to think England is still highly xenophobic

[bnad]

Since the European Football Championships have started I've heard several people at work and the other night in a pub make nasty comments about the people of other nations. Germany, Scotland, France, Wales seem to be the most commented upon in deragoratory ways. I used to think that we live in an open minded progressive country with most people being forward thinking people but it seems a lot of people believe and repeat ancient stereotypes.

Listen there's only two things in life I hate and that's xenophobia and the bloody Dutch.

I think Football is an exception to the rule fwiw, IMO its because England has this (totally statistically irrational) odd belief that they are a top 8 world side, when they are not.
England are statistically ranked 6th in the World by FIFA.

England 3 - Foreigners 2.

Hurrah!

"Sheep for Wales". They'll play better than the current team!

Firstly, the Scots will support anyone but England. I live in Wales and have, in the past, seen people wearing Argentina shirts, when England play. England is no more xenophobic that anywhere else and it pisses me off that some people are utterly wilfully blind to this fact.

You don't hear foreign football players telling their families not to come here to support them when they play football, because they might get attacked.

It's just part of the competition! People aren't going to start declaring their love for the other nations. Fair enough some of the comments are a bit far, but for the love of god it's not a massive issue

Can't believe people think so much into these things.

What whatmeworry said. I watched a doco the other night about the racism of football fans in Poland and Ukraine. Made me sick to the stomach. The difference between England and Ukraine and Poland is that if people make racist taunts at a football ground in England, they get ejected and prosecuted. The doco showed Ukrainian fans doing Nazi salutes, wearing anti Jewish slogans, attacking indian supporters ON THEIR OWN TEAM and the stewards and police just stood there and let it go on. They are in denial, they just don't care. It is tolerated so it flourishes. England is so much less racist than eastern Europe. I am not saying there is no racism or xenophobia, but much less so than other countries. And I am not complacent about that. But I have lived in 3 countries now and England compares favourably.

I think there's real xenophobia and then there's ribbing. I am Scottish. My partner is English. We slag each other's countries off all the time. I'm tight and crap at football, he's smug and crap at football but with a bigger pool of players to choose from.

I lived in Germany and to be honest, there wasn't much in the way of slagging off other countries there, not even as a joke. I think the feeling about the second world war is too strong for that there.

I don't see anything wrong with a bit of ribbing, but it's really unpleasant when people are actually xenophobic, obviously.

And I do think there's a lot of that in England and in other countries.

Exactly Honey, if our fans mad Nazi salutes they'd be all over the tabloid press being condemned.

But in some Eastern European countries that sort of thing doesn't even make a small column on the back page.

of course its not.
I am a foreigner and have lived in more than 4 countries,trust me this country is NOT xenophobic.
In fact, I have never come across another country that opens it's doors so openly to foreigners to settle here.

Football shouldnt be a marker for peoples opinions IMO it tends to bring out the worst in people , DH is a sane sensible man but was supporting sweden last night

Mrsjay

May I suggest you leave the bastard now

That's if you haven't already...I accept you may be posting from a divorce court whilst wearing his bollocks as earrings

There will always be office banter. I worked in a german company where it was broadly 50/50 split between uk and german staff. When england and germany played, there were derogatory comments aplenty from both "sides" - it was all light hearted and no harm was meant/taken. YABU and looking for reasons to be shocked/horrified/offended.

There will always be office banter. I worked in a german company where it was broadly 50/50 split between uk and german staff. When england and germany played, there were derogatory comments aplenty from both "sides" - it was all light hearted and no harm was meant/taken. YABU and looking for reasons to be shocked/horrified/offended.

seriously the man is a fool worra 11 men kicking a ball and he goes all braveheart on me

Nah - of course there's plenty of digs (which can sound a bit nasty) - but they'll be coming back from people supporting other countries (or who have vague connections and want to be different)

Seriously, I've lived a lot of different places, and the UK (particularly England) is the least xenophobic (in my generation at least) - we'll try food from anywhere, talk to anyone about anything (especially the weather), and even if we weren't inclined to, we have rules (which we follow as is part of our culture) about equal opportunities no matter where you come from - unlike places I've lived which will specify which races are allowed to rent a flat/have previously owned a car for sale etc.

