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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to think friends ex-DH should not be able to do this? (sorry v long)

25 replies

Lambzig · 13/04/2012 10:43

My friend has a 7 year old DS. Her ex-DH (and her DS's father) was not good to her, he was serially unfaithful, extremely emotionally abusive and then physically abusive when she got pregnant. He left her after her DS was born.

She is a great mother, her DS is a great boy and she met her new DH who is a lovely gentle person about 5 years ago, been married for 4. She has a DD 2 years old.

In the last 7 years her ex has seen his son a handful of times, despite living relatively near, not at all for the last two years, and has sent the occasional birthday or christmas present. He has not paid any child support.

About 10 days ago her ex turned up out of the blue to her house. He has a new wife, has rented a house a few streets away and wants to see his son and said he has changed. He told my friend that he wanted his son to stay with him Friday evening to Monday morning every weekend starting straight away. My friend is happy for him to see DS, but wanted to start things slowly with a few shorter meetings and build up to staying with him (as DS hardly knows him and hasnt seen him for two years) and that , she would only want him to go every other weekend so he has time with his sister.

Her ex's view is that she has had every weekend for the last seven years, so he gets every weekend for the next seven at least. It ended in an argument with him swearing at her and storming out.

Since then he has resorted to character yelling and screaming and threatening to go to court to get full custody, to snatch her DS and take him out of the country and has even said he will say that her new DH has been abusing his DS to get custody.

My friend and her DH are overwhelmed. I think she needs to see a good solicitor asap and possibly involve the police. She doesnt want to do this as she is convinced if it goes to court her ex will somehow win, so thinks she will just have to agree to his demands. She does not want to stop him seeing her DS if that is the right thing for him, but wants to protect DS too.

I dont have any experience of this type of thing, but I want to advise her and try and reassure her enough to get her to talk to a solicitor. Any advice appreciated.

OP posts:

Technoviking · 13/04/2012 10:48

She must see a solicitor and get it all in writing. Perhaps petition for a restraining order.

StrandedBear · 13/04/2012 10:48

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

fedupofnamechanging · 13/04/2012 10:51

I wouldn't even let him have contact. A man who threatens to make up lies about child abuse or threatens to abduct a child, is not a safe, stable person for a child to be around.

He is a stranger to your friend's ds and a man who demands immediate contact, is not acting in the best interests of the child.

Your friend needs to call the police, and talk to a solicitor and think about getting a restraining order. Inform the boy's school, so the 'dad' can't just collect him one day.

She shouldn't take this lying down - I know she is scared, but her son needs her to do what is right for him, and this man is so very clearly not the right person to have unsupervised contact.

Dee03 · 13/04/2012 10:51

Omg.....your friend should see a solicitor ASAP in my opinion.
He cannot just turn up and demand things his way! Your friend is right, he needs to see his ds for shorter amounts of time building up to overnight then whole weekends....and i wouldnt agree to every weekend either. It was his choice to walk away and not see his ds so he'll just have to suck that up.
He will have to go to court if he wants access and i cant see him winning over the mother TBH but i havent had any experience of court so i cant really comment on that.
Your friend needs to not give in to him and stand her ground for her ds.

PorridgeBrain · 13/04/2012 10:52

Well I'm not an expert but I would certainly get legal advice including whether to register these threats with the police. It seems odd to say he would win if it got to court - is there something we don't know that would cause her t say this?

laughlovelife · 13/04/2012 10:54

she must see a solicitor and get the police involved, keep a record of any threads, demands etc... that has been made, and also I personally would give him a solicitors number, just to knock him off his balance, in showing him that they will not be intimidated, nor will they be blackmailed.

Id also be demanding a restraining order.

I also ask for him to have psychiatric assessments, as no decent normal father would be threatening to "kidnap" his son.

Is he on the BC.

StrandedBear · 13/04/2012 10:55

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

swallowedAfly · 13/04/2012 10:56

she does need to report everything to the police every time and record everything that goes on.

she can put an offer of what she is willing to offer him in an email or letter that she keeps a copy of so that it is evidenced that she has never refused contact and has dealt with him reasonably. that alongside the recordings of his abusive, threatening and unreasonable behaviour paints a very clear picture in case of future court action.

i'd personally want him to have short regular contact and to see how it is for ds and whether it is kept up and positive etc before considering any overnights. she is in no being unreasonable. if she decides she's happy to let him see him for 3hrs on a saturday for a couple of months and then reconsider and puts that in writing and just is a stuck record on this is what i am willing to do then he can take it or leave it with nothing to throw at her as she has been perfectly reasonable given his long absence and in the meantime she is accumulating evidence of how inappropriately he is behaving.

whether she'll do all this is another matter.

IAmBooyhoo · 13/04/2012 10:58

go to the police. he has threatened to abduct the child and take him out of the country. tell the police of all the threats he has made and if possible, press charges and follow through. the court will wonder why your friend didn't if she wishes to use his threats in court as a reason not to allow contact.

i agree he is a risk to this boy and dont think he should have contact.

Original poster

Lambzig · 13/04/2012 10:58

This is very terrifying for her. I think because he walked away from her, she never got to the stage where she made the break and the decision and she never stood up to him. She sees him as all powerful still (whereas I see him as a complete twat who is so self-absorbed and childish that he is dangerous).

DV not recorded. She said at the time "it was just a few slaps and pushes" and blamed herself.

I think I need to get her see that she needs to toughen up to protect her DS as thats the only thing that will convince her.

She has a couple of the messages on her answerphone which is how I know what he said and I have persuaded her to keep them.

