Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

WIBU to get my hopes up, or selfish? Grasping? False sense of entitlement?

23 replies

Arana · 24/07/2012 03:46

My grandmother died some time ago, and straight after the funeral my Dad took me and my brother aside to say that the will hadn?t been finalised yet, but that there would be something of monetary value coming to each of us. My Dad mentioned at the time that there may be an opportunity to do something like re-finance the house so that he paid off the mortgage, then we paid him what we would have paid in mortgage payments to repay the loan interest free. Cue much grateful thanks.

There was then no further mention of my grandmother?s will. Six months later, we were talking about my upbringing, and my Dad was finally made aware that I didn?t get a grant to go to University, that my Mum didn?t give me the money to go, that I had a part time job at Uni, and came out with a HUGE student loan. He said he felt bad as he?d paid my brother?s tuition fees, and so he?d like to give me the same amount as a gift from him, as long as we used it to pay the mortgage. Cue much grateful thanks and 12k mortgage repayment.

Another six months down the line, we get an amazing, once in a lifetime opportunity, but one that?s only possible if we have no mortgage on the house. At this point, I call my Dad, and explain the situation and remind him of his offer to refinance the house after my grandmother died. After a bit of talk of amounts, and how much of the money is available in cash or still in bonds, he agrees to it. I?ll admit at this point there may have been some pressure on him to go through with the refinancing option. I was very excited about the opportunity, and although he was less keen, he agreed it was a good idea. Cue much grateful thanks and acceptance of once in a lifetime offer. Two weeks later I call him to talk about finances and update him on the offer, and rescinds the offer. He says it?s too much (although he can afford it comfortably), however by this point we have already accepted the offer, and can?t go back without great difficulty. After much grumbling and uncomfortable silences, he very grudgingly agrees to go ahead with it, but makes a very big point about how he?s already helped us out with the 12k and we're being overly demanding. He also demanded a full breakdown of our finances of the previous three years to make sure that we hadn?t wasted any money or been too frivolous. He had a massive go at me for ?wasting? 15k, until I quietly pointed out that that?s how much we?d had to pay in mortgage interest payments in the last two years.

Our relationship hasn?t been the same since ? although it hasn?t been mentioned, I feel like this is hanging over our heads.

Was I being ungrateful or selfish? I wouldn?t have asked if he hadn?t suggested it in the first place. I don?t know if I?m being unreasonable, or he is.

OP posts:
MrsBranestawm · 24/07/2012 04:13

I found that a bit confusing.

Did your grandmother actually leave anything specifically to you and your brother? You'd have heard via the solicitor surely, if so?

If it was actually your father's inheritance (not yours and your brother's) then he can do what he likes with it, and any gifts to you are just that - gifts. I'm not surprised if he grilled you about what you needed it for. What does surprise me is that he made woolly promises about giving you money at the start - that seems unreasonable if he didn't really plan to follow through with it. Maybe though, the amount was nowhere near as much as he had first thought.

Jacksmania · 24/07/2012 04:17

Just curious, are your parents divorced? Did you grow up apart from him? Or how is it that your dad did not know that you were left with a lot of debt after uni?

LadyMamaLard · 24/07/2012 04:30

I think you've been very unreasonable and entitled. You knew when you asked him for the money that he wasn't keen to give it to you, but you persisted anyway and have now forced him into a situation he doesn't want to be in.

How do you know "he can afford it comfortably"? Perhaps he has other plans for how he would like to spend HIS money?

Arana · 24/07/2012 04:50

My grandmother didn't leave anything to me and my brother - we knew that, but my Dad specifically said that he would apportion some of the money he got to us. (Freely offered, not asked for.)

Yes my parents divorced when I was 5 - I grew up with him until I was 17, then my stepmum threw me out and wouldn't let my Dad have anything to do with me until they separated when I was 19.

He didn't at all seem not keen to give us the money for the opportunity at first - he seemed really enthused and excited, as indeed I was. I didn't ask persistently for the money, but I did talk excitedly about how amazing an opportunity this was for us. That's all the pressure there was - just me being excited.

He had said previously that he could afford it comfortably, and had actually said that it would be a good way of him getting below the inheritance tax threshold.