I am not british but lived in the UK for 10 years. I've lived in the south-east, London, the midlands and the north-west.
IMO, the UK is categorically not a highly xenophobic country, it is simply ridiculous to think it is.
Some people are xenophobic in the UK, sure, but it is not a highly xenophobic country, no way!

Out of all the British Isles I cannot believe that the OP singled out England as the most xenophobic. The op has obviously not experienced the ABE (anyone but england) mentality including t-shirts in Scotland or the welsh in BBC interviews replying that the only bad thing about playing in Scotland is going through England to get there. The rampant ant-English sentiment throughout the Union is rife.

I don't mind some of the gentle ribbing that goes on between fans of different nations football teams, but not the more severe stuff. Anti-German sentiment is just embarrassing now, I think. Germany is a lovely country and their football team plays very good and great to watch football these days. And they really like the English, there isn't the same feeling vice versa.

The rampant anti-English sentiment throughout the Union is rife.

Hear hear. Again it's just embarrassing. The English are not in general anti Scots, Welsh or Northern Irish. It's a bit like the Germany thing in reverse.

The OP singled England out because that's where she lives. She didn't say England was any more xenophobic than anywhere else, she just said it was xenophobic.

But surely to describe somewhere as VERY xenophobic it implies a comparison.

YABU. Football is tribal. It's largely tongue in cheek and pretty much every nation does it. I wouldn't take it seriously at all. If you think when the swedes or French play us they are saying just nice things about us you are living a sheltered existence.

I agree with Midge. I think football just makes people want to bond with others on the same side, and they do so with the lowest common denominator - making everyone else sound even worse. I don't think it's true xenophobia.

I have heard it in Germany too, but not 1% of what you hear in the UK. Germans (or the ones I know at least) are very very conscious of being respectful to other countries. That's a generalisation obv.

I wouldn't say highly xenophobic, particularly in every day life. As a xenos (not-british born, mixed race, religious minority...the general xenos bingo "winner"), I am able to get around most of the time without fear or concern for my safety or the safety of children. Physical attacks, aggressive verbal attacks, graffiti including abuse language are not part of my daily life or something I usually concern myself thinking about really, though I do know people who have suffered from these here in England. I even live very close to a football stadium and have never had a problem with them.

However, I would say there is a low-level xeno-hatred that is plain as day. I regularly hear that there are "too many foreigners" when I walk past groups of (particularly young) people when shopping, glaring at me. I've dealt with similar comments in the park and had people pull their children away from mine upon seeing me (my children are 'normally' dressed, I wear a headcovering out of choice and specifically choose ones not connected to any faith). I've dealt with people saying that I or others would be able to get XYZ (housing/benefits/not be arrested for crimes) purely due to our xenos status with malice in their voices. I've had people follow myself and my husband around, even when with our young children, making insulting, intimidating comments. My DH - who is white, british born - has had people spit on him and call him terrible things in relation to him being with me and/or "forcing" me to wear a headcovering. I've had people throwing things at the window while we have a lit menorah (which frightened me badly and glad ours is one my DH made with a wide bases rather than a traditional one which is more easily knocked over). My shul has security staff, cameras, and lists of people attending, and doesn't let people mingle outside due to concerns over things that have happened. I've had, even by HCPs, been referred to as "you people" particularly when discussing my preferences. And on and on.

It is there, people rarely speak up about it when witnessing it (I've never had anyone defend me other than my DH during these even when happening in very public places - even when discussing one with the police I just got that it wasn't as concerning as something else), but it is nothing compared to many other countries. There are many places, even in the euro-zone, that I would not travel to for fear of my and my children's lives. In every day life terms, it's been a far better in terms of xeno-hatred than most other places I've been (particularly at this time of year, I've found Nov./Dec. the worst for it), but there are things to improve. There is an attitude that as long as we're better than others and it isn't aggressive/in your face, it isn't a problem that needs to be dealt with. It's hard to figure out to improve things beyond a certain point.