To understand why dd1 is often invited for weekends away and dd2 is not?

[D0oinMeCleanin]

DH thinks it is favouritism.

Dd1 is almost 9. Dd2 has only just turned 5. Dd1 is fairly well behaved and mature for her age. She sleeps, she listens, she understands no, she might sulk for a while but she is past throwing full on strops.

Dd2 does not sleep. Ever. Midnight is her typical bedtime. She'll still still be up and raring to go at 7am. On bad nights you can expect to be awake until 3am or beyond with her. She has no fear of anything and thinks nothing of running off somewhere and not telling anyone. She doesn't listen to anyone. If she is made to listen (one example would my mum telling her to move away from the edge of a cliff only to be told NO by dd2 and then physically attacked by her when she had to drag her away) Any attempt of discipline is met with violence or a tantrum lasting hours.

So AIBU to think that until she is older and calmer and has some regard for her own safety, then expecting relatives to care for her for a weekend is unreasonable?

No I think you're right. If grand parent has offered to take it on that's different but if they haven't I wouldn't insist for the reasons you describe.

Agree Altinkum she is still young and very hard wr, when she is older and Mabey more settled than they might offer to take her

She sounds similar but a bit more extreme to my dd1 who is currently undergoing assessment for ASD.

Yanbu to understand why.

Yep, sadly she is hard work which is why no one would want her to sleep over........once she is older and calmer I am sure it will all change.

My Dsis's kids are a bit like this...hence I NEVER invite them to sleep/come over.

We do discipline her e.g take away toys, stop her playing out with friends/inviting friends over, no screen time, star charts for good behaviour and staying in bed once she's been told it's bedtime.

She is seeing the school nurse about sleeping and is being watched for possible SNs.

I agree she is hard work. I don't understand why DH thinks people must cope with her to be able to give dd1 a treat.

My mum will take her away, so she does get holidays with the grandparents but her great gran feels she is too much to deal with at her age and I don't blame her, frankly. My Aunt (who dd1 is visiting this time) is inexperienced with children and admits she wouldn't have the first clue on how to deal with dd2 if she kicked off or ran away.

She's harder work and yep it's fair enough that people will take the older one and not her.

But, if she does have an SN there's a very real possibility that being older may not make her calmer or give her regard for her own safety, if the required level of behaviour is never achievable, does that mean that DD1 is always going to be treated differently?

YANBU
As much as I couldn't handle the kicking off it would be the no fear thing that would stop me from looking after her. Imagine if a family member or friend had to call and let you know there had been a serious accident. Doesn't bare thinking about.

My ds2 is only 2 1/2 but he is a runner and I have to make sure anyone who takes him MUST have his reigns on him (obviously have tight hold of them too). He has been to my brother's house and I have to remind him to close the gate so ds2 can't open it and put the chain on the door, as their dd is 4 nearly 5 and is past the stage of thinking its great to be able to open doors and running out.

I'm a bag of nerves where ds2 is concerned, my other 2 weren't so bad.

I don't know whether she will always be treat differently if her behaviour doesn't improve. I've never thought that far ahead. She does seem to be improving, slowly, for example bedtime was regularly 3am, we've managed to get that down to midnightish with the star chart and a regular routine of returning her to bed without much interaction.

I try to make the weekends she is left alone fun for her. We do movie nights, baking, swimming, long walks and other treats so she doesn't feel she is missing out too much.

Depends if there is SN, if so what and its severity. DD1 has got better with age, she still doesn't settle till midnight (despite sleeping 7-7 until around four) but she goes to bed and stays on bed.

The thing you have to watch for is how dd2 starts reacting to dd1 going away. She may feel resentful and jealous as she grows older. My DD1 is jealous of DD2 (NT) and actually struggles to understand why she isn't the same in capabilities. Her self esteem is fairly low despite many reassurances that she is just as wonderful as DD2. She is smart and doesn't understand her own behaviour compared to what she sees around her from her siblings and friends her own age.

Of course just because your dd sounds similar to my dd doesn't mean as may have SN but I think it's good she is being watched for it.

My Grandparents took me on holiday when I was 8, but not my just turned 6 younger sister.

They took me and my sister when we were 9 and 7.

I used to do brownies, it was amazing how much more grown up the girls got between 7 and 8. Think infants/juniors at school.

At 6 DSIS didn't want to go away without Mum, at 7 she'd go with me, at 8 I'd go on my own.

I don't think either DD went on sleep overs till 8 or 9 and the youngest we've had here was 7 and we are almost family.

My mother had her granddaughters for seaside holidays,not the boys,as she honestly felt she couldnt keep the boys safe....no hard feelings from anyone.Girls did 1920,s style beach teas with parasols,learned to knit,bake and embroider and listened.Boys wanted to cliff dive and be wild,so the cousins all went to a farm,with military type great uncles.This was before equality...lol.

