to think my cousin's PhD is a fraud?

[saffronwblue]

Brief back story- we have always been very close- same age, same school, shared a flat in London and Sydney. Once out of our 20s our lives took different paths. I have married, had children and while proud of my career have fitted it in among family. My cousin has not married and has had a stellar corporate career. She works hard and rewards herself with great holidays, fancy cars etc. I think our values have really diverged - I feel she is always talking about money and how much things cost. She probably thinks I am suburban and boring.
Over the last few years she has been writing a PhD thesis in a personal development/business crossover field.. Much of it has been researched and written by a friend of hers whom she pays for her time. My cousin also pays for each chapter to be edited which includes all the references and footnoting.
I am really horrified about this. I do not have a doctorate but have considered it a few times and am still seared by how hard my husband worked to write his. I probably am being U and know I am being judgey. It just irritates me that my cousin is so proud of herself when she has done it like a corporate project and outsourced the actual work!
A couple of years ago she threatened to sue her university on the grounds that her supervisor was inadequate. They are clearly terrified of her and will pass anything she hands in. She is very powerful and high profile.
I have to learn to let it go and be pleased for her as she has had a number of recent blows in life. But oooh it is hard!

I'd find it hard not to say anything, but it's probably an easier life not to say anything! She will probably get caught out on something else another time if she usually acts like this.

You are definitely supposed to research and write your own thesis. Most universities make you sign a declaration on the front that it is all your own work except where specified otherwise. Signing that when someone else wrote and researched chunks of the thesis would be lying.

As far as I understand it, the Australian system doesn't have vivas as standard and instead sends the thesis out for external examination. Apparently vivas are only available at a few Australian universities and even then only on request from an examiner who wants to clarify things with the student.

phd without a viva?
researching and referencing paid for and done by someone else?

She will be Dr Having A Laugh from the University of Joke, and I bet she will insist to be called Dr...

YANBU but I would ignore, ignore, ignore

cross posts, I did not know that about Australian vivas

She sounds a scam still

Euphrosyne: the vast majority of Australian PhDs are awarded without a viva. The major issue is that she hasn't done the work herself. The project management style approach would be fine if she were PI on a big project (and had spent much of her time applying for the money to fund the project), but the whole point of a PhD is to show that you can do the work of researching and writing up yourself.

Australian PhDs don't have a viva, mainly due to the large distances between cities. So if you want an external examiner to come for a viva it simply costs a lot more in terms of time and money. So, the tradition now is to send the thesis to externals who then rate it.

I guess you have to admire her entreprenurial way of thinking. She is being a fraud but to be horrified? Really? I'm horrified by murder and rape, using someone else to research a PhD is waaaay down on my list of things to be horrified by. So, she's using someone else's skills to get ahead in life, it's hardly ground-breaking is it? Why are you so pissed about it? She has the job, the cars, the holidays, the money, you have the husband and the kids, you said you were both perfectly happy with what you have.

You are perfectly happy without the job, the cars, the holidays, the money, aren't you?

Although, there is now the possibility of a Skype viva with an examiner anywhere in the world (I know someone who had one).

In any case, the viva system can be played a bit. Poorer theses can be sent to 'easier' examiners, or your supervisor can pick a 'tough' examiner of s/he thinks you're up to it/is evil. It doesn't matter so much as an academic career can only be built on the quality of your research;twill hose who aren't very good will struggle to get a job and stay in it.

Well, the external examiner will still be less 'influenced' by her than anyone within her own department - the important thing is that it is being looked at by someone from outside.

Ecstatic, thanks Grahamtribe. :)

It does seem a weakness of the Australian system if the candidate is not called upon to defend his/her thesis in real time face-to-face (even if only over Skype). It would seem a major way in which a candidate who had not done his own research could be found out.

Admittedly, as someone else has pointed out, the system can be played a bit e.g. by arranging a "friendly" external examiner.

I believe in Holland the viva is carried out in front of a public audience, which may include the candidate's friends and family. They make a great occasion out of it.

Somebloke - I would fail a PhD in Holland for sure under those circs, no matter how hard I worked!

She is clearly cheating...but proving it may be very, very difficult.

At my Uni failing to give an adequate account of your thesis at the viva is NOT sufficient proof of having plagiarised the thesis as some students may be too stressed by the experience to perform well. The best evidence for plagiarism is to find the book/article the student copied, but if they get someone else to do the (original) work it's very difficult to hold them accountable.