OP posts:
Arana · 24/07/2012 04:52

I guess I just find it emotionally unsettling to have life-changing sums of money freely offered, then the offer withdrawn for no apparent reason.

OP posts:
savoycabbage · 24/07/2012 04:53

So, it is he rather than you who has inherited the money is it?

It looks like he has looked at this opportunity you have been offered and has decided that it's not what he wants the money to go on.

kalidasa · 24/07/2012 04:54

Could you arrange to repay him a certain proportion of what he has extended to you over the next few years, now that you're mortgage free? Especially if it turns out that what he has put up is actually more than your share of the inheritance, or more than the share he had intended to pass on. (It's not clear to me whether the inheritance has not yet been sorted out, but will come direct to you (in which case you should definitely pass it on to him of course) or whether what he meant was that he would be getting/has already received a big lump sum and he planned to split a certain amount of that between you and your brother.)

Perhaps best to let things settle down for a while and then try to have an honest chat where you are prepared to admit that you put pressure on him and that you're sorry about that and are keen to make up for it.

I suppose the thing is that inheritances are often worth less than people hope in the end, once all the tax and so on has been paid. So he may have made the initial suggestion when he expected to be receiving a larger sum than in fact he did.

kalidasa · 24/07/2012 04:56

Just seen your more recent post which clarifies how the inheritance works.

I agree it is unsettling when people make offers on which they then renege, especially when the offer represents a big opportunity for you or makes a big difference.

Arana · 24/07/2012 05:00

And we are repaying him directly with the rent we receive from the house - we haven't profited monetarily from the re-financing at all, except that if gave us the opportunity to emigrate, which we couldn't have done if we'd still had a mortgage.

OP posts:
Jacksmania · 24/07/2012 05:34

It sounds like he had a generous impulse and then changed his mind. :(
I'm sorry for you, that is a tough situation.

OhNoMyFanjo · 24/07/2012 05:44

Could it be that he doesn't want you to go?

MrsTerryPratchett · 24/07/2012 05:47

People shouldn't offer money unless they have the cheque in their hand. The problem is exactly this. They get the warm feeling having offered, the thanks, all the kudos. Then they actually have to come up with the money.

BTW I emigrated with a mortgage. What was the issue with this for you?

avivabeaver · 24/07/2012 05:48

so, put simply- he lent you the money to pay off your mortgage and you are repaying him, interest free?

maybe he does regret "losing" such a large amount of capital and the freedom that goes with it. However, your only options now would seem to be to re-mortgage to a BTL lender or sell the house to pay back the capital. Or put up with the fact that you accepted something that you knew wasnt being freely given and then emigrated- that would put a strain on any family relationship.

if it is important to you, is there any way you can discuss the options with him?

tethersend · 24/07/2012 05:54

Him stumping up a(nother) huge sum of money so that you can disappear to another country must rankle.

It's his money; he is allowed to change his mind.

SoSoMamanBebe · 24/07/2012 06:02
  1. Just to clarify, your dad never paid off your mortgage post your grandmother's funeral despite promising to do so?

  2. did you only pay off 12k as a one off vis your dad giving you backdated uni money

  3. Why can't you emigrate without your mortgage paid off. You could rent out your house and rent where you move too. (I've moved around the world a lot and have never sold up to move, just rented out the home).

  4. How can your dad have said you wasted 15k and you said it was interest on the house? Did he do a compound break down on your mortgage payments?

I really feel for you, I'd be really upset with your dad too.

FloraFox · 24/07/2012 06:04

Do you think it is because you are using the money to emigrate? He thought he was giving you money to help you stay in your house and now you will be gone.

Thumbwitch · 24/07/2012 06:13

I don't think you're being overly entitled - just perhaps a little naive to have believed your father's offers in the first place. Your father may have thought he'd be quite happy to part with a certain sum of money before he was aware of how much he'd actually get in settlement of your grandmother's estate; and he may not have received as much as he'd originally expected.

He may also not really have expected you to follow through on his offer and was a bit upset when you did - but in fairness, both those things are his problem, not yours.

