to leave DP to do CC/CIO withDS

[ZigZagWanderer]

I know this may be bad of me but I'm such a whimp.

Baisically DS is 1 and is breastfed, he feeds to sleep and I co-sleep with him. This was never the way I intended it to be, but it has been the only way to get any sleep and I've grown quite comfortable with it.

His sleep is up and down, he will mostly sleep for 11 hours but on a good night he will wake 3 times. On a bad night (like last night) he will wake up about 12 times.
Last night was different however as all the feeds were long, proper feeds. Usually he just half wakes for a quick suck a few times and rolls back over and will only have a 'proper' feed around 3-4am.
Good nights and bad nights are 50/50.

As you can imagine I have aged 15 years in the in the last 12 months, feel like shit and have a terrible memory.

I have now accepted the only way to really get out of this is to do CC/CIO. I have put it off because I always thought it was cruel, I'm so scared of it.
I will have to move his cot away from from my bed and put the side back on, so if I do it, I have to see it through.

I find it upsetting that I will be depriving him of boobie milk, he is crazy about it. He is also very strong, he can cry forever if he has too, so I'm worried it won't work and I've subjected him to this for nothing.

Am I wrong for suggesting to my DP that I go for a walk whilst he listens to the crying? He is not as much of a whimp as me but also has never been keen on the CC/CIO method.

Please tell me it's ok to go out so I don't have to hear him. Or should I snap out of it and grow a pair?

Whatever you decide to do - please don't feel guilty about it. Everyone's baby and their circumstances are different and you're clearly a very good mum.
So many people are passionate about their own way of doing things with their baby - there's very little in the way of evidence though.
FWIW, MrsTerry's suggestion sounds pretty sensible to me.
Good luck.

Good suggestions!
I read Dr Sears stuff and it made me feel better too.
My family tell me I'm making a rod for my own back, which doesn't help. They all talk about my parenting behind my back. They disapprove of co-sleeping.
I'm not going to change for them but it is pressure for me.
My partner just wants to go along with what I want, like me he's afraid to make a choice incase it's the wrong one.
We don't sleep together anyway, his snoring is ridiculous and I am a light sleeper. He also hits in his sleep so I stay away.

I think Ds must be teething hence the bad night, he just sunk his teeth into my arm and I yelped, I think I scared him

Fingers crossed for a better night, we will be co-sleeping, I can't face CIO.

Thanks all.

Have a look here

The No Cry Sleep Solution was wonderful for us and a gentle way to disengage from night feeds. Ds3 did start to self-wean from then on (at 18 months) and slept really well from then on.

If you've made the commitment to co-sleep CIO and CC are so contrary to everything you've already done. Stick to what you want - it will work out eventually, honest!

This book was brilliant btw.

ZigZag,

I don't think CC or CIO are the only methods you can use to get some sleep at night. I also think they make it very difficult to co-sleep in future as the whole point is leaving the child by themselves to settle eventually.

We were not keen on CIO/CC but at 16 months, DS was breastfeeding 8 times a night and I was working full time. I was ill with exhaustion.

The first thing we did was move him into a bed in his own room and then I lay down with him there and co-slept when necessary. Then we had the best of both worlds - I got some sleep when he was asleep and when he woke up the whole time, I was there with breastfeeding comfort.

Then we moved to stage two. DH went in during the night and I didn't. DS was furious and cried for four hours the first night but was always held and loved by his dad. Night two was three hours, night three 1.5 hours. They watched TV, they read books, they ate biscuits - they did anything together apart from breastfeeding back to sleep.

After a couple of weeks, DS was very comfortable going to sleep with DH rather than breastfeeding. I then dropped the evening feeds and night feeds. DH did pretty much everything at night for the next month or so. (I had amazing, amazing sleep).

Then we started alternating so DS wasn't only used to DH and I did the same things as DH. DS no longer asked for breastfeeding at night. He began sleeping for longer and longer periods and now at 2 years old, makes it through the night from time to time. Amazing.

I'm not saying this is the right route for you. But given that DS screamed for four hours when his dad was right there, a walk may not be enough to stop you getting stressed by CC/CIO. If it's right for you, good luck, but you can always try some less hardcore methods first if it isn't.

