Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to not understand why religious people won't eat pork

171 replies

CreamolaFoamless · 23/03/2012 15:54

I love a bit of pork

I have looked into the whole pork v's religion thing but I still am at a lose?

Why is eating pork so bad?

Does anybody actually know?

This has been bugging me for sometime so would love hear other peoples thoughts on this

OP posts:
EmmaCate · 25/03/2012 13:42

Not all religions ban pork - the two that leap to mind are Judaism and Islam. I am religious (CofE) and I eat it.

I think the main reason, as no doubt many people have said, is the cleanliness thing. Viz Pulp Fiction: "Pigs eat, and root in, shit. That's a dirty animal." Most of the Jewish culinary customs - from what my uneducated mind can fathom - are about maintaining good health and hygiene, which makes sense given the hot climate where the religion originated. I don't know if there is religious symbology as well .

mathanxiety · 26/03/2012 00:16

Ruminants have a four compartment stomach. Humans, dogs and pigs (among other animals) have one.

Frontpaw -- an uncle of mine reported the same smell and from the same experience your grandfather had.

exoticfruits · 26/03/2012 07:49

I still don't think that you understand my meaning DoomCats-which was that OP understands the reasons, she just doesn't understand why individuals choose to follow-and that is the bit that she doesn't need to understand.

DoomCatsofCognitiveDissonance · 26/03/2012 08:26

Yeah, but what's wrong with asking on here instead of google? I mean, there are loads of things we don't 'need' to understand, but we're still curious.

I get that the OP came across as a bit rude initially but I think it's become clear this debate is quite interesting and giving people a chance to share perspectives, which seems like a nice thing to me.

exoticfruits · 26/03/2012 08:39

I still think that you don't understand my point.

DoomCatsofCognitiveDissonance · 26/03/2012 08:42

OK, I'm really sorry, I expect I don't get it. I promise I'm not deliberately being obtuse or anything, obviously we're just not getting things across on the net. Sorry if I offended you.

exoticfruits · 26/03/2012 09:07

You didn't offend me-I dare say no one else understood it either! I just can't think of a better way of putting it.

DoomCatsofCognitiveDissonance · 26/03/2012 09:10

Glad I didn't offend, anyway! It's probably just me .... slow of thought ...

exoticfruits · 26/03/2012 09:10

Perhaps Fifivisage is an example of what I mean. She is Jewish but doesn't do Kosher. We all know why they have the system, or if not we can look it up so that we understand it. We don't have to understand why some keep it and some don't.

theodorakis · 26/03/2012 09:15

I thought it was because you can't kill a pig Halal because they don't bleed from the neck. Either way, I can't really see why you would care or judge. I live in an Islamic country and most people don't eat pork. They don't question why some people do, maybe they have enough of a life not to care.

LittleWhiteMice · 26/03/2012 09:35

it says in the Bible, Quran and Torah not to eat the meat of swine.

Pigs eat shit, each other and other humans so it wasnt safe to eat back then. Also there is a high chance of getting salmonella if you are trying to keep pork fresh in the desert.

its not religious people, its scripture.

Mizza76 · 26/03/2012 10:12

OK, I'll have a stab at this as I am an Orthodox Jew who keeps strictly kosher. Please keep in mind I can only speak for myself here though. And I haven't read the whole thread.

The Torah the Old Testament as Christians would call it sets out a series of dietary rules which set out which animals Jews can and cannot eat, and some various other rules. Over the years there have been many attempts to explain the rationale or 'system' behind the restrictions. Various explanations have included health, spirituality (eg we don't eat birds of prey), instilling self-control into us, instilling thoughtfulness about what we it, and lots of other explanations that you can google. The truth is that keeping kosher is one of the few commandments that we simply do not understand the rationale of.

So we do I keep it?

Because it has been part of my tradition for thousands of years. I love being a religious Jew, I love our heritage and traditions, and it's part of the package.

Others keep it because they have been told to -- even if they don't understand it. Please understand that I am not talking about brainless automatons here, I'm talking about people who have thought long and hard about why they want to be observant of the laws in the Torah (as in today's world, most people have a choice), and this is something they accept as part of their wider relationship with G-d. Hope that makes sense.

Yet others genuinely believe one/some of the various explanations that have been offered through the ages health, spirituality etc. These are not 'excuses', they are part of the way the religion has come to understand itself over millenia and are very real to people. Certainly I believe that kashrut (kosher) does have a spiritual dimension a lot of our lives is conducted over food and the way we prepare it and it is inseparable from the experience of Orthodox Judaism.

