The grand national is cruel to horses

[McHappyPants2012]

Alot of the horses will be injured and whipped into going faster, it's also a long race course.

I can't believe people would bet on this event

And yet knowing ALL that, Oblomov, you still approve of it?

I'm really struggling here.

I think a Jockey broke his arm.

I don't really care much about an injured jockey. He's not likely to be shot for it and he took a calculated risk for his own gain...not my problem.

Sparklingbrook the problem with flat racing is that the horses are immature so they suffer injuries such as fused vertebrae. They are 'backed' when only just over a year old then race at 2. As a horse owner I would be gently getting a young horse used to a rider on its back at 3 years old, then walk and trot over the summer before probably turning it out in a field for fun with its mates over the winter days. The following spring at 4 years old I'd introduce cantering and 'trotting poles' before progressing to small jumps.

But I'm a softie who's kept most of my horses till the day they died - 30 years old in 2 cases!

Makes me sick.

Will never change though. Make the fences lower, and the race just gets faster.

Fewer horses would be an idea.

Not as good an idea as just banning the bloody thing.

Oblomov I very much object to your "it's business" smuggery with its implication that anyone who doesn't understand this is a feeble-minded, hysterical fool who is ruled by their heart and not by their head. Lots of things are "business", such as sweatshops, and slave labour. 19th Century coal mines and ironworks were "business". So what if it's fucking cut throat. Why does that make it ok?

You are clearly after a reaction with your comments and I have just indulged you. Happy?

Thanks for that forty. I didn't realise they were so young.

English racing has always been a flag-bearer when it come to the use of the whip btw

If you look at it, it is not like a normal riding crop, it is a padded paddle which can do the job while causing the horse minimum discomfort. (Sometimes - because you are riding so short - you need to use it to correct the direction of a horse - it's not always used to make a horse go faster.)

Anyway, there are strict rules governing its use which were tightened again recently:

in National Hunt racing a jockey can only use a whip on a horse five times after the last fence or hurdle and eight times in total throughout the race.

So if Katie Walsh overdid the use of the whip she will be facing a ban.

I enjoyed reading Sanguine's post. The bit just before the race, by James May, was fascinating.

Ariel, I may be wrong but I don't think she is after a reaction particularly. I think she genuinely can't comprehend why anyone cares. Which to me makes it incredibly sad.

I did see James May's bit on the TV. He makes everything sound interesting.

Sanguine, it might have a feeble coating of foam at the end but it's still a fibreglass stick.

How anyone can pretend that doesn't hurt is beyond me. Shall we all try it at home on our children? Tent poles, wrap an old sock round one end....does it hurt?

I don't like the sound of 'minimum' discomfort sanguine. I would rather there be no discomfort TBH.

Ariel, 'smuggery' and 'after a re-action'. No I wasn't smug, or after a re-action. I never accused anyone of being a hysterical fool, or any of the other things you said, feeble, heart etc. Could you please point out where I said that? I never said anything of the sort.

Horses can and do refuse to participate. They refuse to jump. Sadly that's often how they get injured when the rest of the field ploughs into them.

Lollopy

Is it not sad that even if she wasn't using the whip to make contact and only 'waving it so the horse can see it'?

It's like 'run faster or you will be hit!'

I imagine it would be similar to a parent who beats their child with a belt waving the belt in their face to control their behaviour

They should get rid of all whips anyway

NarkedPuffin the point is that they won't exist to loaf around in a field any more - they will be extinct

Flighty We are not talking about beating horses. With the greatest respect, I think the example you use of beating children with tent poles is unnecessarily emotive. No jockey nowadays uses his stick if a horse is not responding and has nothing left. It is done to urge on - if a horse has still got some running in him - not to punish.

Good post, Sanguine.

I usually keep my head below the parapet with controversial threads, but just wanted to say that no-one will be more devastated about those poor horses than the people who are driving empty horseboxes home to a yard with an empty loose box. Sod the business aspect, the people who look after the horses absolutely adore them. They have so much more than money invested in them.

Just a question for those who know more than I do.

Horse racing isn't going to go away so wouldn't it be better to campaign for flat racing for older horses and to ban National Hunt/steeplechasing/whatever it's official title is altogether?

This is a genuine question.

If these horse owners 'adored' their horses, why put them in a notoriously risky race where injury and death are common place

Oh right... For the money and glory....

There are strict rules on the use of the whip in racing here

I carry a whip when I ride for safety reasons - it's a quick way to get the horse's attention if it misbehaves. The whip is slightly bendy and has 2 flaps of leather at the end that make a 'clap' sound if it's used. It doesn't hurt the horse if used in this way! (I've tried whacking my own leg with it to test this.) However of course horses can be hurt if beaten and this is what the racing authorities have tried to crack down on.

"I think she genuinely can't comprehend why anyone cares."
Thats not true either Flight. I can appreciate that people don't like cruelty to animals. I'm not that keen myself, on cruelty generally. What do you take me for? I don't want to see animals, or rabbits or dogs mis-treated, or children, or anything else for that matter. But, I am not vegetarian, I do like leather, I like going horse-racing, occasionaly. I don't bet on the horses, but I always place a bet on the National.
I think you may find there are 1000's of people, in the UK, who also don't normally bet, but place a £2(or so) bet on the National, Like we did today.
I don't have that much of a problem with Horse-racing, as some of you who feel very strongly about it. Thats all. Where did I say that I couldn't understand why anyone else cares. Try and quote me, on that one. No, didn't think so either.

Ban National Hunt? You must be mad. Have you any idea how much money would be lost to the economy in tax alone?

If I was seeing right today, the injuries all come as a result of the overcrowding at the fences - falling (doesn't like the fence; can't see the fence); being brought down (crowded fence; being ploughed into, to use Chub's expression); refusal (see above).

If there is no safe line of sight for the horses, then there needs to be a smaller field.