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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU to think this is not fair to Single Adult Households?

46 replies

WetAugust · 12/07/2012 17:45

Our Council is one of the many councils that have propsed to abolish Single Adult Discount from April 2013 onwards.

This is a discount of 25% on Council Tax for people who have only one adult living there.

As a result my current Council Tax will increase by a whopping 33% which is almost £28 per month!

That's an outrageous increase! My pay's been frozen for the last 2 years and will remain so - yet I have to fork out an extra £332 per year.

Some of the single adult households affected will be:

single parents
widows / widowers
divorcees
those with children in FE/HE for which they don't receive Family Allowance

OP posts:

mummymeister · 12/07/2012 20:47

There is always an issue with universal benefits or universal discounts like this. some people who are well off perhaps shouldnt have it where there are some households that really rely on the discount. the only true answer is to means test everything so that those who can, pay and those who cant dont have to. however, means testing is so expensive that some systems cost more to administer. The govt overall seems not to like universal discounts/benefits but to date is only answer seems to be to get rid of it altogether. not sure what the answer to it all is really, just pleased that there are people on MN who pick these things up and point them out to the rest of us.

ShellyBoobs · 12/07/2012 20:48

This government seems to be hell bent on victimising the poorer end of society...

From what I've read on this, it's only Labour councils which are going to abolish the discount.

AKMD · 12/07/2012 20:53

YABU, this kind of thing irritates me, sorry. I had £200 a month taken away as of April this year as the rules on working tax credit have changed. I'm on a 3-year pay freeze, living costs are going up and up and up and DH and I just have to manage. Things like this are happening to everyone because successive governments spent far more than they should and now everyone is having to suck it up that what they were 'entitled to' was actually a massive privilege that this country couldn't afford. Everyone is having withdrawal symptoms and I am so bored of the whinging and whining about it. Seriously, how much impact is this going to have on people vs the cuts to DLA etc.? I know which one I'd choose to make if I had the luxury of choice.

AKMD · 12/07/2012 20:54

And don't get me started on the squawking over the cuts to the arts, 'save my puppet theatre' blah blah blah. It makes me sick.

Whoops, too late.

mummymeister · 12/07/2012 20:56

AKMD - i like the cut of your gib. arts funding could be a whole new topic

squeakytoy · 12/07/2012 21:00

YANBU at all OP. Council tax and the way it is apportioned/charged is bloody unfair towards many people.

littleducks · 12/07/2012 21:02

Our council hasn't decided what to do yet, they have outlined all the proposals with details explaining how much each idea would save.

I'm not sure that I agree with the OP, if she is living in a house next door to a couple living in an identical house using the same services to the same extent why should she get a discount? There will be rich and poor single households.

ShellyBoobs · 12/07/2012 21:12

...a couple living in an identical house using the same services to the same extent...

According to the BBC, CT pays for "Local services such as planning, transport, highways, police, fire, libraries, leisure and recreation, rubbish collection and disposal, environmental health and trading standards."

Other than bins being emptied, I'm not sure how a single person would be using 'the same services to the same extent' as a couple?

OutragedAtThePriceOfFreddos · 12/07/2012 21:25

Outraged, but you are saying that you would prefer single dwellers/parents to make up the shortfall

I suppose in a roundabout way I am, but that's not the intention of my point. I dont like the fact that it would have a massive impact on peoples income, of course not, but the way the system is at the moment is that Council Tax is based on property. You get a discount if you live as a lone adult, but the actual cost of the property is what it is regardless of how many people live there.

We either have local tax paid by the individual or the property. Personally, I'd prefer it to be paid to the individual (ie poll tax) but as has already been pointed out, there are downsides to that too.

ShellyBoobs · 12/07/2012 21:37

I think a poll tax would be fairer, if implemented properly.

It would need to be based upon ability to pay/income somehow, though.