I can see why sleeping in his room will contradict that method, I really want to stay with him.
Also DH won't agree to taking over, his evenings are precious to him (yawn) and it's basically down to me to take him to bed, once he's in his jimjams he leaves me to it. At least with CIO he only had to intervene if DS got distressed.

I'm happy to stay as we are for now and try a gentler approach gradually.

I'm relived actually. It was filling me with dread.

Please don't. There are so many other things you can do :(

If it's filling you with dread then you have answered your own question. However, DH won't agree to taking over, his evenings are precious to him. WTAF?

I turned to my gentle form of CC because DD was crying in the night anyway so it seemed that if I could get her to understand that I loved her and would always come back but that I wasn't going to feed her or cuddle her all night, that would be the best solution. And, it was because she sleeps through mostly now. However, you don't have to give up on the co-sleeping entirely even if/when you decide to change things. DD slept with me last night because she was ill and feverish and I wanted to keep an eye on her. I've done it before and she went back into the crib.

Don't make any decisions based on what your family or friends think. I have realised that most have complete amnesia about what their child-rearing was like. Also, though don't get too attached to having to do things one way. I got a little manic and scary about not doing CC and I was ill with sleep deprivation. Much better for DD and I to do a few nights of gentle CC than her living with crazy/scary Mummy.

Glad you've decided to try other things OP - everyone always has bloody opinions about co-sleeping and needing to be firm and do CC etc but actually it should be a last resort and I know that as a PP said some babies really become distressed and vomit which is traumatic for you and them.

When DD went through a separation anxiety phase (which is not the same but the only experience I have of anything similar) she wouldnt settle on her own. I was more cuddly than usual at bedtimes and when she woke, was happy to rock her for a bit, really reassuring but kept putting her back in bed, trying to settle her etc. Then if she cried again I picked her up again. I did this for ages but it reassured her that at a time when she was finding things tough (which your LO may experience if you start night weaning for eg) I wasn't going anywhere etc. I think CC and CIO in a way send out the opposite message to the way that I parent. I think with sleep, because she knows I wont ever leave her to cry she has learnt that its ok to wake up, that Im there if she needs me but now knows she can go back to sleep on her own.

With your LO and moving them to be less attached to you (stopping night feeds, getting them inot their own bed) I think do the opposite of CC/CIO - put the time in reassuring your DC that its ok to be upset by change, thet you aren't going anywhere and in their own time they will realise they dont NEED mummy to soothe them back off. It may be a rough road but surely a better option than leaving a screaming baby? Good luck OP!

'No cry sleep solution' a great book. Methods are slow and gentle,well worth a read. Good luck. Keep cuddling, they grow out if it in the end, then when they are 11 (this will happen before you know it) you will read posts like this and kinda miss those days.

CIO and CC are deeply traumatising for babies (scientific studies show that it irreversibly affects the brain negatively), and as your DS is used to BF on demand and co-sleeping, suddenly doing CIO/CC will be even worse than it would a baby not used to such closeness at night.

It is not a choice between a gentle way or a harsh way. HVs always bloody recommend CIO and or CC. I think it's highly irresponsible, but understand their reasons, even if I disapprove: it's not their child, so it's easy to suggest because they won't be the ones traumatising the person that means most to them in the world and, moreover, they don't have the expertise to deal with the unique characteristics of each child's sleep problems, obviously, so they just suggest a blanket approach.

If he is teething, there's no point doing anything different anyway. You should only try new techniques when there's going to be nothing that can affect the efficacy of said new thing. My Ds has some health problems at the moment and is waking as often as every 30 mins some nights and yes, it is absolute hell. But when your child needs extra love and reassurance in the night, the worst thing you could possibly do is abruptly withdraw it.

People say that CC/CIO work and make their child happier, etc., but what it actually does is teach them that when they need her most, Mummy won't come. They don't feel that love is unconditional and go on best behaviour to try to ensure she won't abandon them again. At night, they don't cry because they feel no-one cares enough to make it all better. Sad but true.

OxfordBags a very emotive and I'm sure heartfelt post. However, you are lumping CC and CIO together, which is misleading and wrong. You are quoting research which is patchy and mixed. And, you are making those of us who made a conscious decision about our families' well-being feel like shitty parents.

Even Leach, who is anti-CIO and talks about brain damage, quotes "prolonged periods" which means CIO not CC and "young babies" which are probably not the 1 yo in the OP.

