to tell (adult) cyclists to GET OFF THE PAVEMENT!

[CelticPromise]

On my run last night a man cycled up behind me and passed pretty close. I didn't hear him cos listening to music. I didn't plan to say anything but 'get off the pavement!' just came out of my mouth. He shouted back something about there being no space on the road.

He then waited outside (i presume) his house and asked if I had a problem, to which I said I did with adults cycling on the pavement. He seemed to think that he was perfectly justified in cycling on the pavement because 'there is no space'. This went into a minor slanging match and I just told him to grow up and ran off.

Now I am not proud of shouting and if I could do it over i'd apologise for that and quietly point out that what he was doing is illegal and dangerous. But AIBU to say something? Has is become acceptable to cycle on pavements? Am I in the wrong?

Peppersaunt, I think you make the point clearly, but come to wrong conclusion

If it's too dangerous on the road ... then either the road should be made safer, or there should be segregated cycling facilities. You wouldn't expect a motorist to have to push their car between sections.

You'd never know it was illegal though - it is a huge problem where I live and I've never seen anything at all done about it.

If it's too dangerous on the road ... then either the road should be made safer, or there should be segregated cycling facilities. I agree with this completely.

In the meantime PLEASE DO NOT CYCLE ON THE PAVEMENT!

I'm Dutch and have cycled in the UK for 13 years, most recently 5.5 milers each way from town to city. Ok you need to be alert and assertive but if you know what you're doing it's fine on the road.

I always shout at adult cyclists on the pavement. And make myself and ds as wide as possible so they can't get past

HipHop, I agree entirely, I always shout at pavement cyclists, but "in the meantime" seems to be a long time coming, which will only create more problems for pedestrians, cyclists, motorists (and the NHS) alike

I have to say the 'no choice' thing sounds like bollocks to me. I cycle through Central London at least once a week; it's grisly at the moment thanks to a combination of gas pipe replacement works and Crossrail; I don't think I've ever felt I have 'no choice' but to cycle on the pavement.

I have just seen a cyclist get missed by a construction lorry by a hairs breath. He was cycling on the road - this is through Hyde Park, the part where there are good cycle lanes on both sides of the road (and some through the park) but in some places it cuts onto the road, so many cyclists don't bother to cross the road and stay on the main road. I see things like this every week on my walks to school. Sometimes is the the cyclists fault, sometimes the drivers, often both. Either way, no one ever apologises, puts their hands up or asks if the other party is ok.

Often the first thing they do is pull out their phone and start recording the other party whilst yelling at them.

My friend was yelled at by a cyclist burning a red light because she had the audacity to step onto the road with her son at the green man. She blurted out 'sorry!' as he was screaming 'get out the bloody way!' before she realised he was in the wrong. His response was 'you won't be so lucky again'. People in the wrong often get very very aggressive.

This particular junction is a free for all - and yesterday I did yell 'youre not supposed to do that!' at a driver who decided that he didn't want to drive his Porsche around the corner, so did an illegal turn through a red light, as I was crossing at the green man.

The lorry today was indicating and turning but the cyclist whizzed up and cut through on the inside. It was very very close. I think people do get complacent on the roads - bikes, cars and pedestrians, and another issue in the mix is the London 'piss put of my bloody way' commuter attitude.

I see lots of cars parked in cycle lanes in other parts of London. I also see tourists wandering over cycle lanes and runners dodging bikes, cars and prams as they swerve around obstacles. Loads of people are texting, farting about in their I-phones or listening to music. No one pays attention to other people, and this is another problem.

It seems that a big part of the problem is that unlike other road users, cyclists can and do go on the road without any training whatsoever. They don't have to know the highway code nor do some of them consider the effect they have on other road users. With the best will in the world, bikes are small and difficult to see on a busy road. You can't always be aware of them and if they don't follow the rules of the road then they put themselves and other road users in danger.

I don't know that you can have a driving test for bikes or a licence system but that is what is needed. I don't see it as any more difficult to police than a driving licence - it isn't as though you have to stick yours to the windscreen when you get behind the wheel so why would having bike licences be any different?

We had to do our cycling proficiency test when we are at school. I hardly ever see a cyclist stick their arm out when turning.

Yes, I did mine too and children at my DC school still do it but you are right, nobody sticks their arm out, well not many anyway and usually after they have already cut across the front of you.

I think children of 9/10/11 are probably too young to fully appreciate the dangers of the road anyway. They really need to be a bit older before they take a test but that leaves them on the pavement doesn't it and then we are back to square 1. There is no easy answer.

