Carseats

[kerchow]

DH and I are about to have an almighty row and I've had to come upstairs to try and calm down about this so I might go on a bit!

DS1 and DS2 have been out all day with MIL, SIL and DN. SIL drives MIL's car, a Nissan Qashqai. When they were collected by MIL this morning they were both in car seats, DS1 who is 6 in a backless booster seat and DS2 who is 3 in a Group 1 carseat belonging to DN. Tonight when they were dropped off I popped my head into the car as they were driving off to speak to DN and saw that she was in her carseat and only that and the booster seat were in the back.

I came in and asked DS1 whether he had sat in a carseat and he said he had but that after they had picked SIL and DN up he had sat in the middle of the backseat and DS2 had sat in his carseat. He also said that on the way home from MIL's he hadn't worn a seatbelt but had sat "very still."

I am livid, not least because MIL has a carseat for DS2 that we bought for her to use and I have mentioned to her before that it is unacceptable for them not to be in appropriate carseats. SIL has two carseats for DN, the one DS2 was in to start with and another in her car. I said to DH that I would have to mention this to her and tell her that the boys cannot go out with her if she won't use the carseats. He has told me that this is unnecessary and that he is sure they would have used the seats. When I told him what I saw and what DS1 told me he backtracked and said it didn't matter anyway as DS1 is tall enough not to need a carseat. When I told him that was incorrect (DS1 is tall for his age but not as tall as a 12 year old!) and that neither boy was safe he told me that I was just being critical for the sake of it and it's just another opportunity for me to have a moan about the in-laws.

I can't decide who I'm more annoyed with - MIL and SIL for being so reckless with my boys' safety or for DH for thinking it's ok. AIBU?

If car seats were provided then yes, you have every right to be livid.

However, is your dc tall enough to not need one? It is I think 135cm or age 11 or 12 .... My dc was tall enough by the age of 7 to not need one!

I wouldn't be happy for my children not to be in car seats. However, my 7 year-old is now just tall enough to legally not use one - He is very annoyed that I still make him use his hi-back booster.

Is the back seat wide enough to get 3 car seats in if 1 is a Class 1 seat (which are pretty bulky)? I can only get 3 in if they are all boosters. I always have the dilemma when I give lifts of whether I am better to have a child not in a car seat on the back seat (which is legal) or a child on the front seat (which I really don't like doing).

if it was me, then basically the children wouldn't be going in their car ever again. why did your oldest ds not have a seat belt on?

By law if a child in the middle doesn't have to have a car seat unless it is a full size seat, I don't think it is in that car. The not wearing a seatbelt is a bigger issue as that is law.

As far as i am aware If your children is tall enough to not need a car seat you could cause more damage if there was an accident and they are in a car seat.

I think given that you have asked them to use car seats for your children then you have every right to be livid if they go against your wishes.
It is not for them to decide whether or not your DS should use a booster, esp if you have told them he should - and as for not wearing a seatbelt?! WTF?!!
If they couldn't fit 3 seats in the back of the car they should have taken 2 cars or done 2 trips.
I think you are well within your rights to bring this to their attention.
Good luck with the row!!

I don't know griphook. He knows he has to wear one but knowing as he's ASD wouldn't have argued if they didn't put it on him.

As for him being tall enough, He's probably close to 135cm but not sure exactly how tall he is.

Regardless of this, as they have enough car seats I'm annoyed they haven't used them. The Qashqai is wide enough. It's a squeeze but they all three have been in there before. I suppose they may think DS1 is ok to travel without one but why didn't they put DS2 in his car seat? I just don't know why they haven't used them and as far as DH is concerned there must be a reason for it that I'm not allowed to ask about. When I mentioned that DN (who is 2) was in the car seat he took this as me having a dig and implying MIL was favouring her!

I can't get 3 car seats across the back of my car so tallest child has, had to sit in the centre without. As the middle of the back seat is quite high the seat belt fits a child reasonably well.
Not wearing a seat belt at all would make me very, very,

Sorry but I think this is one area where you just can't compromise. You have every right to be angry. Either they travel with the appropriate restraints or they don't go. It's also illegal for them not to. You MUST win this argument!!!

Do your mil and sil not realise what could have happened to the dc not wearing a seatbelt in a crash?!

