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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To be pissed off about the seeming totems of being well off

59 replies

QueenofPlaids · 15/09/2012 22:58

Okay, I have been known to peruse the comments section of the Fail on occasion, but I've seen it creeping on here and also in real life, so I ask:

Why, when someone says they can't afford something, almost regardless of whether the something is a basic or a supposed luxury, is it then backed up by the:

"of course we don't have meals out, smoke, drink, have holidays abroad". IME holidays in the UK are no cheaper

Closely followed by:

"have Sky TV, two cars / a fancy car, gym membership & designer clothes"

It pisses me off no end. Now clearly, if you're skint, you're not going to have the above and that's fair enough, but if you"re just having to make choices like most everyone else why are meals out, holidays abroad and drinking seemingly the nadir of profligacy?

Could just be me, but I seem to see this often. (Whist the plural of anecdote is not data, I recently endured a lecture from a friend who is a sole breadwinner (bigger income, smaller mortgage) on why he couldn't possibly take his wife and kid abroad. Great, but he'd just bought 2 grand of Apple computer kit. This is not an isolated incident.)

OP posts:

Original poster

QueenofPlaids · 15/09/2012 23:28

pagwatch I assure your I'm not trying to be chippy, I mostly observe with mild amusement. It doesn't impact my day to day life, though I do occasionally get a bit peeved when someone who is paying for private school, riding lessons etc. speaks to me as though my wine on a Weds or last minute week in Europe is evidence of how lucky I am compared to them (I do okay, I feel that I am lucky in general).

OP posts:

CommunistMoon · 15/09/2012 23:30

YANBU in that everyone has their own definition of luxuries and there's no general consensus about this (nor should there be, of course). YABU to read the comments pages on the Heil website. There is no conceivable definition of living well which includes that.

Pagwatch · 15/09/2012 23:35

Ok but tbh you don't sound amused.
I am not trying to be arsy. I just a) haven't noticed what you are describing nor b) really understand quite what is bothering you.

Original poster

QueenofPlaids · 15/09/2012 23:42

handbagcrab thanks for that link - very interesting article. I was one of those with Parma ham in the fridge at uni, although I was not rich, just took a while to learn how to manage money

pagwatch No worries, didn't think you were being arsey at all, but being a Scot just wanted to make sure y'know, everyone would know when I was being chippy . Okay, too much for QoP...

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Pagwatch · 15/09/2012 23:45

Original poster

QueenofPlaids · 15/09/2012 23:45

communistmoon I suspect from your NN wee may have radically different politics, but on you Mail point I agree. Mea culpa etc.

Does it mitigate at all if I say my work only has IE6 so virtually nothing works? (Mail, Guardian sometimes and the Torygraph). I was a BBC News girl... sigh I now know so much about Chantelle, Amy Childs' boobs.... (read as barf)

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Happybunny12 · 15/09/2012 23:50

Thanks for the link handbag crab, interesting. Goes to show it's all about how well off you perceive yourself to be. One woman said something about having the nicest house on a shit street making you happier than the worst house in a nice (naice?) area. Probably true that- ie being richer than those nearest you. Some of those people though, seriously? Living on another planet!

fairtomiddling · 15/09/2012 23:51

I think I get what you mean - the first thing that pops into my head is the example of one of my flatmates at uni, who had by far the most money out of the six of us, and he was always the one complaining the loudest about being skint at the end of each week. Because of his priorities/how his parents did things, he evidently thought that eating out at restaurants several nights a week was his right, but would then complain about not having enough money to go out drinking. Unlike the rest of us who would live on 10p noodles for the week and spend all our money on vodka

Socknickingpixie · 15/09/2012 23:52

i expect its because the daily fail and some people like to paint poor people as feckless people who waste money on these none essential things kinda like

person 1. "im really skint"
person 2. " you cant be,you have sky tv and last month i saw you eating out in the harvester"

because ofcourse skint people shouldnt do anything like that ever and if they do,we should get to rip apart there shopping habbits judge them badly and it will be there own fault. so a "im skint" if you dont want this needs to be followed with "i dont understand it because i dont use/have/buy xyz,im a very humble poor person just because im poor i am not irresponsable i dont waste money"

obviously i dont belive the sterotype im just using it as a example of why people feel compelled to add that when mentioning skintness.

Original poster

QueenofPlaids · 15/09/2012 23:57

socknickingpixie I think that's fair, it's certain actions that attract the judgy pants and the almost as though some people want to pre-empt that by avoiding any judgement.

I must confess I had my parents up this week and whilst we are by any standard well off, we've had incredibly shit luck with our house. Parents found a receipt for DP buying Oxo clips for £3. Went mental about profligacy. Drank £10 wine with dinner before going...

OP posts:

larks35 · 15/09/2012 23:58

Am not sure what you mean either, but we're pretty skint.

