To be angry about school parents panel

[littlesos]

I have just been sent an email asking for parents to join a parents panel at my daughters primary school. The email says that a random 12 parents representing a cross-section of the school will be selected to meet with the head. All fine and good, however the meetings will take place at 2.15pm.
AIBU to be really annoyed about the fact that once again working parents are excluded.
This comes on the back of the fact I can't get to either of my daughters parents evenings as the latest time they do is 5.15 and although I sent back the forms the next day it was already booked up and I had to miss both daughters curriculum/new year group meetings as they were held at 1.00 on Mondays for DD1 and 1.00 on Thursday for DD2.

I also missed the "thank you" afternoon tea for all volunteers (I'm on the PTA) as that was also in school hours, it seems like if you work your contribution is not as valuable.

our parents evening goes on until 7pm at the least but teachers will happily chat away and they are usually running late anyway.

why does your's only run to 5.15pm?

galvanize other working parents to help you get a later time for the panel. As you say it isn't an accurate cross section if it ignores working parents.

To be fair, the Parents Forum at my dc3's school runs at different times, in turn.... 9.30 (after the Parents assembly) once, then 2.30 once (so it runds for 3/4 hour and you are there to collect your child at the end) and 6.30 once. The 6.30 one is the poorest attended.... parents have replied (when asked about it) that it's a terrible time as they are getting tea / putting dcs to bed / don't want to come out again / etc.
It is awkward when you work (and of course, there aren't many jobs that are less flexible for getting time off than teacehers.....) but I agree with others - why not ask if you can have notes from meeting / agenda and if parents who aren't able to attend might be able to contribute by e-mail. This is what they do at the Parents Forum as dc1's school.

I agree with posters who say that parents evenings (clue in name) should be held later. Ours start 3.30 and go on for 3 hours. I think thats fair.

However everything else, really the parent needs to allow for. I leave two or days free of my annual holiday available, so I can take four to six half days off for various events (assemblies/plays/parties/sports days etc) and DH tries to do the same. I'm not allowed to take less than half a day. Now and again I have to have a 'dentist appointment' in order to get to something but I try not to do this as my employers are very good to me.

I do still miss lots of things (cake stalls, decoration day at xmas, harvest festivals etc etc). Its difficult to pre-arrange too far in advance but have just done DS1's first year (Reception) so I understand how many events you have to take into consideration now. It would be more difficult as a lone parent because I couldnt share the events and would have to find babysitters etc.

Its only going to get harder when DS2 starts school as well, but at least I only have two!!

If you're that keen then you can always use your holiday up to attend the meetings. Dh is a governor, and he sometimes uses his holiday time for meetings, or he flexi-times it, which may mean working very late another night.

He finds a meeting in school time easier to arrange than I did when I'd a preschooler at home and a child at another school.

Are you forgetting the other times teachers have to stay late that don't involve parents?

I have to say, I've never come across a school that doesn't do at least one Parent Consultation 'evening'.

I'd ask for them to be reviewed, and copy the CoG into it.

Parent Panels/forums, other events, a bit tricker I think.

I worked in a secondary school. Our parents' evenings went on till 9 p.m. (if rigorously policed by Senior Management to make sure parents didn't overrun). That's an 13 hour day, and, since I taught nearly every year in the school, it wasn't "twice" but 6 times a year, plus 2 Options evenings, school journey meetings, prize giving, school productions etc. AND I was part-time.
Not to mention the staff/section/departmental/moderation meetings after school, at least one a week till 6, till the unions stepped in.

I think an on-line forum is the way to go.

Could you ask to see the minutes and add your comments by email?

Re parents evenings, teachers will arrange a mutually convenient time to see you if you can't make the official parent's evening, if you ask, but I do think as a working parent it's usual to save some of your AL to accommodate these kinds of things.

What does the parent panel do that can't be done by sending out a questionnaire and having an email discussion? Tbh, I am an not really sure of the point of them but then we don't really have one here.

Curriculum/new year group meetings can be covered by a hand out. They aren't usually very long anyway so I wouldn't worry about missing those so long as you get a write up of what they are going to be doing in the year.

I think the only thing I would object to on the list is the lack of later appointments on parent's evenings. I don't really see how you can see 25+ sets of parents over the course of 2 afternoons/evenings if you don't go on until 6.00pm-ish at least one evening. Surely there wouldn't be enough slots? Anyway, parents' evening is the one thing you can't really afford to miss imo. The school should be more accommodating.

Now if you had just a parents' panel you could get them to work on changing that.

Thank you everyone for your comments.
To all those suggesting I save/use annual leave. Please please can you explain how I can stretch my 5 weeks annual leave to cover 13 weeks of school holidays let alone save AL to use for parents evenings/school plays/sports days etc. etc,

My DCs schools alway run late afternoon/evening slots. If I as a SAHM sometimes need to book a babysitter to attend I see no excuse why teachers can't as part of their normal working practise. What if the OP was herself a teacher, say at a senior school? She'd find it virtually impossible to attend parents evenings.

I would probably make an official complaint to the head and copy the chair of governors, especially as the parents panel says they want a "wide cross section" of parents. Also point out that they are discriminating against over 1/2 the parents, almost all fathers and WOHM.

they are teachers, they know when they train and take a job they will have to do parents evenings (twice a year at our school). I am really being unreasonable to expect them to stay late for two nights a year to do something which is part of their job description?