I have external examined for Australian universities and the standard seemed very comparable to me to UK students. The lack of a viva is a practical issue as far as I know due to the costs of having externals come over. It is surprising that they don't do more over video conferencing though.

The public examination system is very common across Europe. One of my colleagues examined a Swedish PhD and said it was a really lovely occassion for everyone involved.

Systems definitely differ a lot round the world. The Americans make their PhD students do a heck of a lot of graft and extra courses to begin with (mainly to catch up with the level of undergrad degrees in Europe) but then work them significantly harder. They have to defend their thesis in open lecture theatre before they write it up!

Whereas here our finished theses are sent to one internal examiner and one external, both of who come to grill the candidate in a viva. The thing about that is they can ask you anything, even to define why you thought something or to derive some equation you quote. Mine took 2.5 hours! (It was 308 pages - I'd like to have seen someone ghostwrite that for me!)

I know a lot of Dutch folk in my field - yes they do have a big viva in front of everyone; their theses are however more a neat, properly-bound book of their already-peer reviewed and published papers and aren't nearly as long as our unwieldy tomes!

I don't think you need worry, saffron. Folk in the same field will always spot the imposters; even if they've pulled the wool over some eyes they won't do it to everyone. And that gets around...

If it were me I'd set out to annoy her hugely, I have to say, by getting terribly interested in the process. So, does it matter that she hasn't done the research herself, then? Does the university give the PhD to the whole team she has doing the PhD? Who gets to call themselves Dr. at the end - is it the person who wrote the most of it? How terribly interesting. The university - do they think it's cheating, then (note emphasis there and hope she picks up on it..) What is she going to do when - ooh sorry dear cousin I meant if, of course!! - one of the team want to publish parts of it themself? Let's hope they haven't kept proof of it being their original work if she wants to be the one to do any publishing! Oops!

Hahaha.

When you next see her, ask her how her team is doing with their PhD.

You will probably see her shutting up about it pronto.

She's putting herself in a very risky position. Doctorates have been stripped from people, and an accusation of plagiarism or dishonesty is taken very seriously. The people she has subcontracted to could damage her reputation (and gossip can be very damaging) at any time.

I did hear of someone who did a PhD on an area of an African country, then about 10 years later an academic went to that country and discovered the area didn't exist.

mummytime I agree. People have lost their whole careers for less.

Just recently the german politician accused of plagiarism has lost his phd, and it has damaged his career.

I would tell her - she is cheating and doing so devalues a genuine phd.
I wouldn't object to reporting her either tbh.

I think the least she should do is to issue an Oscar winner's type statement on the lines of "It's not really my award but really the countless unsung heros and heroines who have slaved away in the background on my behalf - my my parents for having me, everyone I have met in my whole life just for being there etc etc [takes out handkerchief, sobs ...]"

Send her a copy of this article. This guy was the German politician who essentially copied large chunks of his dissertation word for word from other sources. He tried to hang on to his job for a while but thousands of PhD holders across Germany signed a petition against him, precisely on the grounds that it devalued their own work. He's now without a job and in disgrace - those is the consequences of cheating! And he only got found out years after the doctorate was completed - if your cuz hands in this work she will ALWAYS have the fear that she will be outed. You could perhaps remind her of that fact.

I have a colleague who has a PhD from a leading university but I have serious doubts about his/her own input into this given his/her subsequent research track record. However it made his/her career and nobody has ever checked up on anything.

It's not good, but it does happen.

i would definitely consider it cheating, and yes it 'horrifies' me - i work in uni's and this massively devalues qualifications, it also is indicative of a 'horrifying' attitude that if you have enough money you can purchase anything. This attitude undermines not just education but the very core of our society.

I would tell her clearly i think it is cheating and i didn't want to hear her talk about it anymore. I would never acknowledge it and refuse to address her as 'dr'. And tbh i wouldn't want to be friends with someone who thought this was okay, and had such a consumer/disposable opinion of fairness and democracy.

It sounds utterly pants & part of me would be horrified, too.
But in grand scheme of things, it's no biggie. Not worth the family rift you'd create & she's probably not the first to get a PhD this way from that Uni.

It's fine to outsource some of the work, but specific credit has to be given where due. Proof-reading you can pay for legitimately, but no one is supposed to edit it for you.

If she asked to be addressed as Dr. she's a terrible ponce, anyway!