to think DS, almost 17, would be better getting a job

[frostythesnowlady]

than going to college.

All his scroaty mates are going to college to do Btechs in this and that.
DS hasn't got a clue what he wants to do and is just following the crowd saying he'll do a sport Btech with every man and his dog but wasn't even interested enough to go to open day at the college he says he's going to

He's a sociable lad and he's into watersports hobbywise, and would like to do something like that as a job, but he's not academic enough to do a degree so I haven't a clue how he'd make a career out of something like that.

AIBU to think college isn't the best option for him?

My DS1 works for Conexions and when we had this debate over DS2 he suggested the Apprenticeship route. DS2 has ended up doing the dreaded BTech, but it might be worth a look at what apprenticeships are available in your area.

He can be a sports instructor surely? When we go on holiday we employ ski instructors/wakeboard instructors/tennis instructors etc and they are all really nice hard-working young men (mostly - only a few girls

My friends daughter works most of the year abroad she works in watersports for a resort loads of opportunities around for them

Whilst an apprenticeship may be a good route, that would also count on him knowing which vocational area he wants to go into. It will also depend on what apprenticeships are available in your area. Gordylovesheep has gave you the link to the national apprenticeship website which would be worth a look to see what is available.

When a young person has no real idea what they want to do, staying in education is the best thing because it is leaving options open. If he leaves to look for work, the pressure of being unemployed may make him start an unsuitable, unfulfilling job that doesn't necessarily offer any long term benefits.

Don't rule out higher education for him on the grounds of not being "academic". You'd be surprised what young people can be capable of if they find the right course that ticks all of their interest boxes.

Does Connexions still exist in your area? If so go and speak to a Careers Adviser. And also, as gordylovesheep also mentioned his college have a statutory duty to provide impartial careers advice and guidance so if that isn't through Connexions, they must have something else in place.

I work for Mcd's and have a Masters degree, don't assume everybody who works for the company is stupid! I worked hard and the only job I got after my Masters was at Mcd's, it is not a bad company to work for plenty of chance for progression. Education certainly is not the only way to develop a career.

Do you think only scoaty people do BTechs then?

Actually it's only Indian people, it's an Indian qualification.

OP I assume you mean BTEC, you can go to uni with a level 3 BTEC.

If you are in the midlands Wolverhampton council are advertising for apprentice swimming instructors.

These days, is a degree really a "passport to a good job", like it was considered to be once before? These days, I'm not convinced that everyone going to university at 18 is necessarily a good thing. Studying to degree level often needs a certain maturity; I'm not certain I had it! With tuition fees, degrees are now so very expensive.

I know someone with a first from Cambridge, someone else just graduated as a vet. Neither can find work.

I think I learned far more about the real world by working in shops, volunteering, temping in offices etc. than I ever did on my degree. My first graduate job was very much in my subject, but I knew nothing about the real world, people, offices etc, and I didn't do very well at it. Had I done the temping and shop work first, I may have done much better.

I think there's a lot to be said for "learning a trade" these days, rather than studying, which can be done later.

Outdoors instructing and watersports instructing. He may be able to get an apprenticeship in outdoor education somewhere. Your local council probably has a few outdoor education centres.

Education is not good for those who don't want to be in it at thee time. I would have between better leaving a levels until I was older. Water two years at college and three months at uni. Now I'm doing what I really want but didn't know what I wanted at the time.

I'm not a massive fan of BTechs or AVCEs etc and the like because I think that a lot of employers just dont get them and would always prefer A levels/ the IB over them.

However, if your DS is particularly good at watersports etc, I would suggest letting him do the BTech, impressing onhim the importance of doing/getting on with/finishing it and then also getting him to do the lifeguard qualification course alongside (it's not very onerous or long, I believe). If he can get his lifeguard's licence, he will be much more employable in that realm of work than with just a BTech.

It sounds like neither of you has any real-world information, which is going to be a problem!

He needs to talk to people in the kind of places he wants to work in (sports shops, leisure centres, water parks etc - sail and surf places if you are near the sea?) He'll be able to find out what kind of jobs appeal (sports instructor? sports/outdoors shop sales advisor? lifeguard?) and what he needs to do to be able to get them. It might be a BTec, it might be just experience on the job - it might be something totally different.

