to think this video may show that Esther Rantzen KNEW Jimmy Saville was abusing children...

[spareidentity]

... And to think that if she did, ChildLine need to say publicly how awful that is...

Esther Rantzen was interviewed on Sky a couple of days ago, about the documentary which alleged Saville was a predatory abuser. I've just come across , and I'm really shocked by how she appears to duck the question "When did YOU know?"

It does seem that a lot of people knew about Saville, or had their suspicions, years ago :( But I can't help feeling that Rantzen's role at Childline puts her in an entirely different position to anyone else who may have known... She's a 'champion' for the organisation... But if it transpires that she kept silent about abuse, I think that's really appalling, and ChildLine need to make some kind of statement... Because if even the founder of ChildLine keeps silent about abuse, for any reason at all, then doesn't that give a terrible message to all those children and adults trying to find the courage to speak out about what has happened to them, that everyone is keeping silent, and they are right to feel afraid and alone? :(

I find this very upsetting, and if turns out Rantzen did know, I think that is really shocking and outrageous... But AIBU? Do other people draw different conclusions from the video? And if not, could there be a good reason for her not to speak out?

aqua- I think you're going after the wrong scapegoat here.

Aquashiv - are you so sure YOU would have come forward and kicked up a stink if you had been in ER's position, really?

Yes, instead of going after ER let's go after all those men in high positions who knew the rumours, did nothing to investigate, and happily renewed JS's contracts year after year.

This William De'Ath who did nothing because he was a bit scared of JS - didn't he stop to think that the girl herself might have been scared?

Janet street porter basically said the same thing on Question Time last week - that she knew of the rumours about JS and she knew of other sexual harassment in the industry but said nothing because she was junior and no one would have listened to her. Well she wasn't bloody junior a few years later, was she, she's now very high profile and influential. Like Sandi Toksvig and Liz Kershaw. And they all say they know of sexual harassment or sexual abuse of women, teenagers, children, it doesn't matter. And they are saying NOTHING, naming no names. It's bloody disgraceful.

They might be frightened, from what I have read JS was involved with a Paedophile ring that included very powerful people in the establishment. Investigations have been stopped, people died in mysterious circumstances. Very, very shocking, after reading the stories I wonder what has really happened to a lot of missing children.

WTF?

Seems to me that what is happening here is that various women at the BBC are speaking out now because they can.

Because JS is dead, because stories are coming out, because the sexism that was accepted in the 70s and 80s is a little bit frowned upon now. And yes, perhaps because these women are in more senior positions than they were at the time.

Blaming women such as ER, JSP, Sandi Toksvig and Liz Kershaw is focusing on the wrong target and is misogynistic. These women will presumably have experienced the culture of male entitlement and misogyny at the BBC (or the media in general), throughout their careers. Indeed it is victim blaming to hold them in any way responsible for the actions of their male colleagues and bosses.

I can't believe that people are trying to pin blame on women for men's sexual predation - except I can, it is all part and parcel of the culture that blame victims, protects predators and lets men get away with sexual violence against women and girls.

Maybe what she knew is one of the driving forces behind her setting up Childline, which is an amazing organisaton.

YY Beachcomber

And aquashiv your anger would be better directed at the police officers who dismissed the girl who later committed suicide, and workers at the care homes, hospitals and approved school Savile preyed upon who had an actual duty of care to the children in their charge.

I don't want to bash social workers and the police. It's a very hard job but there is evidence of negligence here and if guilty, people should be made to answer, because this kind of thing is going on right now somewhere else. The only way to stop it is if these bastards know someone in authority is going to take their victims seriously.

Then we can ask questions of the showbiz personalities who may have joined in and at the back of the queue will be the people who knew about it but for whatever reason didn't say.

Beachcomber- what refreshing common sense. Excellent post, exactly what I wanted to say, but better worded.

Thanks cfskate will watch it

Yes but keeping quiet and refusing to name them now is protecting them, brushing it under the carpet just like used to happen and ensuring that IT STILL DOES.

