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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think pet dogs don't belong in cages?

90 replies

mrmump · 08/08/2012 22:43

Yet another friend has got herself a puppy, I met her today, a dear little thing, in a cage in the hall (the puppy, not the friend). Since when did the family dog become a caged animal? I even see "cage trained" on adverts for puppies now. I'm sorry, but a dog does not belong behind bars and it really upsets me to see it becoming the norm.

OP posts:
adeucalione · 09/08/2012 08:54

'It's not natural for them to be shut away'

What a daft statement - loads of natural doggy behaviours that we curb to make them more socially acceptable to us.

midori1999 · 09/08/2012 09:13

I also don't expect them to perform silly tricks

What, you mean like train them? Hmm There is an awful lot of evidence that tells us that 'teaching dogs tricks' is actually very beneficial to them.

As for not being natural to shut dogs away, well if you're going to go down that route, it's not natual for them to be on a lead, groomed or go to the vet, live in our houses, is it?!

LurkingAndLearningLovesCats · 09/08/2012 09:18

I swore black and blue when I got my Chihuahua I wouldn't be the Paris hilton type.

Now t's winter, she has to wear a jumper everyday due to the cold, and pyjamas at night. Blush If she doesn't wear them she sobs from the cold.

melliebobs · 09/08/2012 09:18

Oh for god sake. Dogs were wild animals that lived in dens. When u have a puppy a house is a big open space that is overwhelming. Creating there own den to give them a place of their own that they can retreat to I don't see the problem. We've got a 3 yr old dog who we crate/cage trained. When we first got him we had him in the kitchen and he just got so stressed out n wound up. Poor thing. Got a cage, lined with rags n covered with a blanket n he was so much happier. We don't use it n more but he still has his own lil corner that's just his.

theodorakis · 09/08/2012 09:23

What constitutes silly tricks? My latest foster has a thirst for training and learning, it is obvious from his body language. Having taught him the basics, we are now teaching what you may call silly tricks, like "give a paw" but as we need to check feet for ticks daily here, not so stupid. Ditto roll over etc. I defy anyone to say that the shaking nervous unsocialised baby who was thrown out of a moving car 3 months ago is not blissfully happy. The hardest training we had was when he grew out of his crate, he tried to squeeze in no matter he was twice it's size.

I think teaching a dog tricks with reward and encouragement is never a stupid idea, all it does is strengthen the bond between owner and dog and could actually save the dog's life.

seeker · 09/08/2012 09:24

Ah- I read "silly tricks" not as training them properly but as dressing them up and pushing them round in dolls prams sort of thing....

I hate the walking on the hind legs tricks too.

wordfactory · 09/08/2012 09:26

Dogs like safe spaces.
A crate/cage/kennel is just that. They don't look upon it in the way humans do. It doesn't have the same connotation at all.

GingerWrath · 09/08/2012 09:27

I had to pack my 8 month old puppy's crate down to travel yesterday, when I started to do it, he got in and laid down and refused to move as if to say, 'what you doing to my bed Mum?'

theodorakis · 09/08/2012 09:28

Why can't people just look after their own bloody dogs and chill out about the way other people look after theirs. Unless you actually see a dog being abused or neglected, who the hell cares how your in laws or friends choose to train their dogs. Happy dogs should = no opinion needed in my opinion. Apart from Midori who should be in charge of all dog owners.

Kladdkaka · 09/08/2012 09:42

I hate the walking on the hind legs tricks too.

Better not get a Westie then. The walking on hind legs (known as the Westie dance) is as natural an instinct as herding is to sheep dogs. Mine has never been trained to do it, but he does it all the time.

LurkingAndLearningLovesCats · 09/08/2012 09:43

Mum and always joke we wish our dog could be like Pudsey from 'Ashley and Pudsey' on Youtube. She's quite smart but she can stand on her back legs for all of half a second before adorably tumbling down. Grin

Totally agree theo...As long as a dog is loved, fed, kept warm and I'll say it again - LOVED I don't think it matters whether you crate train or do agility or whatever.

I spend half my life in shelters (mainly cat shelter, sometimes dogs and cat shelter)

I'd rather a loved pet at home than an abused/neglected/dumped for new puppy at the shelter. :(

midori1999 · 09/08/2012 09:47

I hate the walking on the hind legs tricks too#

Why?

Puppypanic · 09/08/2012 10:09

OP, I really do think you are getting upset over the wrong thing here. I have a 3.5 month old pup and he voluntarily gets into his cage/crate/bed call it what you will, at 11.30pm and when I come down at 8am to make a cup of tea, he yawns, stretches and wanders out to the garden to do a wee. When he comes back in he ambles back into his cage/crate/bed and curls up on his vet bed gold for another half hour or so for a further snooze. The door is open, it is his choice as to whether he goes back in there or not - how in anyone's book is that cruel?