I actually believe that holidays are very important and not luxuries, I think everyone should holiday in some way at least once a year. I had 2 holidays this year. Admittedly they were more like visits to MIL, incorporating visits to my DPs and other family members. But, they were breaks away from our house. I am now saving to ensure that we do actually have a proper holiday next year

WRT wine, well to some it is a luxury, to me an absolute necessity, yes I do know I have an alcohol dependency problem

QueenofPlaids · 16/09/2012 00:04

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster

QueenofPlaids · 16/09/2012 00:06

Damned iPad - about, have and been and also 'being able to step away'

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nokidshere · 16/09/2012 02:02

Well I am most certainly not skint by a lot of peoples standards but I am skint by my own!

But then I am not as skint as I was when the boys were little so maybe I am well off after all. :)

thisisnotrhubarb · 16/09/2012 02:29

let me entertain you. I do not have Sky. or any TV package. i have terrestrial TV c'est ca. no extra channels. we do not have a mobile phone contract. we have no debts, yet we have one holiday each year, usually camping, usually cheap in the autumn half term. we do not complain. but people who judge? i hate the fukers. let them live one day in my shoes

TapirBackRider · 16/09/2012 02:34

Apparently sober here, but being an arsehole elsewhere?

Reported.

Gingerodgers · 16/09/2012 04:35

By the time my husbands massive salary has paid for the renovations on our rental properties, the school fees, the sailing and riding lessons with stabling for the ponies, and of course our wonderful nanny, there is barely enough left to buy anything other than cheap champagne.!

Gingerodgers · 16/09/2012 04:35

I could of course get at job, but I really just can't be arsed!

Alurkatsoftplay · 16/09/2012 07:49

Nicely put gingerodgers!

I too thought of university, fairtomiddling. The posh kids would have spent their money by week two, forcing us rough kids to share our fray bentos with them. Then posh kids would drive off in their alpha Romeos to their uncles chateauxs.
Different meanings of being skint I suppose.

EdMcDunnough · 16/09/2012 07:59

I think some people have a very high income but they tend not to want to spend money even though they have it.

Case in point being my wanting some second hand uniform from school - and being invited to come and choose some from the office.

Well off friend followed me there, and decided that they were going to buy two out of three of the items, while I was left with one.

I have utterly no money. They did suggest giving my child one of their child's items instead, but that never transpired.

they were so bloody pleased with themselves and no concept at all that I might have needed those clothes, while they were just saving themselves from having to spend their money.

So you could say, your child wearing cast off clothes is a marker of poverty but in this instance it isn't - it's a marker of being tight.

ps we don't have Sky, don't smoke/drink, run one car which we don't own, never go on holiday anywhere, no private school, I only usually buy clothes when they are very much reduced, and we sometimes get a takeaway. (is that everything?)

georgie22 · 16/09/2012 08:09

The Guardian article is fascinating - I almost couldn't take some of the comments seriously I.e. once we've paid for the nanny we have no money left despite owning rental properties etc. and the couple struggling on £1m p.a but not having a Bentley! I'm learning to economise on a smaller income working part time but we have no debt other than our mortgage. We're not rich but we don 't struggle on a monthly basis and live within our means. We're fortunate compared to many people.

Pendulum · 16/09/2012 08:25

I think I get your point. They are often the same things that - on certain threads - working mothers are described as spending their money on (foreign holidays, 'designer' clothes - although god knows I have never met a real person who wears Armani, eating out which includes buying groceries from Waitrose, and multiple 'flash' cars.)

These are the things that people are presumed to spend 'excess' disposable income on, and the things that are the first to mind when someone posts a thread asking why they are spending beyond their means. I think the OP is simply inquiring why the Mail etc fixate on those particular things as signs of profligacy.

In my view this trope is related to, but distinct from, the 'sky tv/ fags and booze' class of profligate spending. The first shouts 'brash aspiring middle class', the second 'feckless philistine working class'. Both used v effectively by the Mail and its ilk. Just a few words to summon up a fully formed image of the person involved in a news story. That's why the Mail stories always tell you what cars are in the drive of a bereaved family, and that the asylum seeker's house has a satellite dish on the roof.

redwhiteandblueeyedsusan · 16/09/2012 09:55

"I don't have meals out, drink and take holidays abroad"

meals out and holiday abroarrd, no chance with ds..and I don't like the tast of alcohol.. (weird )

holidays in the uk can be as expensive

I think the area/house you live in has a big impact but some people clainm they are broke whilst living in a good area.. ok so maybe no disposable income but it is opreferable to living in a flat/rented/socialhousing and having no income.
being able to buy a new fridge/cooker/washing machine etc when one is broken without having to save is a luxury many don't have
having disposable income to treat the children now and again to trips out or prersents other than at their birthday
money saved in the bank

VivaLeBeaver · 16/09/2012 10:02

I suppose it's all about priorities.

We have two cars and Sky tv. Can't afford a holiday abroad, we camp every summer. But I've just spent £800 on a cycle. So we could have had a week on the costa del sol or something in a grotty flat for the same money. But I'd rather have the bike, which is something that will last years.

I couldn't afford the bike and the holiday. Well I probably cold, but I'd have to raid the isa. So in my head I can't.

VivaLeBeaver · 16/09/2012 10:03

But I don't moan I can't afford a holiday abroad. I recognise that I'm well off compared to a lot of people.

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