Me or xp?

[Offred]

"I don't suppose you can shed any light as to why our daughter just told me I need to pay 'mummy her money'?"

The text I received last night, as yet not replied to.

The response I would like to send but am probably not going to:

"because the csa have been calling a lot to try and sort this stuff out even while we are on holiday and i've been really stressed out about the whole thing which has been going on weekly since march. You should know by now that I am not a "pretending everything is rosy" parent and I am not going to tell the children lies to cover for you. So no I'm not slagging you off but equally I'm not going to keep it a secret when I'm pissed off with you and you are doing something shit (anymore than I would if it was DH pissing me off). I also think the fact you are actively avoiding contributing anything is something really they should be aware of. I found out today the csa did write to you in 2007 and that last time they asked for a card payment for august you said you'd pay £20 ffs then didn't even pay that, that you have asked to set up the first dd payment for a Saturday so they have to take a card payment for september and that you have moved jobs without telling them meaning you'll have to be reassessed which will place further delays when the arrears are now almost £2000 and you have made zero contribution to them. The children live here and have been asking me why they are calling and who they are and are cross about it as am I. Don't you actually think that really they should be cross about it? It is their money! I have explained to you all along that I didn't like asking because I thought you seeing the kids was more important. You had over a year of giving me excuses before we had to go to the csa which would always have been more stress and money that i was asking privately from you. I've tried so hard to accommodate you at our expense and i feel like you have been feeding me excuse after excuse mixed with lie after lie. I've tried to be considerate until the point where we are getting debt in order to cover our expenses as a family with virtually zero contribution from you for 6 years and you just are completely self concerned sitting about playing bloody video games and drinking in the pub. At least you've managed to keep a job. Shame you haven't actually managed to contribute any real time or money or actual care, fun daddy only has so much mileage and you often can't even manage that. The children need a financial contribution, they need more than an hour a week contact, they need you to step up and put them first in your life not way down below alcohol and a job you don't even give a shit about, most especially you need to stop taking them to the pub for that hour a week you see them."

Don't!!!

But if you must, shorten it: "Because she found some of the many letters from CSA confirming your arrears. What did you tell her about why you haven't been paying?"

HIBU for all the reasons mentioned above. But YABU for bringing the children into your financial quarrels. Sorry.

I know, I know... Have seriously reached the end of my tether with it. Am paying £15 a month overdraft charges, I spoke to csa and said I'd be happy to accept lower arrears payments if he made a card payment to clear some in the meantime because I knew he was trying to pay for a wedding, that is when he offered the £20 and then didn't even pay it.

And to be honest although I feel bad about them knowing, it couldn't really be avoided at this stage when they can read the letters and are answering the phone and seeing me upset.

I think you need to stop telling your dd so much as she will pick up on your mood and it could damage any relationship she has with you or her dad in the future when this gets sorted

Kids shouldn't be saddled with negativity

Well I dont think YABU at all. If he has very little contact with them and pays nothing I dont see why they shouldnt know the truth.

Did you tell your DD to say that or did she take it upon herself?

He is BU (and a twat) not paying

But I think YABU for involving the children, it might not always be easy but you can keep them out of things like this. I had similar problems with my ex and the only times I ever discussed it with my children were when they asked me directly and even then I stuck to facts. There were times when I felt like telling them, but it's not fair to put children under that burden

To be honest kayano I don't think this will ever be sorted. Xp is a mess, has improved in some ways, doesn't really know how to be a parent and doesn't really care about trying, does stupid stuff which harms the dcs whenever given the opportunity and I've pretty much always thought that one of the purposes of them seeing him is to learn that he is never going to be able to be a dad which yes is horrible for them now but better than them growing up idealising him and then getting back in with him as teenagers/adults when they'll be damaged by him.

My DD found about the arrears when the CSA rang, asked to speak to Miss B Xxxx (my name but just my initial), which also happens to be the same as DD's name. (She is also Miss B Xxxx, it's just the initial stands for something different).

Couldn't do much about the fact that they spoke to a 9yo, could I? I put in a complaint, did nothing, and couldn't take away the fact that my DD knew her father owed me £17,000 at that point, in respect of maintenance for her, could it?

After that, I was always honest with her, though without slagging her father off.

And the OP said that this is the reply she would LIKE to send, not that she actually HAS sent!

"I think you need to stop telling your dd so much"

Why? Why should the OP pretend daddy is wonderful when actually hes a good for nothing arse. Her dd is going to find out for herself and will then feel betrayed that she was never warned. Yes kids should be protected. But not lied to. And in the OPs situation she would have to lie to cover the phonecalls and letters.

Good lord I didn't tell her to say it no!