If your DH insists on both girls being treated exactly the same, all that will happen is that neither gets invited to stay over.
As a family you might prefer this option.
However, it might also be worthwhile talking and planning with extended family, how you can help them to give DD2 treats of her own. This may or may not include staying over. Perhaps she gets to spend the day and do some sort of special activity, but come home before the bedtime stuff becomes an issue.
I'm sure there are ways of making both of them feel special without them having to do exactly the same activities.

Oh it was a rhetorical question more than anything - I don't think there's any issue with treating an older child differently, but equally, than a younger one, but if it leads to an unfair situation as the younger child gets older, then it could have the potential to cause problems.

tabulahrasa raises a very very valid point. Its is NOT behavoural, it could land like she is being punished. However I am sure you will manage/handle this

good luck OP

So will DH make DD1 wait until DD2 is 17 before either to them learn to drive?

Ok, inexact example, but readiness for sleepovers - whether with family, friends, Scouts or residential courses - is to a large extent age dependent. It is unfair to hold back an elder because there are younger sibling who are not yet as mature. So I think your DH is BU. It all evens out as, although not 9 years old at the same time, they will both be 9 during their childhood and do 9yr old things then

And OP, I hope you get a breakthrough with DD2 soon - it sounds exhausting.

That's exactly my point Moistoncemore. Dd1 would be prevented from going if we insisted dd2 was also invited.

He is upset by it because this is the third time over the summer holidays that dd1 has been invited to stay with relatives.

The first time was with my mum. All her grandchildren went, including dd2. My mum reported back that when they stayed on site (they were camping) dd2 was fine. The site was secure, open with no open water near it so they just let her run wild. When she went on walks or trips off site with them she made their life hell by running off, skipping along the edge of steep cliffs, insisting she needed the toilet the second her meal was served every single meal out and kicking off if no-one took her. On a night time she deliberately told ghost stories (re-hashes of Scooby Doo episodes) knowing it would make the younger ones cry.

The second time dd1 and my niece went to stay with my sister for a week. Dd2 went camping with my other sister and all of her brood for that week, so that would have been fine, except dd1 stayed on at my sisters and didn't come home until 10 days after she should have. The reason she kept dd1 is that she has been suffering from depression and loneliness and we as a family thought that dd1 staying with her would give her reason to get up and out of the house. Dd1 is old enough to phone for someone to come and collect her if my sister got worse, dd2 is not. Plus she is not really relaxing company as lovely as she is and she is lovely.

This time it's my niece who has been invited to my Aunt's house (their great aunt) to celebrate her engagement, but she asked for dd1 to come with her because she gets scared sleeping in strange places alone, so wanted to dd1 to share a bed with her. Dd2 telling her tales of red eyed monsters and zombies who live under the bed would not help matters.

Well op has not said her dd2,has sn, or is undergoing assessment so will assume she has not. She sounds quite hard work so no I don't blame them not taking her if they ar not all that confdent

piglet, the SEN person at their school is keeping a close eye on dd2 atm and has been for the last year. She does not think she needs referring just yet, but does have concerns and will be referring her soon if she does not start catching up to her peers socially and academically.

yanbu

i would just say to dd2 that her sister goes because she is 9, nd that when she is 9 maybe she can go too.

I think your DH needs to recognise that treating children fairly does not mean treating them identically.
if your parents/grandparents can't cope with DD2 then that's just the way it is, and she can do other different thinngs that are more appropriate.

Only thing I can add to what yo've said is that I would get some reins or a wrist strap to use while you are out with DD2 to ensure she doesn't run off. My youngest 2 have both gone through phases of running off and so i got some wrist straps and keep them in my bag always and they know if they run off then they get put on the strap and it's helped a lot!

YANBU

My youngest is 7 and does have some special needs. She's dyspraxia and is very set in her routine. Doesn't like being away from home, is unsettled if she's not with certain people, etc, as a result she doesn't have sleepovers or days out that are not on her 'list'

It wouldn't be fair on DD1 to stop her doing those things when DD2 doesn't/can't just so we treat them the same.

DD2 gets treats in other ways (we take her friends out with us/have sleepovers here, etc)

Oh ok doing. So That may be a possibility, my dd 5 has ASD btw so quite used to it all

No, YANBU, you're right

Even though my dd is ard work so would not expect people to look after her other than ourselves, or respite if she goes there in the future

I'm clueless Piglet, so just have to trust in what the school tell me. I had thought a year would be long enough to decide whether she needs referring or not, but it seems not.

The SEN person at their school tells me that she isn't quite at the point where she looks like she might need extra help but that she is behind her peers but hopefully is just slower at developing and will catch up.

My ex neighbour whose son has ADS and ADHD tells me dd2 is exactly the way he was when he was the same age and I should be pushing for more help and a diagnosis because once we have that things will be much easier for both us and her.