Proposition, but maybe she has named them but to the police and not the media. She can hardly go to the papers with suspicions without getting massively sued.

JSP also said on QT when challenged on this that as 10 yr old child she was molested at the hairdressers when her mum wasn't around. When she told her mother later what had happened her mother hit her. This was the kind of culture many people grew up with. You knew to shut up rather than say anything, make a fuss, cause any trouble or you might be blamed and punished.

This all brings to mind something I saw when at Glastonbury back in 2002 (I think then). There was a HUGE poster / notice board along the railway track with a long, well written story (story is the wrong word) on it about child abuse and how it was rife in The Establishment - judges, police, industry leaders, the masons, etc etc etc - (and cotholic church now we see) it went on and on about how this was all covered up and anyone trying to break up the ring was liable to suffer "consequences" as it was so deeply entrenched in the political and public service. It was deeply disturbing and left me wondering what on earth could be done about it. And (a bit) wondering if it was yet another conspiracy theory rant.
Now it looks like it was very true. Don't know what I could do or anyone could have done. frightening ...

Bonzo, I've seen similar stories on the Internet long before JS died. It's unlikely ER or JSP could have brought them all down on their own! It's time we stopped blaming the women who were probably struggling against discrimination and misogyny themselves at the time. It was the "two sugars please love" culture for women in the 70s.

JSP and other people can't name those they know are guilty. They can tell the police and let them deal with it. For all we know they already have done. If for some weird reason they haven't, the police will soon be knocking on their doors.

If they name people these men will not only sue, they will try their hardest to dodge a trial.

I know that no one here has done it, but can people avoid referring to these people even by initials? And anyone who sees it, would you please report it?

I'm not a bossyboots, honest. It's just these people deserve punishment and I want them to get it.

Well said limited.

given just how powerful these women are in the industry and how they didn't say something indicates to me just how much more powerful the abusers were and may still be given that they and a great deal of others didn't speak out.

additionally given the culture at that time, i think that sadly a great many of us would have done exactly the same.

seems like some on here would like there to be a mass outing of those who are guilty in the most sensational way

we all want those who are still alive to be prosecuted but for it to be done the correct way so a trial can not in any way collapse and for others to be named and questioned if they have actively covered up for JS and others

exactly, ER and JSP can't exactly blurt out names on This Morning or in The Sun can they?

They would a) be sued and/or b) jeopardise a possible future trial.

Youoldslag - I agree - and in case you were directing your second point to me - I'd already been saying ER wasn't to blame for not reporting but the producer bloke who absolutely knew should be rotting in hell for not reporting it.

Bonzo- Agreed.

Oh sorry Bonzo, reading my post back, the second sentence of my earlier post is in fact directed at aqua, not you.

I do agree though that if anyone knew FOR a FACT i.e not rumour and gossip, then they were very wrong not to come forward and protect any future victims by stopping the abuse.

However, some posters on here have been blaming female employees such as ER and JSP when female employees in the 70s and 80s had the smallest voices of all. That, I feel is making scapegoats out of the wrong people.

I watched the video and all she is saying is that she heard a rumour in the office. That's it! She had no evidence. Rumours go around all the time, particularly about famous people, i would imagine that most if not a lot are untrue. People like spreading shit about, you can't call the police every time you hear a bad rumour about someone.

There was a thread the other day where the op said that she had heard that one of the dads in the playground was a convicted child molester, she was absolutely flammed and told to mind her own business. How is that different? According to some of you she should personally investigate him.

I think in this case its a lot of people looking back with the evidence we have now thinking that things in the past should have been done differently based on that, not what we knew then. Some people don't seem to understand that you can't base a decision in the 70s or 80s on info from 2012!

As for all those saying that they knew he was a wrongun because he was creepy, what a load of bollocks!

And look at the number of people now who are saying that the victims are coming forward so that they can get money for telling their stories! Even now, when there is so much evidence coming out.
So I can believe ER and JSP when they said they couldn't do anything at the time.