On a personal level, I have kept kosher all my life and so it has never been a problem. I have never in my life been tempted by pork or any other non-kosher item and would never give up my rich religious and cultural life for a piece of meat. Yes, I do sometimes wonder what various non-kosher foods taste like but I'm hardly starving! I don't really care if I never taste them.

The only problem I've ever had with keeping kosher is at work going out for meals with colleagues etc., they often feel awkward when I don't eat. Again, the truth is that I really genuinely don't mind being 'left out' of the meal I'm happy to tag along and sip at my diet coke (and eat my own food later), it's just that others are often uncomfortable. I have to say though that wherever I work, people have always been wonderful - taking me out on occasion to kosher restaurants, ordering in kosher meals and generally going the extra mile for me. It's a testament to the real multiculturalism in this country and the good nature of the British people.

There you go, hope that helps.

KalSkirata · 26/03/2012 10:46

Is there a list of kosher foods Mizza? Or treif? Stuff I wouldnt have thought of. I keep a kosher kitchen as have lots of observant friends (and ethnically but not religiously jewish). Not too hard as I'm veggie (mostly vegan) but I know some baked beans arent kosher. stuff like that.

Mizza76 · 26/03/2012 10:54

In the UK, there is a list of kosher foods called The Really Jewish Food Guide (now even available as an iPhobe app...). You can also search to see whether individual products are kosher here: www.theus.org.uk/jewish_living/keeping_kosher/keeping_kosher/kosher_product_search/

In the US and Israel it's all marked on the food packets (economy of scale).

frumpet · 26/03/2012 12:12

Pigs do so bleed from the neck , thats where the term squealing like a stuck pig comes from i think , stuck meaning stab , in the good old days thats how you killed the pig , didnt want to waste all that lovely blood .

giveitago · 26/03/2012 13:50

Sort of get where mizza is coming from. My mum's family don't eat beef and are strict veggie. Now lots of parts of india people are eating meat (but not pork - so must be something in this) but my family are veggies. I'm not a veggie but I will not eat beef in asian cooking. Sounds odd I know but to me a beef curry is off limits completely as is a lamb or a chicken curry. So all meats in non asian cooking and just veggie for asian cooking.

Can't explain it but it suits me as has not caused anyone any problems to date.

Devora · 26/03/2012 14:05

I don't keep kosher but I do avoid pork and shellfish. I'd no more put a prawn in my mouth than I would a dead beetle. So one answer to the question is: Jews don't eat pork because Jews don't eat pork and cultural habits set hard. Just like British people not eating horses, which is no more logical.

Another answer is that all faiths have rules and prohibitions, and it is the respecting and living of these that entwines religious practice throughout daily life and cultural identity.

A third way of answering is to look for all the anthropological explanations why this particular practice started, which others have done on this thread.

But often on these kinds of threads, for example those on circumcision, what the questioner is really demanding is an answer that will make sense to her, that is coherent with her own cultural heritage and set of reference points. And there probably is no answer to that.

Frontpaw · 26/03/2012 14:21

www.jewfaq.org/kashrut.htm - ok so I can't explain why grape products made by non-jews cannot be consumed, but not eating bugs sounds very reasonable.

www.faithandfood.com/Islam.php - 'Sitting at a table where alcohol is served is forbidden too.' Hmmmmm, my local Persian does serve booze and I have seen some holy types eating there. Interestingly, 'Any human substance or part Envy (meant to be 'boak' but they dont have one - yet), All carnivorous animals and birds of prey ' (so Owl and Lion off the menu then).

ok - so read and learn!

mathanxiety · 26/03/2012 16:06

I wonder about that carnivorous animals bit, in light of mad cow disease and scrapie in sheep, and rendering of animal remains to process into feed.

KalSkirata · 26/03/2012 17:53

animals at the top of the food change would have more toxins from eating all the other animals? So predators are out.
I know its true of fish. Fish are acumulating all the stuff we pump into the sea and carniverous fish eat lots of those. Mind you, sharks are ridicuously healthy.
And I cant spell today

Latara · 26/03/2012 19:30

Thanks for explaining what a 'ruminant' is.. Can't imagine having 4 stomachs!

New posts on this thread. Refresh page