I put him in there in the evening whilst I'm cooking the evening meal but that is probably only for 30 mins tops and he gets a kong with treats in or a nylabone to chew so hardly a great hardship.

If I go out during the day and cannot take him with me then he gets the same as above but I make sure he has had a good play, walk and/or training session beforehand so that he is worn out and just goes to sleep.

I hate people claiming things are cruel when they really have no understanding of them.

Dogsmom · 09/08/2012 13:33

By 'silly tricks' of course I don't mean basic training, all of mine are taught to come when called,not to approach other dogs and to walk sensibly on a lead, they aren't expected to shake a paw, roll over, twirl around, dance on their legs etc just to get a biscuit or to entertain me. They get their stimulation in a way much more geared to a dogs instincts by being taken on two long off lead walks a day, they're dogs, they love being dog sand I love them being dogs.

Separation, exclusion and being denied freedom is punishment and that's what cages do, if I were to shut one of mine in a cage they'd wonder what the hell they'd done wrong!

All dogs need are boundaries and yes it may take a bit more effort to do it without locking them in a cage but in my opinion they are worth the effort.

If, for example, your dog goes mental and jumps up visitors you aren't teaching them the correct way to behave by shutting them away, if anything you are exascerbating the problem and will either wind them up even more or teach them that visitors are a bad thing and to them means being excluded for doing nothing wrong. They are pack animals and if you want a pet that is happy to spend a lot of time on it's own then get a cat.

For anyone interested in learning how the dogs mind works I thoroughly recommend the courses run by Shaun Ellis at the Wolf Centre in Coombe Martin, they'll help you understand dogs a million times better than any pet training course.

LurkingAndLearningLovesCats · 09/08/2012 13:37

Our dog trainer said crates are never, EVER supposed to be used as punishment.

Putting a dog in the crate because they're misbehaving is cruel IMO. :( My pup only goes in there to sleep and hide stuff

Kladdkaka · 09/08/2012 13:47

My dog goes in his so he can savage anyone trying to remove him so bath gets put off till another day. :o

LurkingAndLearningLovesCats · 09/08/2012 13:49

Ooh you've peaked my interest Kladd, what sort of dog do you have?

I SWEAR if you say one of my dream high maintenance grooming breeds...

Kladdkaka · 09/08/2012 13:51

He's a very naughty Westie.

And I luvs him.

Signet2012 · 09/08/2012 13:54

I never had one with my dog simply because I bought him from a pet shop (long story - yes I know alllll about puppy farming now but at the time I didn't and I felt bad for him)

He once saw a crate at a friends house and she opened the door for him to go in it and he peed and shook with fright. I had been considering getting one so he had a safe place until that point.

I know of people from both sides of the camp: people who are sensible dog owners and use crates in the correct way, and those who just think you are putting a hamster back when you are bored with it.

I personally think there is nothing wrong with a crate, provided it is used correctly and the dog is ok with it.

LurkingAndLearningLovesCats · 09/08/2012 13:59

Westies! [love emoticon]

One of my mates has an adopted three legged Westie, she's always hopping on her back two feet to shake paws. I don't think I've ever seena cuter dog. Covers my doggie's ears

allthatglittersisnotgold · 09/08/2012 13:59

Our dog was a rescue and as she was a bit older, we were really struggling with her toilet training, as she'd just never been house trained from a puppy. We were initially anit-caging, but it worked a dream. She was in it over night from when we went to bed till the morning, to teach her to hold it (they won't soil their space).

She is house trained now so we don't use it and she has free reign (more or less). We bring it out at other people's houses, so she remembers that she has to "go" outside and that the house is not her space. She is in it for 20 minutes when we get somewhere to be calm and take in new surroundings.

We would never leave her in it all day and now not even overnight. It is not cruel it is extremeley helpful, if used kindly and properly.

Kladdkaka · 09/08/2012 14:02

I've just put a couple of pics up. The first is him in his wedding outfit and the second is him in yet another self-made den.

midori1999 · 09/08/2012 14:07

DogsMum, all you have done is show how little you know about dogs and crates. Anyone who shuts a dog in a crate because it is jumping up at visitors is not using it correctly.

As for dogs/wolves. Well, dogs aren't wolves. They have been domesticated for thousands of years and they don't behave like wolves. Not captive wolves, not wild wolves. That old theory was disproven ages ago. Of course, some people like to hang onto the idea, cos, well, it's all romantic, isn't it, thinking there's a close relative of the wolf living in your home and you can 'tame' a wolf. Hmm

Kladdkaka · 09/08/2012 14:12

Midori, my dog begs to differ. He says he's 100% wolf apart from when he wants a tummy tickle :o

mrdarceych · 09/08/2012 14:13

Hear hear midori!