I understand he is being a bit painful about the money now, and is asking for what I believe to be an unreasonable level of intrusive knowledge into your finances - but I think he should have been straight with you when you first made your request so that you didn't go ahead and accept the offer. FOr him to have agreed it, knowing that you would then accept an offer conditional upon it, and then renege, is just unkind - and for him to now punish you with silent treatment and so on is childish.

Money between family members can be a real issue - if I were you, I'd do my damnedest to pay him back as soon as you possibly can and then never accept any other offer from him again.

gamerwidow · 24/07/2012 06:21

I think you have been unreasonable actually. He mentioned that there may be a chance to remortgage the house, this sounds like a putting forward of a possibility not a promise.
When you approached him and he wasn't keen you should have left it there instead of pressurizing your DF to make a financial commitment he wasn't happy with. You were also foolish to commit to the move on your end without finalising finances and making sure the money was in place from your DF first.
It looks like you have put your DF in an impossible situation where he couldn't refuse you just to force ahead with plans you couldn't afford.
That money was your dads to do what he wanted with and only becomes yours when he dies. Other people finance their plans with their own money without emotionally blackmailing their parents and you should have done the same.

Youaresoright · 24/07/2012 06:42

I don't think you are being entitled and grasping, but as to whether you were being U to hold him to what may have been an ill thought through offer on his part only you know - if my DF had made an offer like that he would have thought through exactly what cash he needed to keep from his inheritance, he woudl have had an idea what my mortgage was etc etc, however is you know best whether your DF would have really thought it through beforehand.

Also, if it enables you to emigrate away from him - well I would have thought that might upset him, not what he thought you would be using the money for? My DM offered us some money when we were thinking vaguely about moving 20 miles away where it is cheaper, if it meant we could afford to stay in the area. I don't intend to take her up on it at the moment but might do one day in the future but only for the purpose she intended it for.

Arana · 24/07/2012 06:44

We couldn't have afforded to emigrate with a mortgage - the rent would have only just covered the mortgage and we couldn't have afforded any increase in interest rates on a buy-to-let mortgage (we could only get consent to let for 1 year). We couldn't guarantee that we'd have enough money once out here to send back to top-up the mortgage payments.

Yes, I suppose we were foolish to commit to the move without having the finances in place first, but it was a situation where we had to respond quickly, and my Dad went on holiday immediately after agreeing to re-finance the mortgage, and we weren't able to contact him.

I made the situation as clear to him as possible, in a neutral way. I didn't emotionally blackmail him, but I did say that if we couldn't re-finance the house, we couldn't move. I don't think stating the facts is emotional blackmail. I made it as clear as I could, that he didn't have to do this, but that if he did, it would be very much appreciated.

I suppose there is a bit of resentment (that I've always been very careful to hide) that he just doesn't understand what it's like to not be well off. He's always been well off, although financially cautious, and has never seemed to "get" having to make tough financial choices. For example he criticized our choice of car because it was 10 years old and had high running costs, without taking into consideration that we couldn't afford to spend any more on a car, while he gets a new car every 3 years, so everything is always covered by warranty. The same with the mortgage - he's been mortgage free nearly all my life, so it didn't occur to him that we'd pay 7.5k a year in interest on our mortgage. He'd always suggest we should take the kids somewhere sunny on holiday, not realising that there was no way we could afford a foreign holiday.

I think some of the resentment from him to me is also about us emigrating - it's much more of an inconvenience that he now has to travel to Australia to see us, rather than Yorkshire. I don't think he minds the travel per se though, as he regularly visited Australia, New Zealand, South America before we emigrated, so I didn't think it would be such an issue.

I guess we're both unreasonable.

OP posts:
Arana · 24/07/2012 06:46

Sorry I meant to add that he'd always been very positive about our plans to emigrate (which had been a long term plan since we got married 8 years ago).

OP posts:
SoSoMamanBebe · 24/07/2012 06:58

Can you rent out your property? We have BtL and it covers our mortgage. We had 30% collateral.

whois · 24/07/2012 07:58

I think you are both being a bit U.

He offered something then changed his mind, but then you should have been v grateful for any help and not expected more. Tricky.

Good luck with emigrating.

New posts on this thread. Refresh page