He could ask around and see if any friends of friends can help, but if not I think it's fine to just go in to places, introduce himself and ask if somebody senior would mind giving him 5 mins for a bit of advice. People generally are quite flattered by that if it's done politely - and the worst they can say is no.

I do think it has to be people working in those industries, not careers advisors. They just don't tend to have the specialist knowledge to give detailed advice IME.

Meant to add, I think it's completely pointless making a general judgement about education v. work experience and basing the decision on that. Everyone has an instant opinion about which one is better, but opinions mean absolutely jack squat without knowing the facts of how the sector he's interested in works.

as you have suggested 'every man and his dog' has a sports btec so unfortunately that means he needs one too if that's what he wants to do for a living, plus also experience in coaching and coaching qualifications from his relevant sports authority.

college plus part-time work is the best option i'd say.

oh and glasgow 2014 commonwealth games have just opened pre-registration for volunteers. I would say that any sports student should try to get something like that on their cv.

education doesnt necessarily give you the best options, beyond a point, depending on job you want; regardless of his abilities

i was a diving instructor for example; all that matters is your diving qualifications and dives logged

if he is determined to stay in education;

surfing degree at Plymouth Uni

what water sports is he interested in? do you live near the sea?

this is great fun. Should inspire something in him, if this is really the direction he wants to go

Outdoor Leisure Management Course

and its residential-so he will learn some life skills

Damn it now I want a McDonalds...

water sports instructor uni course

holiday job with these, would give good experience?

www.fitforsport.co.uk/

I think apprenticeships are a good idea. I'm in my second year of employing an apprentice and whilst the money is not good, they do get a qualification and fantastic experience. My first apprentice went straight to a permanent job with the same organisation. I expect the second to do likewise. Without the apprenticeship they simply would not have been able to compete for that kind of job.

The trouble is, the national curriculum has totally messed up education for kids who learn through doing rather than sitting still and listening. Almost everything practical has disappeared: they even write about cooking rather than learning to cook, most of the time!

'Activist learners' are left with very little that suits them, and many come out of school feeling like failures. Bright activist learners fare even worse, since the very few practical bits that are on offer are aimed at young people who are not bright.

Apprenticeships are bringing back a practical option for some young people. This national website lets you search by postcode as well as/instead of by trade: www.apprenticeships.org.uk/ .

Level 3 BTECs are also a good option for activist learners/practical young people who think they might want to go to university. My son has just started one after a year pissing about doing nothing on a course that didn't suit him, and is (happily) re-engaged and motivated him after about 3-4 years of being disengaged and unmotivated. :)

Frankly (and speaking as someone who spent 20 years in education and another 7 teaching in FE and HE!) NO qualifications matter after they have gained you access to the next ones: GCSEs don't matter after you get onto A levels or a BTEC; A levels and BTEC don't matter after you get onto a degree course. And after a few years in work, your degree probably won't matter either.

But 'climbing the educational ladder' does matter, because the higher your personal qualification level, the more you are likely to be paid, and (more importantly IMO) the more choice you'll have about the sort of work you want to do. And choice is a wonderful thing: if you end up doing work you want to do, you'll live a happier, healthier life :)

Personally, I think the important thing is for your DS to find something that engages him. I don't think it matters what that is. It's disengagement and ennui that do terrible things to people's confidence, mental health and employability...

Good advice here.

My son did not want to stay on at school or college after the age of 16 so looked for work. For the first 10 months he only managed to find very short term agency type work. Then for three years he worked in two different fairly dead end jobs with awful shift patterns. Then at 21 he announced he wanted to work 9 to 5 in an office as had enough of shifts. He enrolled at the local college and studied for a BTEC in I.T and got a good job in a bank where he has worked for 18 months.
My husband and I both went to university in our mid 20's after working for a few years.
I think it us quite common to have a lot of mind changing in your teens and early 20's.

Now I have a moment I'll add that going into the outdoor education field he'd be better getting a job to pay for qualifications in watersports (Paddlesports are a good one to go for, lots of outdoor centres want paddlesports), lifeguarding courses can be done easily enough, normally a week long, costs vary though. Archery and fencing are handy qualifications to have too, and easier to get the first levels.
HTH a bit. I was trying to get into Outdoor Ed a while ago and am a paddlesports instructor after kayaking through my teens :)