NowThenWreck · 12/07/2012 21:39

Maybe Shelly, but it's this government that is making it all possible for the councils.
I can see this is going to be another thread where people fret about "hard working families paying their taxes" and "cuts have to be made somewhere" so I will end it here I think.
It may be that couples have had their WTC cut. So have single people. I am personally about £50 a month worse off than I was. OK, I will take the hit (or rather ds and I will take the hit), but I just can't accept that all these cuts austerity measures have to only hit the people who are struggling the most.
What top council employee, or management consultant has taken any kind of hit to their paypacket?

My council spend THOUSANDS on fucking promotional banners to put up on lampposts proclaiming how fab it is to live here.
Cut that load of shite first, then come tell me I need to pay another £25 quid a month, on top of the £90 a month I pay (on my own) for water, the £75 a month I pay for energy and the £600 I pay for a roof over our heads and the £70 quid a month I pay in fucking bus fares.

Makes me feel knackered just thinking about it.

NowThenWreck · 12/07/2012 21:41

Oh, and my landlord owns my house, so whoop-de-doo for him if the property values are such that I have to pay a high council tax.

NowThenWreck · 12/07/2012 21:42

I meant £30 a month for water, not 90!

OutragedAtThePriceOfFreddos · 12/07/2012 21:43

Income tax is already based upon your ability to pay. It doesn't take in outgoings, but I don't believe it should have to. There has to be an amount of tax that everyone is required to pay, we already have council tax benefit for those who are the least able to pay.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 12/07/2012 21:46

Well, there is tax everyone has to pay. It's called VAT.

Council tax isn't a tax everyone is required to pay. Students are exempt.

So not quite sure what you are getting at there.

littleducks · 12/07/2012 21:46

I think council tax benefit is going as part of these proposals actually-to be r4eplaced with 'something' determined at local level

Margerykemp · 12/07/2012 21:47

The biggest chunk of council tax goes on social care, next biggest bill is education.

This isn't about bins.

quoteunquote · 12/07/2012 21:58

I wonder how long it will be before the discount on holiday home council tax goes?

here

supersalesoup · 12/07/2012 22:10

I think means testing is better for council tax discounts, after all if the single person was on a low income they'd get council tax benefit anyway (although I know that is changing, but our council has said it will still offer means tested benefit). Just because it will affect single parents, divorcees etc, not all of those people will be struggling to pay. If they are, they should be applying for council tax benefit.

I don't really agree with exemptions for holiday homes or students either. I work in a university and deal with administration for their finances so I know many students are better off than many working people, especially the mature ones who have gone back for a 'fulfilling' second degree after years of corporate work!

lunamoon · 13/07/2012 22:43

Sensuallettuce- What I meant was the cut off thresh hold for wftc is the same for one adult as it is for 2.
I am only pt working, this takes us to just (and I mean just) over the threshold for qualifying for wftc, or at least will do next year, as it has been dramatically cut.
If I was single, or dh was single we would qualify to have our income topped up. However we are still earning the same iyswim.

Basically I will face a position of going out to work to be no better off or perhaps when I take into account the costs of getting to work worse off.

That is another thread I know.

As an aside I think the council do waste money.
Examples have been given above already about posters proclaiming how great it is to live in town x. Can I add leaflets printed in hundreds of languages to that waste of money. My council building a brand new swimming pool 300 yards from the existing one. Building a brand new multi media library in the town centre, alongside the existing town centre library, but then closing many local village libraries because "the council cannot afford to run them," even though when I do visit my village library it is always busy.

2rebecca · 13/07/2012 23:02

I think encouraging people to live together is good. Any benefit or reduction that makes people reluctant to move in together or makes them pretend they don't live together is daft. Having said that 2 people do use twice as much water, make nearly twice the waste etc so just having all adults pay council tax regardless of whether they live together or apart would make more sense, but then that was the idea behind the tory poll tax which was hated up here, and that would lead to people not paying for second homes which is wrong. There should be incentives to have all homes occupied for as much time as possible.

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