Neighbours children climbing on and jumping off 20ft wall!

[pippala]

We have just bought a buy to let house and have a couple renting.
A few weeks ago they casually mentioned some kids sit on the wall in the garden.
The wall goes up the side of the house and garden and round the back. The wall is shared between about ten houses. On our side it is a 20ft wall but the house next door the land is higher so maybe 10ft on their side. On the deeds it says it is uncertain who owns the wall.
The houses are Victorian. The wall is old and crumbly and leaning.
We were at the house yesterday refencing some of the old timber fencing on the other side of the garden from the wall. There for about two hours. All the time there were the two neighbours children boy roughly 12 girl roughly 10 sitting with their legs either side of the wall and jumping off the wall onto a trampoline in their garden.
Twice I told them how dangerous it was as it was a long way to fall which was met by giggles.
Now I don't live there and our tenants don't seem to have a problem with it but I felt uncomfortable to have these kids watching every thing we did all afternoon.
When we finished we went in the house to talk to tenants and the kids were sat on the wall, legs dangling over our side of the wall looking right through the lounge window less than 3ft away.
So I opened the door and told them sternly to get off the wall before they fell off.
Within ten minutes there Dad was on top of the wall saying "excuse me do you live here?" We told him we were the landlords.
He then said I have told my children they can jump off the wall on to their trampoline, it's halfterm and don't worry I won't sue you if they fall! WTF!!
So my DH was polite but explained it was 20ft drop our side. He then told us its 10ft his side so he has put a step laddar his side so they can jump on the trampoline!!
We asked him who owned the wall and he said his wife thought they did. So it wasn't a problem was it?
I walked off at this stage as I was fuming at his attitude and DH was trying to keep it polite.
Would I be unreasonable to ask our solicitors to find out exactly who owns which bit of wall.I want it noted that he said he won't sue us as that was a very odd thing to say, why would he sue us? Why would he even think that way. I am concerned about damage to the wall and the lack of privacy my tenants have although at this early stage of living there they don't seem to mind.
Am I being unreasonable not wanting this to continue seeing as I don't live there?

Oh come on, it was obvious the 'We won't sue' was a smartarse comment because he felt you were unreasonable/grumpy!

Really, everything else aside....if you own a property you should know whether you own the surrounding wall so YANBU to want to find out what you do or don't own.

The kid thing...well that's annoying but what can you do if you don't know who owns the wall they climb on?

I would have thought a fall from 20ft would break a few quite vital bones if not worse. - foolish stupid man imho.
I wouldnt be happy about it whether as a tennant or landlord. invasion of privacy as well as the fact that witnessing kids on the top of the wall would make me nauseous (I get vertigo even when its not me 'up high'!!)

No sensible advice to offer though sorry.

If it were me I'd ask my solicitor to find out who was responsible for the wall with a view to stopping the kids climbing on it. If it's your wall and the structure of it is unsound then the last thing you want is kids climbing on it. If it crumbles then you're responsible for repairs etc. Plus, it's clearly not offering much privacy to your tenants is it.

Hang on, 20ft? That's massive, roughly two storeys height worth, no?

Utterly ridiculous if so. And definitely wouldn't be happy at tHem sitting on top.

Agree re solicitor. And in the meantime, I'd send a letter (so that you can prove you have in writing) saying:

1. You are very concerned for the safety of their children and that you feel this is a dangerous activity given the height and age of the wall which you have asked them to stop.
2. The children are infringing upon your tenants' privacy and you would ask politely but firmly for them to stop.
3. Whilst ownership of the wall is in question, you consider this activity to be weakening the structure and that, if it were to break, you would be looking to them to mend it promptly (if it is their liability) so that your house remains secure. If it is your wall, you will be mending it and seeking immediate and full compensation from them. You might want to get a price from a local builder and chuck that in too - because a brick wall will be. FORTUNE to replace/ mend.

Thank you for all your comments and yes Eggs the wall is nearly as high as our house!
I can't understand how the parents think it is a safe play option!
The house was empty for two years before we bought it so they were free to climb without upsetting anyone before.
I have heard that as the house was empty all the children in the lane played in the garden!!
When we cleared out the flower beds and cur down the knee high grass we found so many toys and balls!
Will be contacting our solicitor tomorrow.
Thank you.

That is crazy! Letting your children jump from a ten foot wall onto a trampoline? Not to mention the twenty foot drop the other side.

I would phone the non emergency number for the police and find out if they have a community officer who could come around, as those parents are not keeping their children safe.

Chicken wire in wall if it's yours

I have a similar problem with kids climbing up onto a high wall beside my property. Apart from concerns regarding who is liable if they have an accident, I also don't particularly want random kids staring into my sitting room or kitchen and taking away all my privacy. YADefinitelyNBU.

tell them you will sue tho if the kids cause the wall to fall down into your garden and the tenants get hurt!

also anyway you could put up a wooden fence on the top on your side??just a thought?

Is it even legal to have a wall that high? When I was married to a builder, he wanted to build a brick wall round our garden and as far as I can remember, legally, he could only build it 6' high. Actually it might have been because on the other side of the wall there was a public pavement...

That's crazy, a bad accident waiting to happen.
Just so that you know however, if your deeds don't specify who owns or is responsible for the wall (and most won't) you'll never find out for sure.

CalamityKate, the OP's wall was probably there long before current planning regs. You almost certainly wouldn't be allowed to build it today.

Having studied law only briefly I am reasonably confident that if it is your wall and it is old and crumbly (unsafe) and you know children play on it (even if they shouldn't) you are liable if it falls and hurts them.
The law views children differently to adults and expects them to behave in unpredictable and not necessarily safe ways and expects you to take account of that. If it came to this you could find yourself sued although the judge may split some of the liability with the parents for placing a temptation (trampoline) in the vicinity which would encourage reckless behaviour.

Something to think/get advice about.

On a more day to day level, even if it is your wall and you can tell them to keep off it, you might find it makes more trouble than it solves depending on how the kids and their parents take the request. I would be picking my arguments very carefully.

Good luck

It is up to you to maintain the structure of your property so it is safe, so even if the kids 'knock it down' they wouldn't be liable as that would only be the final curtain call on a neglected wall - the ultimate cause for its fall would in fact be the previous years of poor maintenance etc (though obviously you weren't around then, you have inherited the responsibility if it is part of the property).

what sort of idiot parent lets a chi;d jump off of a 20 foot high wall I would find out who owns the wall and if it is you put something on the top of it to stop the children getting on it

You really do need to find out who owns the wall. I also wonder if the dad has seen the wall from your side. If he had, maybe he would not be so blase about it.

If it is their wall -then fine.If it isn't I would worry about the wall collapsing.
I would have certainly climbed onto a wall that high and jumped on to a trampoline at that age it sounds a normal childhhod thing to do.