I never cease to be amazed at how much control people assume the individual teachers have in these cases!

I understand that it is a problem for you, OP. The parent panel is one thing, but parents evenings are pretty much statutory. The only way this won't be being addressed is because it was the way it was decided years ago and there hasn't been any need to change it yet.

I would write a letter to the Chair of the Governors. You can write the letter and hand it in to the school reception. They'll have a pigeon hole for the governing body.

As mummytime said, if you word it to explain that (wrt the parent panel) they cannot recruit a wide cross section of the parents if they are excluding every working parent, they will have to address it at the next Governing Body meeting.

Besides it clearly isn't in their current job description to stay late because that's not how the parents evenings are organised.

I'm on a parent's council assume its a similar thing. Our meetings are twice termly immediately after morning drop-off and last an hour. There are many working parents on the council they just go into work a little later that day - I do appreciate they have flexibility to do this though.

I found it hard when I had children non in school though as couldn't take them to meetings so had to arrange childcare.

Its hard for lots of people to make these meetings but then only a very few people volunteer to do this stuff in my experience.

We have this issue at our school and the reasoning behind it is how many parents working until 6pm every day are then going to have time to attend the meetings. This tbh is why I am not on the PTA committee who meet at 5:30pm. I am just walking in the door at 5:30pm. I could not go straight to the meeting from work as I have to do ASC pick up, homework, dinner etc. I don't think it's unfair, I think you would never be able to please everyone.
If the meetings were at 8pm, it would make it impossible for people who work nights, people who have small DCs that have to be put to bed, people wouldn't be happy about it being so late in the evening.

I don't think it's a conspiracy to exclude working parents, it's just logistics. No time will ever suit everyone but late in the evening would be difficult for a lot of people, both SAHM and WOHM, so the school cannot win, whatever they do.

I am also on a parent panel, it starts at 9.30am so I just go in to work late on that date - we get the dates for the panel at the beginning of the year so I can organise my work diary so it doesn't clash,. But if it does, I just send my apologies.

I think times of parent panel and the fact that there are no parent "evenings" is just the sort of thing the parent panel is for - the head discusses issues with us the parents and we all give our views from parents point of view e.g new policies, school meal system, new payment system, school trips, communications with school, new initiatives etc.
We are a real mixture, some working full time, some part time, some with one child in reception, some with a child in each year so we all have different views on all sorts of things.

As a working mum, I would be asking that the school considers at least one parent "evening" for working parents!!
Attend the panel when you can and get that down on the agenda!

We obviously don't always get everything as we want it, (we don't all want the same things anyway!) as parents are just one stakeholder within a school and not the most important one, but at least we get consulted and some things.
We can also suggest agenda items and make points via email on specific items if we can't attend.

I imagine the head does not particularly look forward to our meetings but it does help him consider parents views on things and maybe reduces compliants overall - at least his response to complaining parents can be "well we consulted the parent panel and they thought it was a good idea"!!

I am not sure why you want to be on the panel. If you have any concerns, raise them with the teacher or write a letter to the head. The school are just trying to get stuff done, they aren't trying to exclude working parents. However, you are quite within your rights to ask for a parents evening meeting with the teacher at a time you can make, perhaps on a different day from everyone else. Ditto re missing the curriculum meetings - you are entitled to ask to see the teacher for 10-15 mins at a convenient time so they can impart that info to you.

Our primary always has a school hours Parent's evening, and a 'late' parents evening. You only get an evening appointment (5.30-7.30pm) if you have a reason for needing it, so everyone who needs it can get to it. I figured most schools would do this?!

The school provides a crèche for littler DC's too. You just tick a box on the Parent's evening letter to say that you need a space.

they are teachers, they know when they train and take a job they will have to do parents evenings (twice a year at our school). I am really being unreasonable to expect them to stay late for two nights a year to do something which is part of their job description?

And you're a parent. You knew when you decided to become a parent that school is during the day and you would need to sometimes go to that school. Are you being unreasonable to expect everyone to change to suit you?

Someone is always going to be excluded. What about parents who work evenings, work away, parents who can't get care for younger siblings and aren't allowed bring them, etc etc etc.

Take an afternoon off, or accept that you can't go. Thats the breaks for what you've chosen.

The Parents Panel and the Parents Evenings are 2 sep issues IMO.
The panel is just one of those things you have a good excuse to get out of you unfortunately can't make if you WOTH and it's in a job where you can't be flexible with your hours. Ce la vie really.
There ought to be the opportunity for WOTH parents to meet with the teachers a couple of times a year though.

The parents' panel is supposed to be representative and yet it meets at a time that means only one type of parent can attend, so it's pointless really isn't it.

A proper parents' panel needs to include a variety of ways to engage if it's going to actually represent the variety of parents at the school.

I'm fascinated by this. Parents evenings were always in the evening at my schools (both primary and secondary) because the school recognised that parents have to work in order to be able do those pesky things like feed their own children.

The idea that annual leave should cover everything (including school holidays) is just not going to fly. I get really good holiday entitlement and even I couldn't cover it.

Only one type of parent? What type is that then?
Lots of people have complicated lives, its not a sah, woh type divide just.

I'm surprised that working parents seem to think their annual leave should cover all the holidays and everything else. Of course it isn't, thats what childcare is for. If its important enough for you to be very bothered about it its important to take a halfday for though.