To think that what is happening to council housing will eventually happen to state education?

[Margerykemp]

Lots of people don't realise this but back in the 50s council housing was supposed to be for everyone, doctors, lawyers, plumbers, factory workers, everyone not just people in need. Just like the NHS. But lots of factors over the decades has left much social housing solely for those in greatest need. Now plans are to make it a temporary solution for those who pass a means test.

Is this education in 30-50 years time? A means test for access to state schools? Children being made to move school if their parents pay increases above a threshold?

The only certainty is that nothing will stay the same.

I live in hope that this is the worst it will get, and soon everyone will realise how a welfare state can improve all of society. I'm scared about how we'll survive otherwise.

Why are you linking council housing to education?

FWIW I believe that council housing should go to those most in need of it.

Doctors, lawyers and other high earners...if they can buy or rent privately should do just that imo.

WorraLiberty but if there was more council housing it could be made available to more people. The problem with private renting is the short term leases. And if there was council housing made available for those less in need the councils could make a profit from it which would be a good thing.

MargeryKemp sadly I think you are correct, and the nhs too, at least in England.

Yes but to more people who are high earners and so don't actually need it.

I'm all for council housing for the needy and not for people who want to spend their disposable income on luxury cars and holidays whilst occupying council homes.

As for Education, well since many schools are becoming Academies at a fast rate of knots, I really doubt it'll happen to state education.

I hate to say it, but Mathew Wright made several valid points about this on today's show.

I do not agree that education will be subject to anything like the restrictions on council housing.

I for one would much rather councils bought up houses for council stock and let them out to tenants, rather than funding private landlords £900 a month fecking rental because there aren't enough council houses/flats to go around.

I think it will. Private education will be the norm, and competition will lead to fees decreasing and standards soaring. Public education will be the equivalent of public housing, for those who can't afford anything else.

Totally disagree. Council housing is no longer the norm, and housing is in no way comparable to education (IMO).

the VAST majority of children in this country go to normal state schools. The difference is that if something changes with council houses then it's always going to be an individual affected. If anything started happening with schools, even before the parents could bludgeon Gove to death protest about it, the teachers unions would squash it before it ever became reality.

It would be so much better for everyone if the majority of housing were council again. Private renting is obscene, people should not be owning 2 homes and making a profit from it. Mortgages do nobody any favours , what is the benefit of owning your own home? If we could all live well in council housing. Much fairer on everyone. Schools, nhs, housing all being reduced and privatised only benefits the very rich few and fucks everything up for the rest of us.

Agreed

If anything started happening with schools, even before the parents could bludgeon Gove to death protest about it, the teachers unions would squash it before it ever became reality.

It'll be the teachers unions that force the issue, because it's them that are preventing change and allowing the gap between public and private to increase.

Governments haven't listened to teaching unions about anything over the years (regarding fundamental changes to state education) particularly the academisation of the system.

No. I don't believe it will happen like that.

Apropos of nothing: I read an interesting fact a few years ago (perhaps three) that over 40% of residential properties (in the UK) were owed outright (without mortgage)

It could be argued that given how appalling the current system is anything which limits the number of state schools in this country is a good thing. I can't see your fears becoming reality though Margery so I doubt if you've anything to fret about.

krumbum

"Mortgages do nobody any favours , what is the benefit of owning your own home? "

Well, unlike in the private rental property I lived in for 7 years while waiting to buy, we don't have the lights packing up every 2 weeks, the washer/dryer completes a full load in less than a day, the oven gets warm enough to actually cook food, and the carpets don't look as though they were taken from next door's skip.

State education is a failure for so many children. It fails the best and the brightest, it fails the least able. The ones that do OK are the ones that fit the state-approved 'box' the best - average or above-average intelligence, reasonable work ethic, reasonable family background. Anything outside that 'box' and you're going to struggle.

education, no. Healthcare yes. They are already trying to dismantle the NHS and turn it into the craptastic system the US has

Council housing? Housing associations have taken over, and are much better run than council housing. And there is lots more of it too

Amis- the rent the tenants pay?

The whole idea of universality of the provision of services to fight Beveridges 5 giants of want, squalor, disease, idleness and ignorance.

YABU.... Education to age 16 is compulsory. Living in social housing was never compulsory

Private education will not be the norm for most people , tbh in other parts of the country private education is in the minority , in my area we have 1 fully private school and a half and half private high school TBH i dont know how that works but the children who live in the area can go for free , maybe the fee payers get better classrooms

My whole family for a few generations came from council houses , there doesnt seem to be the stigma of LAH in scotland that there is elsewhere , lots of non needy people live in LA or HA homes , although that is changing because there is no more council housing being built
, but i dont think state education will be just for the poor and needy we do not live in victorian times , and i dont see it going back that way anytime soon , you get fantastic state schools with great results and pupils coming out motivated and hard working young adults ,

I think it would be more sensible to sort out the private rental market so there was more protection for both tenants against bad landlords and landlords against bad tenants than building stacks and stacks more housing to be rented out at a subsidised rate. Make long term leases the norm, make it easier to evict properly bad tenants, make it easier to take landlords to court for failing their duties.

While this is Australia, the idea of wealthier parents paying fees for government schools has been floated. Bear in mind that all government schools have expensive uniforms, all books, etc are paid for by parents, and there are "voluntary fees" levied each year.

I think free education is safe for a while in the UK, but under tighter state control as LAs are ditched for central government-contolled schools.

I agree with you cly make private landlords responsible , DDs friends landlord has been taking rent and not paying the agency she may get evicted shes a 19 yr old student its shocking ,

Cogito- schooling isn't compulsory- home education is legal

Mrsjay- how you describe state schools is how council housing used to be described. Lots of council housing was of much higher quality than private housing when it was first built. And it was envisaged to be lived in by the 90%+ of the population, just as high as % using state education.

yes i know margey but i do think state education could stay that way , trying to be positive here council housing is now looked down on and SOME people assume the plebs and great unwashed live in HA houses