Bennifer, no you wouldn't expect a motorist to push their car, it isn't designed for the purpose.

A push bike on the other hand is! There's a clue in the name.

"minipie, what is wrong with having to step to the side of the pavement when someone else is trying to use it too? If another pedestrian was walking in the opposite direction to you, would you continue walking in the middle of the pavement, or would you step to the side to make it easier to pass? I'm guessing you must step to the side, or you'd crash into other pedestrians whenever you met someone else who thought the same way. Why can't this same courtesy by extended to cyclists?"

Teddy of course I step aside for other pedestrians. There are several differences however when it comes to cyclists:

1. When two pedestrians need to pass each other, there is space for them both to stay on the pavement, they just have to move aside. There is often not space to stay on the pavement if a cycle is coming past you at speed, so the pedestrian has to step into the road/gutter.

2. When two pedestrians need to pass each other, sometimes one steps aside, sometimes the other. There is give and take. With cyclists it ALWAYS seems to be the pedestrian who has to step aside because the cyclist wants to maintain their straight line (often they aren't a good enough cyclist to steer around the pedestrian whilst keeping up the speed they are at).

3. Most importantly, when two pedestrians need to pass each other, neither of them feels at risk of being hurt. When a cyclist passes me at speed, I feel at risk of being hurt if they or I get the judgment a little bit wrong. And I expect most pedestrians feel the same - especially if they have children, or are a bit frail themselves for some reason.

Now, if cyclists were to always slow down to pedestrian speed when on pavements, my objections above would disappear. But they don't.

Everything that minipie said.

Plus, at the risk of being a broken record, another pedestrian on the pavement is not breaking the law, but a cyclist is.

A small child or a frail old person does not need to be hit by a fast cycle to be really injured, a slow moving one will do a great job - so on that basis I actually disagree with minipie.

Certainly round our way there is simply no room for bikes on pavements.

segregated cycling facilities otherwise known as cycle lane. We have loads of these where i live and yet they still prefer the pavement.

I have no problem with 10 year olds cycling on the pavement. It's on the pavement or not cycling at all and then how will they learn.

Bikes are a lot faster than pedestrians and not as manoeuvrable as people on foot, even for a skilled cyclists. Cyclists can come from nowhere because of their speed and if you aren't expecting to see them or if they come up quickly behind you, you don't get a lot of option to get out of the way.

Plus if you bump into a person at walking pace, not harm done, you apologise and move on . If you bump into a bike it becomes a proper accident. It is likely the cyclist will fall off, you could trip over the bike (it's metal and that hurts). The potential for a bad accident is much greater. You would only come close to that on foot if the pedestrians were running and even then you don't have a hard metal object to get caught up in.

The relationship of cyclists to pedestrians on the pavement is the same as the relationship of cars to cyclists on the roads. It is unequal and one party can do a lot more damage than the other can. I think cyclists often forget that when they are on the pavement they are bad to pedestrians, as the cars on the road who put cyclists in danger.

but squosh, the push in push bike is for pushing the pedals round with your feet...

Madmouse So you think it's unacceptable to expect a cyclist to push their bike at any stage?

Give me abreak.

I agree with minipie above. As a pedestrian it doesn't bother me to move so cyclists can pass, but I'd expect them to do so at walking pace. One issue that hasn't been mentioned yet is that if you're pushing a bike on the pavement you'd take roughly twice the space up. In a lot of places round here that would prevent passing entirely.

I don't feel that there's disproportionate anger towards cyclists, most of the stories tell of irresponsible and dangerous behaviour. I don't take any of that personally because I wouldn't lump myself in with that group just because I'm a cyclist. Of course some people think all cyclists are the same, but they can be safely ignored.

YANBU

And it really annoys me when cyclists tut at you for being in their way on the pavement.

No squoosh not at all, I do it myself to go past stationary traffic on the pavement.

Just commenting on your earlier comment about the word push in push bike.

@madmouse if on the pavement or not at all are the only two options then it's not at all. And they aren't the only options anyway, these days. As well you know.

Metabilis I'm talking about young children not adults.

@inabeautifulplace Obviously all cyclists aren't the same! Many, like me and my kids, follow the law, cycle on the road or dedicated cycle paths, and show consideration for pedestrians. Actually, I'd say MOST of us do that. I'm convinced it's just a selfish stupid minority (and their apologists) who are the problem. Most cyclists I encounter as a cyclist, pedestrian, motorist or runner are just fine. I see more mad car drivers in any given day than I do bad cyclists.