OP posts:

bigjoeent · 13/04/2012 11:07

Agree with all the other posters, get legal advice straight away, could you help and look up some solicitors who specialise in family law, details on legal aid and any schemes to get initial advice free. Make it as easy as possible for her to do this. Contact the local police, get them to listen to the calls and get them recorded at least, I cannot imagine any judge agreeing that at present he is suitable to have unsupervised contact. Could you raise this on the legal bit of mumsnet discussion, there may be family solicitors on there who could give some insights.

Good luck, this guy doesn't sound as though he has changed at all and doesn't have the childs best interests at heart.

diddl · 13/04/2012 11:08

All else aside, he hasn´t really seen his son for 7yrs-would a court allow him immediate access & as much as he wants/custody?

He hasn´t seen him on weekends for 7yrs & wants the next 7??!!

Is this a toy?

What prevented him for seeing his son at the weekends for the last 7yrs?

Original poster

Lambzig · 13/04/2012 11:09

Thanks for your info. Its reassuring to know that my dislike of this man isnt clouding my judgement too much.

Am going to see if I can persuade her to see a solicitor today if I go with her.

OP posts:

Iactuallydothinkso · 13/04/2012 11:52

She must see a solicitor as soon as possible. I am not sure when the rules changed but I think if he is named on the birth certificate then he has automatic parental responsibility which does carry some weight. This may not be the case though depending on when the rules changed. They were also married so you need to tell her to check with a solicitor whether he has parental responsibility. As I assume there is no court order in place governing contact she is not obliged to let any form of contact take place. However, if he has parental responsibility then he can use this to say, pick him up from school early etc etc I don't mean to scare you but it's a possibility and one that will leave her with no option at all but to go to court for the return of the child. Scary huh?

Her best bet is to see a solicitor. If she feels she needs to protect her child, sadly this is the only way to do it legally. It's a fine line between scaring someone and making them see it this way but this is what it kind of boils down to.

She really would benefit from speaking to the police. She can just walk into a station and ask to talk to someone and ask for advice as to what she should do if he comes around threatening again. It will all be on record and may help her in the long run.

I hope for your friends sake that she is entitled to legal aid. Protection does not come cheap. Especially if her ex is the outwardly charming couldn't do any harm to anyone type.

Good luck. Your friend may well be terrified that there isn't anything she can do to protect her son but there is. And it takes a lot of strength and determination and tits of steel to do it.

Iactuallydothinkso · 13/04/2012 11:59

Sorry I meant to add that courts see a bad father as better than no father so she needs to do something about this situation before she is forced to.

TheWonderfulFanny · 13/04/2012 12:00

how about encouraging her to talk to women's aid as well? It dies sound like she's not processed the earlier abuse, and he is now abusing her again, with the same sort of threats abusers use to keep their victims in the home. If she could see how common it was for abusers to make this sort of threat, she might then be reassured to know that it only works for the abuser in novels - courts and social services really aren't that dumb...

ben5 · 13/04/2012 12:08

is the house he expects his son to stay in child friendly. Has he got a bed for him? any toys beds etc? you need to point this out to your friend. does the ds do any weekend activties? are they paid for and is the dad prepared to take him to these activties? Has the dad any idea? she so needs to see a solictor and get some legal advice. He hasn't paid maintance for 7 years and now wants to see him. OMG! hope she gets help soon

slug · 13/04/2012 12:32

If I was her i'd be going to the CSA as well.

keepingupwiththejoneses · 13/04/2012 12:38

You friend needs to let him take her to court. FME he will either not bother and things will fizzle out or wil get told by the court to take a running jump and get 3 hours a week supervised! Seriously though, family court is fine, not scary in the slightest, our local one is separated from the rest of the court building with it own stairs, toilets and everything.
I agree contacting the police for now and keeping a diary of everything that goes on so she can show her solicitor. Also contact CSA or even just tell she is, and that she wants 7 years back pay, I guarantee he will soon change his tune.

justmatureenough2bdad · 13/04/2012 12:51

might also be of some solace that if it did end up in court, he woudl presumably be obliged to stump up 7 years of maintenance payments...

Dee03 · 13/04/2012 12:57

Yes def get csa involved too

WilsonFrickett · 13/04/2012 12:59

In this order:
Police
Solicitor
School - to ensure XP doesn't pick child up one day
CSA
Womens Aid - for the counselling I think she needs, it sounds like you are bang-on in terms of her seeing him as all powerful which could mean she's 'stuck' in the past in terms of the action she can take.

Keep all messages and a diary of events

What's her current P doing in all this? Has he got any kind of parental responsiblity?

And I'd x-post in legal too, they are usually very switched on.

Good luck x

Original poster

Lambzig · 13/04/2012 13:17

Thanks everyone. She is going to see a solicitor this afternoon (recommended by another friend who can squeeze her in) and her DH is going with her. Hopefully the solicitor will suggest she talks to the police as she is adamant it would make things worse at the moment.

She is also locking passport/birth certificate etc away.

She wont go the CSA, she doesnt want money from him whatever happens.

Her DH is very supportive of her and has acted very much like a father to her DS for the past five years, including supporting them, but I think he is out of his depth with this and very upset.

The school wouldn't just hand her DS over to a stranger who said he was the boy's father would they (they have never seen him)? Her ex is no charmer, he tends to come over very aggressive, I dont think he has the social skills to fake anything.

OP posts:

WilsonFrickett · 13/04/2012 13:39

I wouldn't take the risk tbh (of school) - they absolutely shouldn't hand him over to anyone who isn't on his pick-up list but I would want to cover all my bases . It should just be a two minute convo with the teacher. They'll also want to be aware should there be any behaviour issues from the DS.

mummytime · 13/04/2012 14:29

There was an earlier thread in which someone had got a caveat put on her sons passport so only she could apply for one, something similar would be sensible here. She also needs to tell the police that he threatened to take her son out of the country, as they can alert the ports and airports. It's better to be safe than sorry.

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