have different degrees of faith and some have none at all. Called education, I think.

I don't hate Christians though... I don't think that's the something a lot of people do.

I DO hate people who knock on my door uninvited when I'm busy and try to regale me with stories of their faith (whatever that may be) and try to inflict that faith upon me. I now have a sign on my door saying they are not welcome and none have knocked since it was put up. The easy way, I find, to not hate people :)

Passover is always celebrated in spring - the first day is 15th of Nissan which generally moves around in relation to the solar calendar but is always at March/Aprilish time. The Jewish calendar is lunar, with an extra month added every couple of years (Adar 2) to ensure that the festivals always happen during the right season. So if the last supper was a passover seder, then the crucifiction would have happened in spring time. So, let's say the crucifiction was the day after the first night of Pesach (I'm not sure around time lines) then it would have been on the 5th of March secular/christian calendar.

We celebrate festivus and write happy holidays and season's greetings in our cards - heathens

actually, if it's CE 29 then it would be Friday 5th April (give or take)

That makes more sense

Ah! Festivus - the festival for the rest of us. Do you do the feats of strength and tell your family members all the ways they've disappointed you over the past year?

I guess one persons "spreading the word...." is another's 'preying on the vulnerable'
Disagreeing with the shoeboxes or whatever doesn't mean your hypocritical for having your own Yuletide celebrations.

Having mid-winter without some sort of festival to get people through the cark nights would be dreadfully difficult - look uo how the Puritans faired when they had the bright idea to cancel Christmas.

I live in a big multi-cultural area with work colleagues who celebrate Eid, Divali etc. for a large number of families, their kids also get Christmas presents - double the fun - because it's what the wider society around them is doing. Some people choose not to celebrate it and to only celebrate their own festival of light and treat is as a normal day hence how our McDonalds can get staff to work on Christmas Day

waiting - they do that in Leicester. Diwali lights go up and stay up for Christmas.

ethel - it was the second biggest, though, so still pretty big!

Christmas is religious, and pagan, but also cultural. It's my culture to celebrate Christmas, even if it isn't my religion (non-believer).

Feasting is a very ancient, ingrained human habit which has real cultural and probably also psychological value. I need my midwinter feast. The various old new, religious or secular practices that get attached to it are secondary.

Christmas is really religious in the US but because of separation of church and state people are more careful about assuming someone celebrates Christmas. There is a much larger Jewish population where I'm from, so Hanukkah is a bigger deal. In fact even in parts of the US that aren't Jewish, state schools put on holiday concerts with both secular Christmas and Hanukkah songs.

Since I've been in the UK it seems to me Christmas is both more ubiquitous - in that every school does a Biblical pageant, commercials talk about "Christmas" instead of the holidays, etc. - and just cultural to most people. It all looks shockingly religious to me but I've been told that Christmas is just cultural here, even the religious bits which are everywhere?

An atheist but brought up presbyterian, here. The Christmas story can still move me to tears - because it's about rebirth and hope in the darkness. And a Baaaabbbyyy - a lickle tiny baby! I also think the message about God giving his only son to the world as a gift is great - if you're going to give a present, make it something from the heart.

I think it's a wonderful time of year and a treat to be feasting and spending time with loved ones when the world is dark. Almost immediately after Christmas, the garden starts to perk up and it all feels like it's going to be ok again.

I wish we celebrated the summer solstice with something as joyous, actually. (although of course in Australia/NZ, they do - Christmas!)

Oh, and Hanukkah didn't used to be such a big deal in the Jewish community (DH is jewish) but then the children got cross because their Christian friends got loads of presents. DH alway says his favourite festivals were the one where you sleep outside and the one where you eat sweets.

Syncretism.

It's why lots of gentile kids in the US have a massive party aged 13 - because of Bar Mitzvahs.

OP? where are you?

Pfft, Christmas is so last year. I'm celebrating Yalda this year.

Anyway, you can ask 'Why do you celebrate Christmas, when it is so clearly a religous festival?' but I woul say, 'why are you a Christian when Christianity is so clearly made up of a mish mash of other, earlier religious stories and beliefs (see here - fantastic book, highly recommended)

The festival would exist without Christianity, but it wouldn't be called Christmas, as Christmas is the name given to the festival by the Christian church.

And if people think the mass of Christ is a load of bollocks, that's their right, just as it's my right to believe in it.

Absy - thanks, I thought it was something like that and that september was off-base.

Ethelb, Adam didn't exist! He's part of a creation myth.

Narked really? I hadn't realised. I must be very silly.

Pagan here, we celebrate Yule from the 21st to the 24th then go all traditionally Christmas for the DC's, so the festive season is one long party for days!!
One explanation for Father Christmas is that he is a modernisation of the Green Man, or Lord of the Wildwoods. It depends on where you are really.