To not want to leave school near tears every week?

[AngryFeet]

Sorry I know this shouldn't really go here but I don't know what to do and really need some advice.

DS started reception in September (he is Feb born). We are now over halfway through his first year and he still has no friends, none of the children really talk to him and some are nasty to him. I have a DD in Y2 and she had did take a while to make a best friend and there was some low level teasing so I am aware of what kids are like but this is different I think.

At the start DS did struggle to be social with the other kids (possibly a bit shy plus a slight speech delay) and just played alone so they put him in a group with the SENCO twice a week to work on speech and making friends.

This seems to have helped as I have seen him regularly approaching children to show them a toy or tell them something but they all just look at him like he is odd and walk off or just ignore him entirely. I have seen this lots of times now (at drop off, school trips, pick up etc etc). Today I was looking through his school folder and there was an observation sheet filled out by the TA (they have to watch them for half an hour once a term and write down everything they do and say). It started off great with him making numbers out of playdough and proudly showing off what he was doing. Then he wanders to and tries to interact with the others. Both times he is knocked back either by them saying "No don't bring that thing (an elephant toy) here, go away" or just being completely ignored. Each time the TA writes that he wanders off aimlessly.

Last week I saw kids saying "Don't sit next to me XX" when he sat next to them and they quickly moved away or said "sit over there not next to me!". A friend then told me that he DS had been told by others not to invite my son to his birthday as he is a "smelly smelly boy" (he is not).

I don't know if they see him as being different as he can't sit cross legged so has to sit on a chair at carpet time but that is the only thing that sets him apart (he has been referred to an occupational therapist for this)

I just don't know where to go from here. The ladies on the SN board have pointed me in the right direction for assessment in case he has some SN (the leg crossing thing, slight speech delay and he sometimes flaps his hands made them wonder if there was an issue) but I really don't think he does and neither do the school. His teacher says he is immature for his age and really could have done with another year in nursery.

I am sad to leave him every day as he walks into the classroom then just wanders about alone with noone to talk to. He doesn't cry but he is clearly not happy to be there. If he had just one friend to welcome him every day it would help but it is not happening. I have tried some playdates but it hasn't helped. There are two boys who he does get on with but they are in other classes.

Do I just keep going and hope it gets better? At what point do you say "this is affecting him badly"? It can't be good for his self esteem to be knocked back all the time.

What do I do? :(

I am so heartbroken for you OP

this is not how things should be, so def follow the advice on here

for starters speak with school, be frm and gentle but keep going

I am also surpised this nasty behaviour is starting so young, its not normal and you are NOT BU to want to adress this

if you dont think he has SN, then stick with what you feel. I think we are waaaaaaay to fast to jump to SN issues

he's got off on the bad foot, and work can be done to adress this

FWIW I see alot of little boys struggle in this area, so I think its normal

But school need to be more proactive
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Yes we have a friendship stop and games etc that the year 6 run. Maybe organising to talk to teacher and ask her to refer to school council there are always kids who love to play with little ones and this in turn enables children to play together and create bonds in the classroom.

Went through this a little with ds. Used to watch him being left out and it broke my heart.

I have no magic solutions except to engage with the school and push them for help and to work with your ds yourself to help him decode social situations which he may not be able to intuit on his own. We do a lot of "how else do you think you could have acted " and "what do you think x thought of what you said" with ds.

However, my best advice to you would be to look at how happy or otherwise your son actually is. My heart ached for ds as I could see how others were treating him. He however did not see it the same way I did and was much happier. Is your son actually unhappy? If he is not, take a step back, work with him and the school and try not to stress about it.