She answered the phone to the csa lady and asked me who they were and why I was upset. I told her it was about trying to sort out money from daddy, she asked why he had to pay money so I explained that he is her dad and we are meant to share caring for them and that things like houses and food and holidays and uniforms etc cost money and ATM DH is paying for all that and the csa are trying to get daddy to help out.

It just happened to be about an hour before he picked them up for his one hour weekly contact. She was cross he wasn't helping with the money, she decided she thought they shouldnt go and see him if he wasn't paying and I had a big talk with them about how money and contact are separate things and why they are but they were both still cross when they went out with him.

This asking him for money has been going on every month for two years and been with the csa since march which is when he started building arrears and they have called or I have called them once a week since then to try and sort it out but he is messing them about. This is the first time the dcs have noticed even though they were calling while we were on holiday.

I think you've been remarkably restrained!

If he really cared about his children, he would make some attempt to support them financially - it's as simple as that.

I don't think you've done anything wrong here, you can't hide everything from kids. Though it depends on their ages a bit too.

But seriously, he spends 1 hour a week with them and takes them to the pub? Good grief.

1. Don't believe everything the CSA say they are liars.
2. Don't involve the children in problems with your ex.

My children once said to me "mummy says you wont buy is any food or pay for clothes", I'd been making payments to the CSA for more than 6months they didn't bother to pass the money on, fuckwits

Sorry offred, from your op it seemed like you'd told your dd to ask for the money

I still think though that dc should be shielded from this as much as possible, not lied to but protected. As I said I've been in this situation, I've never mentioned the letters or the phoncecalls unless theyve asked directly, not least because even though I'm not the one on the wrong-the letters and phoncecalls stress me out and I'm an adult, I don't want that for them. They need to know the truth, but in a way that doesn't put the burden onto them, and I know that's not always easy (or even possible) to do. Sorry your ex is such an arse

Your XP sounds like a complete twonk.

However, you need to shield them from this as much as you can. Not for his sake, who gives a fuck about him. But for their sake they need to not hear anything about this stuff.

It is obviously on her mind and it shouldn't be.

Whowhatwherewhen - I appreciate that the csa are a very blunt instrument, it isn't them this time though. He is not ashamed he hasn't paid anything. He gives excuses about money not going in his account or wedding bills coming out. I suspect he thinks he shouldn't have to pay anything but won't say that. We are in the incredibly frustrating situation of having him on all fronts promising all kinds of things regarding contact that make him look great to girls he wants to shag but that he has no intention of actually carrying out.

I know, I feel unreasonable, hence the trial by fire here but I've been in this pressure cooker, calmly and patiently accommodating everything, trying to support him with his various dramas but it has just all exploded in my brain today.

I agree re. the CSA. I can't see if he is on PAYE why they cannot get a deduction of earnings? and surely they would have. Are you sure he isn't paying?

Yep, sure. The problem was that he was not acknowledging paternity of dd. There were problems assessing it with her on, he avoided speaking to them, didn't tell them things, when they caught up with him he said he would pay, gave excuses about why he couldn't right then and then never did and has now changed jobs just as they set up the first dd. He doesn't tell me he is paying, he tells me the excuses he has given them.

Should mention in his friendship group actively avoiding your children is not frowned upon. He doesn't feel shame, he has several friends who don't have anything to do with their children and run away when they see them in the street he is mega daddy in comparison.

Makes me sick when all his friends and family fawn over him for being a great dad on fb though. Makes me want to kick him in his stupid head.

But yes I feel unreasonable and crap that they always seem to end up embroiled in this stuff of his.

I think I am just going to ignore the text tbh. Was talking it over with DH last night, we decided we thought he was fishing for ways to headfuck me over the whole thing and feed his script of lies that he tells everyone about me.

He'll be telling everyone I told her to say it whether I did or didn't.

Ignoring him sounds like the way forward.

Be as polite as necessary at hand overs but no convos that don't directly involve the children's needs at that time.

No way for him to fuck with you then.

Ignoring him is the right thing to do, as you say he'll twist whatever you say anyway

I do understand how frustrating it is when he's the one causing the problems but it's your responsibility to shield they children and protect them. There have been times when I have wanted to scream about the sheer unfairness of it all, that my ex could ignore them for months at a time but then show the world what a great dad he was by taking them for a day out- and id have to say ' how lovely! Im so pleased you've all had a good time' with a fixed on my face. But it's all worth it in the end. Just smile sweetly and write cunt on the roof of your mouth with your tongue

I am always on the phone to the csa & my dd (8) doesnt get involved. She knows who the csa are & thats all she needs to know. Iv left her to make up her own mind about her dad.

I dont rely on csa money as i know its not regular & guaranteed. To me it sounds like you are relying on his money. If so maybe you should look at your finances & work out a budget. If you do get money from him that will be a bonus & with it u could treat ur dd.