I'm not saying CC is the way to do it. I think co-sleeping is great if it works for you. So is feeding/cuddling to sleep if it works. If it doesn't work, however, there is room for some of us to CC and do it in a way that we feel is not damaging to our children.

I disagree entirely with OxfordBags post. Babies who have been sleep trained don't not cry in the night because they have learned that Mummy won't come to them (emotive tosh) they don't cry because they are asleep!

How on earth is op supposed to carry on if her ds wakes up 12 times in the night?

I am cross with you, OxfordBags, for posting provocatively and insensitively in order to make the op feel bad. The needs of a child do not always come before the needs of their parents. Most of the time, yes, but not for the 12th time in the night they don't.

I do urge you to read Elizabeth Pantley's book, op, if you haven't done so yet. And I also think you should re-think being in the same room as your ds.

Without outing myself, I have professional expertise in this sort of area, so am not just spouting subjective tosh. I am disabled with a condition worsened by tiredness and my ill Ds has been waking 10 times or more a night for a while, as I mentioned, and I have to carry on. I do know what the OP is going through but I believe it's up to the adult to suck it up, not the baby. IMHO, the emotional needs of a baby do come before the parents. I didn't mean to guilt-trip the OP, that I apologise for if it came across that way.

"this sort of area"?
How will a baby's emotional needs be met if the mum can't function because of exhaustion?
And what about the needs of the baby's siblings?
No baby is capable of thinking, " I've never needed my mum more than now, but she isn't coming...." Surely?

What about the Melbourne longitudinal study, then? Which said that there was no evidence of any damage to children from CC?

I agree that if a child is sick or teething or cold or hungry or a million other things, yes, it is the job of the parent to do what needs to be done. In this case it sounded like a healthy 1 year old who is feeding all night. Now, the OP has clarified and said that a) she thinks it's teething and b) she wants to carry on co-sleeping. In this case, absolutely, CC is not the answer. I believe that I have never heard of a case where CIO is the answer.

In our case very gentle CC was the answer. DD sleeps better. Amazingly, she appears to still believe that I will come when she needs me because when she is sick (night before last) she cries for me and I come. She knows I will come because even doing CC I came every time (in my case I never left her more than 2 minutes). I just put her down, told her it was time for sleep and left again. It worked after a few times and I think three nights. She was very ready for it by the time I did it. Well over a year old and I believed old enough to process it. Horses for courses.

To add my twopence worth..my DD was still in with me at 14 months and I was on my knees with exhaustion. I was back at work and if anything she was feeding more often in the night, not less - I think if she stirred and knew I was there, it was a nice option to get a feed and a snuggle back to sleep. Quite understandable!
But I was really struggling.

We decided to move her into her own room and to night wean at the same time. I wouldn't go in at all, and DP would go in and cuddle and settle her.
By the second night she slept through - she didn't fight it at all. Even the first night, whilst she grumbled, she didn't cry.
From my experience, all I would take from it, is that is really depends on the child. Is your child one to give in easily (like mine) or does he protest more?
I can really sympathise OP, as I was so tired but wanted so much to do what was best for my child.
I wouldn't try and night wean/controlled crying or move him to another room while he is teething though.

OP, I co-sleep with my nearly 6mo and have recently returned to work full time so she is ff through the day. I initiated this a few weeks before my return to work and she has adapted well. I do still breastfeed at her bed-time feed, but once she is well-fed I slightly wake her to put her into her sleepsuit and then just rub her back for a while. When she wakes later, I give her a bottle, which she takes happily and generally sleeps for about 7hrs solid.

This took a few nights to get sorted but has never involved crying (apart from me after a couple of restless nights and having to work the next day!)

Agree with others that controlled crying and crying it out are very different methods, but you may find you don't need to use either. Why not try either a ff or some warm water in a bottle or just a cuddle if your DC wakes?

ANother vote for dr jay gordon night-weaning, worked well for DD2 at similar age, carried on feeding in the day and co-sleeping, but 4/5 nights of hardcore screaming for hours! We did it on holiday (joy) and shared the work.

Agree with mrsterry about your DH. He should be pulling his weight day and night: work is not an excuse to let you do it all (unless he's a brain surgeon or nuclear submarine bomb-button-presser). Does he look as knackered as you?