I help out in my dc's school a few times a week.Lots of the children in reception don't seem to have special friends -especially the boys.They run arround by themselves and join in with whatevers happening in the playground.So don't be too worried by this!.Girls are much more socially aware at this age and can make nasty comments to other members of the class and boys can take it to heart.He will eventually learn to cope and toughen up a bit -its part and parcel of life.I do think he should be bathed every day though.I wonder if he is forgetting to go to the toilet during the day or perhaps leaking a bit [one of mine used to!]-so keep an eye on this.Finally just keep talking to the teacher and ask to see the senco and her to formulate a plan to proactively manage the situation.If you have no joy i would suggest going to see the headmaster with some written points and ask how you can work with the school to help.

OP, speech delay is a additional support need. It's not necessarily one that will be with your DS for the rest of his life, it's not necessarily major, but at the moment if he has a speech delay he does have a SN. In the same way as if he broke his leg and couldn't get round the stairs at his school, he would need support with that issue until he got better. And it could be that his speech delay is affecting his communication, which is all part of the bigger picture.

I just think if you go in with 'there's an issue but it's definitely not SN so why are you offering him SN support' you're not going to get very far. Many schools are not exactly overflowing with support for children who have significant, diagnosed SN's so I wouldn't be cutting off your nose to spite your face, if it were me.

It does sound unpleasant OP, and I would definitely talk to the teachers. My dd is in reception and the only 'bad' behaviour per se seems to be the occasional boy tripping her up in the playground, or play fighting a bit roughly with each other, but generally there is no name calling, as far as I am aware.
I do think you should investigate his needs further though, as he does seem to have a collection of behaviours which could indicate SN .

I agree with all the great advice you've been given about going to the school. The children shouldn't be rejecting and excluding and calling children 'smelly', a talk on kindness and some proactive buddying should sort this out.

I'd also second what 'teta' says though, at 4 or 5, many children don't have great friends. My dd2 is in Yr 1 and is only now starting to develop stronger friendships, but she still mills around looking for people to play with and gets knocked back a fair bit. I think it's more normal than we think for reception children to play by themselves or in loose groups that reform every breaktime.

I have also found playdates are nice, but they aren't at the stage of making really good friends, so perhaps keep doing that but with the understanding they are all mixing in together at school and it may not result in a special friendship.

As for being smelly, my dd2 also doesn't wipe that well and so gets a bit whiffy that way, so more baths/showers may help with that. It may not be that he smells all the time, but perhaps did once and children do pick up on these things. But both mine have had accidents at school and no-one teased them so any teasing should be reported and picked up on.

Hi Wilson, sorry I didn't make myself clear. I am aware that he does already have some SEN and I am happy to take all help required and if they believe he has further issues then again I would never turn help down. The only people who have ever though or mentioned any signs that he shows are me or people on MN. So I was just worried about sounding OTT asking for a referral when noone else has noticed an issue. But I know him best and need to be his advocate so I will make this suggestion.

Thanks for some good ideas ladies. I will report back this afternoon after I speak to her :)

I hope it goes well angry, do let us know.

OP, my DS is 13. I have an appt to take him to the drs for a potential SN.

When he was younger, I always assumed it would be picked up by some professional or other - the school nurse, the teachers... then because it wasn't picked up, I assumed it wasn't really a 'thing'. It's only becoming more noticeable now he's at secondary school.

Just because you feel you are the only one who's noticed anything doesn't mean it isn't there. You are his greatest advocate. Good luck.

Ds2 (3) wets the bed occasionally and I find he needs a quick wash down with the shower attachment on the bath as it can really smell but we do not get time for a bath in the morning. I just wash him over with it, put some body wash on and rinse off, it does the job. I would definitely be approaching the school to see what else can be done. They could get the ta to play games in a small groups, maybe even just with ds and one other child to encourage interaction and also do circle time discussing feelings and how they can help each other to feel good about themselves ect. I feel very sad for you and your ds.