Absolutley, no compromise.
Very on your behalf, car-seats is something I get very anal soap boxy about.

Bad enough that parents risk their own DC, but to risk someone elses child.

WRT height/boosters. My DD is nearly 10 yo and tall (definately 135cm + ) and only within the last week have we taken out her booster.
She asked to keep it because the seatbelt cut across her neck. Only now is she comfy without the seat.

Whatever reason your SIL gives for your DS not having his seatbelt on, it's the responsibility of the driver to make sure all the passengers are belted up.

YANBU!

I'd be fuming, the thought of my 3yo being on a backless booster makes me sick, she's still in a 3pt harness ffs!

Wrt the 6yo no carseat in a middle seat is perfectly legal, I have a 6yo sister and when we had a smaller car had no choice but to seat her in the middle without one (no one else in the family drives so no option of two cars) however, its not something I am happy about so I'd squeeze between the children in a fiesta and sit sister in the front on a HBB.

This is the single reason why NONE of my ils are ever allowed to supervise my dcs where a vehicles involved.

All hell broke out between me and my in laws when they took dd and ds out for a day trip (2 hours in the car each way) and I discovered when they were dropped home that ds, who was 1 had been in a simple, backless, booster seat for the whole trip, as had dd but as she was 4 it wasn't quite as bad. They had the appropriate car seats available, they had room to fit them and had fitted them many times before in that car. I then also discovered that on top of that they had put the children's drinks bottles out of reach in the boot, doesn't seem so bad bar the fact it was an over 30 degree August day and traffic meant that they had been in the car for 4 hours non stop.
At the drop off I honestly couldn't say a word, not sure if I have ever been so angry before or since, mil knows perfectly well which car seats they should have been in, she had no excuse. I bit my lip through drop off so not to be screaming at nanny and granddad in front of the children but the next day on the phone hell broke loose.
Due to this and other things that were going on between mil and myself at the time lines were set, I didn't want anything to do with them personally ever again, they were only allowed to have the children with dh there with them and under no circumstances were they to take them out in a car.
My ds has just turned 4 and they are now allowed to have the children alone and take them out in a car, they learned their lesson and were much more diligent from that point onwards but it wasn't until ds was older, in a high back booster and able to fend for himself more that they were allowed to take them out in a car, even then to start with dh checked the car seats before they went anywhere. My relationship with them is still strained but we are on talking terms. I wish the whole thing hadn't happened and it makes me white to think about it still but thankfully no harm did come to the children and it has given the opportunity to get some ground rules laid down and have a relationship that is more honest rather then sitting on things until breaking point.

YANBU about this and it needs to be addressed, your ds would have been legal in the middle with a seatbelt but no booster however him not wearing a seatbelt is unacceptable, but you would need to see if you could find out if that was due to him being told by an adult not to bother or by him just not putting it on. However it is a bit irrelevant as they were aware of your requirement in regards to car seats and an adult should always check everyone is buckled up before the car pulls away.
I think you have to bring it up with them but try and be calmer then I was, allot of hurt, on both sides could have been saved if both and and the in laws hadn't gotten so rabid about it and talked it over in a calm adult manor. I am still deeply ashamed of how I went about some things and what's said can not be unsaid. Yes it is a massive issue and a massive breach of the trust you place in them but you need to keep your dignity.

YANBU. No compromise, it's illegal; plain and simple. Had she been pulled over by the police she would have got a ticket.

I would be beyond livid!!

Not being in the seat would be enough to make me furious and there would certainly be some strong words.

Not being in a seatbelt would mean I'd never let them in the car again.

Have they any idea what happens to a backseat passenger without a belt on in a crash?

My dad was in a car accident where the middle seat passenger went through the windscreen.

He has impressed upon me how important it is to always make sure everyone in the car is belted up.

Dd is five and 120cm. Occasionally dp will pick us up on his way home from work when he doesn't have the seat-it is a high backed one as I've heard bad things about booster seats and children flying under seatbelts. Dd is however long in the back and fits the seatbelt perfectly even though she isn't legally tall enough. Grandparents are expected to use the provided seat. Mil said once "its only a day without it" as dp belted the seat in and explained no seat no kid !