to think that there are people who choose to live a life on benefits?

[autumnlights12]

the recent threads about George Osbourne made me wonder..
A high number of posters say that people don't choose to live like that, they stumble into it, hate it, what a miserable existence it is, nobody would ever choose it etc..
but if you have two or three children through choice, whilst at the same time having no job to provide for them, or if you turn down the job at the local factory (as I know someone who did) because it pays £7.50 an hour and a full time job there doesn't give you the same unemployment rights and benefits, isn't that choosing to live a life on benefits? Or being trapped on benefits? I'm not talking about people who can't work, disabled people, ill people, women dumped by feckless ex and left to fend for herself etc.. of course they should be protected.
I was watching 999 What's Your Emergency and I know that area. And I know people like that exist. And it's often a second, third generation who have never worked a day in their life, even during times when work was freely available. In the town I live, we have numerous Eastern European immigrants who all seem to be working, but mostly in low paid work the locals wont do
What say you?

What usual just said.

The working poor are going to be just as affected as benefit claimants.

The working poor are also not very far from benefits with jobs the way they are. Why would they vote for a party who wants to remove that safety net?

Growlithe, ironically I voted Labour for twenty years when I was "rich" (in relative terms) now I'm not rich and you've probably gathered I'm not Ed's biggest fan!

yes, I think the Labour Party did offer financial bribes to win votes in the 97 election. It worked wonders for them. The spend and borrow mentality and turning a blind eye to the bankers fucked us over afterwards.

I wouldn't call it government by opinion poll

I do. Perhaps it's my marketing background, but I can predict OsCam's soundbite 'policies' from what the Daily Mail and BBC have been saying about public opinion.

Example: Totally pointless new 'law' about being allowed to Defend Your British Home by use of ... er, exactly what the law said before this 'policy'. Cameron simply used the preferred wording of the DM reader in the street.
Etc
etc
etc
ad nauseam.

I don't know wannabe but they do, and more might.

Well that's OK garlic you can go with the ideologues who never listen to a word you say !

Growlithe, ironically I voted Labour for twenty years when I was "rich" (in relative terms) now I'm not rich and you've probably gathered I'm not Ed's biggest fan!

Hah, me too. Only I'd cheerfully drown Ed, Dave & Nick in the same pond.

Might yes.

The more that find themselves unemployed under a government which hasnt put forward any attempts to create jobs, the less you will find voting tory.

garlic

I have to agree with autumn there.

Wannabe: maybe you're right but Labour would be deeply complacent to make that assumption.

And you have to think, which is the biggest group losing their jobs? Public sector workers. Is it an unfair assumption to suggest that loads would have been Labour voters anyway? I don't know, I'm on thin ice, but I reckon that's a safe-ish assumption. So not that much of a loss in voting terms.

That IS a big assumption isn't it. I wonder if there are some statistics somewhere. Perhaps a lurking statistician from Labour HQ can supply. Thanks in advance, if you're out there!

that's OK garlic you can go with the ideologues who never listen

Not my point at all. We hire governments to listen to our concerns and propose expert solutions, not to echo the opinions of the loudest. If the average daily mail reader's solutions were the best possible we wouldn't need a fucking government, we could do it all by phone-in and save a few bob.

Brycie, no problem.

You are probably spot on that I'm likely to be part of a swing vote come the next election.

Well usual I must admit my profound hope is that everyone at Labour HQ agrees with you and believes that 1. no working poor people will ever vote Conservative and 2. nobody hanging on to their jobs will vote Conservative. I doubt they'll be that complacent, unfortunately, but I'll keep my fingers crossing that they think the way you don't and don't bother leafleting!

Hi outraged: thanks. Don't you think this is an interesting conversation?

What is the difference between "listening to our concerns" and "government by opinion poll". Who said anything about "the opinions of the loudest" or the Daily Mail. I think we are agreeing - I think you have invented someone to disagree with because I didn't say those things.

Yes, I do Brycie. I always find it interesting to read views that are so starkly different to me own. And I learn stuff.

my own!

The shops would have gone out of business under labour too usual.

Keep it up Usual. Listen to Usual, Labour HQ. No need to campaign with these groups at all.

Went a bit dick van dyck there outraged! Yes I agree though.

Sorry usual I was making fun of you there, I shouldn't have.