In thinking the Govt have not thought through the changes to council tax benefit?

[JakeBullet]

As of next April most of the poorest members of society will be asked to make a contribution to their council tax. There are real issues with this as for most families although the amounts will be smallish, perhaps amounting to less than £7 a week it comes at a time when they are already being squeezed financially.

The feeling amongst councils is that many will refuse to pay, especially if it is a stark choice between paying this amount or buying food. As the amounts are so small it will be uneconomic to go down a route of trying to enforce it.

I am a single parent and currently rely on benefits (my son is autistic), however because my family consists of just myself and DS it is likely that a small amount going back towards council tax will not pose a problem. The same might not be true for other families who for whatever reason find themselves on benefits.
I don't think the Govt have thought this one through and in reality what this will mean is that councils which supply vital services will face massive shortfalls.

I don't think the Govt have thought this one through.

The trouble is that it is all taking effect from the same day, so some people are going to be hugely affected and will rapidly get into arrears:
particularly older empty nesters living in social housing who are on JSA or similar - they will lose loads of HB due to under occupancy as well as then receiving a ctax bill expecting them to pay 10% ctax for possibly the first time in a long while.

www.rotherham.gov.uk/info/63/council_tax_benefit-new_claim/2318/council_tax_support_from_1st_april_2013/3

Over 60s are exempt from under occupancy rates...
Families who have a child with a disability where the child has been assessed as needing their own room are not exempt...

I have 3 girls in a 3 bed. Dd1 has her own (small) room and the other 2 share. Although i have not heard that we are going to be affected officially i think we will be. How i'm supposed to fit 3 girls in 1 room i'll never know. (well maybe if they move us to a house with bigger rooms than we have now. You cannot get a double bed in the little ones room (but bigger of the 2 smaller rooms) -ive tried.

It is all very well saying that people need to move, but in practice this is not always possible. If you have two DC of different sexes and the eldest one leaves home, suddenly your benefit drops and you can't pay the rent. So you consider moving but the only alternative housing would mean the young has to change schools in the middle of their GCSEs. And if you are on a very low income the cost if moving (van hire etc) is also a potential barrier.

Then of course you have the problem that the support for housing for under 25s is virtually going so if you have moved and the eldest loses their job, or want to come home after uni, you then have no room to put them in.

Whilst I accept that their is a chronic shortage of social housing, forcing poor families to move constantly is not the answer. Building more homes is.

Zelda, you won't be affected. The rules are 1 bedroom for each adult/couple. 1 bedroom for 2 children of same sex regardless of age. 1 bedroom for remaining child. So you need 3 bedrooms.

yanbu
I was shocked to find out that no allowance is made for a carer.
so if you need a carer 24/7 they can't have a bedroom

"Families who have a child with a disability where the child has been assessed as needing their own room are not exempt... "

JsOtherHalf - that is not true. There is case law which means that if a family can prove that their child needs their own bedroom on disability grounds, then the council can waive the condition.

""9.
Due to a Court of Appeal judgment in the cases of Burnip, Trengove and Gorry those whose children are said to be unable to share a bedroom because of severe disabilities will be able to claim Housing Benefit for an extra room from the date of the judgment, 15 May 2012. However it will remain for local authorities to assess the individual circumstances of the claimant and their family and decide whether their disabilities are genuinely such that it is inappropriate for the children to be expected to share a room. This will involve considering not only the nature and severity of the disability but also the nature and frequency of care required during the night, and the extent and regularity of the disturbance to the sleep of the child who would normally be required to share the bedroom. This will come down to a matter of judgment on the facts." www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/a4-2012.pdf

threesocks.. there is an allowance made for a 24/7 carer:

"7.
There has previously been little restriction on the size of property Housing Benefit will cover in the SRS. This statutory instrument introduces restrictions to the amount of Housing Benefit payable for working age SRS claimants who are under-occupying their properties. Claimants receiving housing benefit for SRS housing will have the amount they can receive restricted based on the number of bedrooms their household requires measured against the same size criteria already used in LHA:
One bedroom for each of the following:

• a couple
• a person who is not a child (aged 16 and over)
• two children of the same sex
• two children who are under 10
• any other child, (other than a foster child or child whose main home is elsewhere).
• a carer (or group of carers) providing overnight care

www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/a4-2012.pdf

Sad thing is that they propsed cuts to the budget before to reduce the deficit and borrowing went up.

So all these people are suffering and facing homelessness and in the end its likely the deficit wont be reduced at all.

When will they see that taking money off people who already cannot survive on what they get isnt the answer? They need to restart the economy instead of damaging it further.

Lougle, thanks for that. I will pass it on to some people who may need to know about it.

it is compleatly incorrect that it will only effect people whose income is solely benefits.

it will increase the ammount payable to any household that currently recives any ctb and the vast majority of those are working households.

loobydoopy wasnt that 999 emergency? anyway that is not a accurate reprasentation of the majority of benefit claiments not even a large amount of them. its a very clever way of getting a image out that people wish you to see in order to get you to pass judgement onto thousands of perfectly respectable decent law abiding none drug taking poor families.

Here we go again with the food vouchers opinion/benefit bashing.

Here...have a . It wasn't paid with a voucher but a coupon did contribute.

lougle

i think you need to walk into a few of the housing benefit offices and ask them.

the 2 groups you state are protected are not they will be effected and are not exempt unless they seek assistance via the discreationary housing fund unfortunatly you have to re apply for that every 3 months and its done on a first come first served basis using very different rules to hb and can target protected benefits even if they are commited by paying for the carer in the first place.

its shite

In my area people on benefits and working low-paid people (many of them lone parents) will have to pay up to £4 a week. The working low-paid will have to pay more than those solely on benefits. I think this will piss them off, although there is an argument for it.

We are being pitted against each other.

my other post is ment to say payable by not payable to.

and line i think your right

Oh i did not know that Lougle. I thought all children of same sex must share a bedroom up to 16 yo. Oh well thats 1 less thing to worry about with all the changes.

I know a lone parent who is desperately trying to downsize to somewhere smaller. He is in a private rent and would love a smaller, affordable flat, preferably social housing.

Can he get one? Can he buggery.

Sockreturningpixie, that document I quoted is a dwp circular to housing departments. It clearly states the criteria, one being that over night carers are entitled to a bedroom.

I think it is fair. We all use council services (at the very minimum have our bins collected) so we should all contribute something, even if it is a small amount. Totally unfair for the already squeezed middle income to have to pay more. We are all "in it together" right?

i know but sadly,housing benefit is neither managed nor paid by dwp and the guides they are working from are not the same.

most la's are accounting for these exemptions (granted most not all) by falling back on the dhf system (with its 18 million pound increased funding) to pick up the ones who should be exempt under the dwp guidelines. its very very wrong but its what they are going to do.

well ophelia it would be fair to say that the very poor are somewhat more in it togather than others

Tbh, I don't think expecting people to pay a small amount of council tax is too much to ask. Councils provide essential services, and they need to find that money somehow.

I think we would all be much better off if there was a higher personal allowance before we had to start paying income tax and then low earners receiving CT benefit would be able to afford it.

outraged, you would say that wouldnt you as you have yet compleatly failed to grasp that if you have a very small amount of money to live on that very small ammount has to cover everything, when legislation comes into play that reduces that amount on one hand and in the other increases what you have to pay out, your fucked.

it really is very basic.