Well I met with the teacher and TA who did his observation and it went really well. The TA said she was upset herself when she did the observation which set me off and embarrassingly I had a little cry . They were very nice about it though :)

They said they have spoken to the class about how to treat each other this week and they are now keeping a close eye on DS. They told me of some incidents this week and recently where they have seen him playing with others and even being invited to play by others. They also said there are a few other children who are struggling and they have been bringing them together when they see them wandering aimlessly and that DS is playing very nicely. He just seems to struggle to approach people in the right way and will often try and jump into a group where they are already playing and say lets do this and they say no so he needs to learn cues better but they are trying to help him. They did say his confidence is already growing and he seems quite happy most of the time.

Going forward they are going to do a school/home diary where they write down each week some things he has done and people he has played with so I have a good idea of what is happening.

I am going to give them a copy of the SALT report after his assessment on Thursday.

They are also going to set him up each morning a little area to do some model making as he is very into that right now and it gives him somewhere to go first thing which makes his start to the day more positive.

They have also agreed to having the SENCO come and observe him for a morning so she can see if he needs to be referred to CAMHS.

Finally she said lets meet each Friday after school from now on to catch up on what is happening and make any changes needed depending on how he is progressing.

I feel much better now and they both said they were happy that I had come to them and that they preferred that to a parent who was trying to ignore any issues so not to feel bad (I did keep apologising for making additional work for them!).

Thanks for all your advice, it was very helpful to go in there knowing what I wanted to get out of it and they took on board all my suggestions :)

That is GREAT progress - well done! You must feel so much happier.

Wow, I'm so glad the school have taken this on and will really help him (as they should, but it's nice to hear of them doing a great job).

So nice to read your update. Hope he continues to get on :)

Wow - that's brilliant :) I am really glad it went so well - here's to happy school days for DS!

Bless him. Hope it goes well. My ds is v shy and went through a similar thing earlier this year - after a number of playdates in the xmas hols he is now totally happy and has lots of friends to play with. Wouldn't worry about the 'smelly' thing though - I'm sure it's just a standard playground insult with no basis in fact.

Oh I felt so sad when I read your story and so relieved by the update.

You sound like a great mum and I am so glad you feel supported by the school and not alone with these worries.

I hope things continue positively from here.

Re. the possible smell. Many years ago there was a little boy in my DN's class who had a smell about him and was isolated as a result. He joined year 1 half way throught the year and struggled to make friends. I used to listen to him read and as the other children remarked there was a very strong smell about him. He was beautifully clean. I was not able to identify the smell.

On parents evening I sat with his parents and they had the same smell, it was not offensive but it was strong. Not long afterwards the family left the school. Your post reminded me. I wounder if it could have been incense. It was not a food or a dirty smell.

I live on a farm and often hope that eau de farm yard does not linger about me! I keep a bottle of No 5 in my glove box just in case.

I hope your little boy finds some good friends soon.

Well we definitely don't have any incense or air fresheners or anything strong smelling in the house. Started giving him a mini shower in the mornings and still caught a boy calling him smelly again this morning. I gave him the death stare and told the teacher. She seemed quite shocked that it was this little boy although I get the impression he is the main instigator so hopefully she will be more watchful of him now.

'I must say I have never experienced reception age children being so deliberately exclusive in that way. Sound like much older children'

I have .It happens in middle class schools with precocious children IME
What sort of 'intake' does the school have OP?

oh and the 'smelly' thing I think is a red herring. Why does the teacher think the kids don't like your DS.Ask her to be brutally honest!

just a big hug and hope it gets better

It is a very middle class area. I have asked the teacher and she thinks it may be that having to sit on a chair at carpet time has pegged him as different. Also because his social skills at the start weren't good and he played by himself a lot.

Oh bless, I'm glad the chat went well OP

My DS1 had some issues when he started school, he was very young ( late August birthday ) and had just finished a lengthy spell in hospital after an accident. He didn't mix at all well to start with and it broke my heart.

Fast forward a few years and he's a cheerful, confidant, friendly soul with a good crew of mates.

An unmumsnetty hug for the pair of you.