AIBU to think that Retail Landlords are just a bunch of greedy suit wearing monkeys?

[AprilMeadow]

I'm not sure if this is the right topic to post this in but am struggling as to where to post.

My best friend, a fellow mumsnetter (thecoffeewench) & her partner are the owners of an independent coffee shop in the town I live in and are currently suffering at the hands of their greedy landlords. They have 2 dd's who are 3.10yrs and 19mths. Their youngest suffers with a heart condition so their stress levels are already fairly high.

I'm not very good with wording things so i hope you don't mind but i am going to put a link to a friends blog who says it all Save More Than Coffee

These people are godparents to my youngest child and we are godparents to their youngest. The stress that they are being put through is totally unnecessary but unfortunately the greedy landlords are not interested.

So far we have managed to a get a petition together, had BBC Radio Surrey interview Sarah & John as well as getting the local press involved.

Tomorrow at 10.30am we are holding a Flash mob at the Hart Shopping Centre to see what interest and support we can drum up.

So, aibu to think that this is all down to the landlords or should we just accept that this is how things are in this current day and age?

If there are any fabulous mn'ers out there that could offer any advice/help/support it would be greatly appreciated.

We do have a Facebook page if you would like anymore information.

Thank you for taking the time to read this x

Those landlords sound like proper shits. Have your friends looked into relocating the business at all? Who else is lined up to use the unit? Another coffee shop?

Bastards.

If they relocate it will cost them £40k that they don't have. They shouldn't have to relocate with so many other empty shops.

We aren't sure who the other people are.

£40K sounds an awful lot if they already have fittings etc - have they really looked into alternatives - with that many empty units they may be able to negotiate a better rent deal and save alot over a few years.

And while I do have a lot of sympathy you dont know the landlords backstory - they may be staving off bankrupsy and higer rent may be thier only option.

In this case, its a greedy landlord - very rough on your friends. Not all are like this - and with so many empty premises, most landlords have had to peg their rents for years, and the value of the property will have declined a lot. Many will be shit scared of their tenants leaving for cheaper property and then being stuck with the business rates and insurance on an unleasable, unsaleable property. In 'this day and age' the unfortunate case of your friends may well be the exception. Its hard on the high street all round, I'm afraid.

What's wrong with the landlords wanting to maximise the rent they get for their property?

Well maybe but if you have a private pension I bet a fair amount of it is in commercial property and you'll be wanting a good pension and to see an increase in your investment every year. Market rents are just that, what the market will pay.

And £40k for moving premises sounds very steep if they already own their fixtures and fittings

AM - how do your friend's occupy the shop ? Do they have a lease ? Do they have security of tenure provisions (i.e. is it drafter within the 1954 Landlord & Tenant Act) or are they occupying on some kind of Licence to Occupy or Tenancy at Will ? Have they had any legal advice ?

I'll send you a pm on fb

We have actually matched the higher rent offer made my the other party. Which is a 60% increase on what we are currently paying. We have been told that the landlords think that on paper the other offer is a better option.

Try the Mail to see if you can get any coverage.

Editorial Mail on Sunday
News - 020 7938 6899. [email protected] .
Features - 020 7938 7053. [email protected].

Read more: www.dailymail.co.uk/home/article-299115/Contact-Daily-Mail-Mail-Sunday.html#ixzz1ny3f90J5

Editorial Daily Mail
News and features - 020 7938 6000 or [email protected].

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Tillyscoutmum is in the same line of business as me - so I'm sure if you PM her she'll be able to help. (I am a retail surveyor, but in my previous (pre-SAHM) existence only worked for tenants because I hated being a landlord surveyor and putting the rent up. Coupled with high business rates it's crippling the high street.)

However, as HappyCamel says, much of the commercial property in this country, particularly in shopping centres, is owned by large pension funds and so they need to secure market rents in order to support their pensioners.

Tilly, I believe they have a licence to occupy that is up for renewal on the 7th April.

The only things from within the shop that MTC can take with them are anything that is plugged in or on the shelves. Everything else comes with the unit.

The other units within the centre are not set up for a coffee shop so would need everything installing. There is a huge shop in the middle of the centre that was a coffee & cake shop, but when they emptied it they caused a right mess and that will cost mega bucks to repair on top of fitting it out.

Whilst I sympathise with the cafe owner's position, it is a commercial operation and so are the landlords. Commercial operations exist to make money and the landlord's agents are simply seeking to maximise their profit for the benefit of shareholders.

To turn the question on it's head, why should the landlord take less rent than they could. What would be the explanation to their shareholders?

Having said that, I don't quite understand why a landlord would force out an existing tenant if they have several other units vacant. That seems very odd. Something does not add up here.

Unless - in spite of the claim that they have another tenant ready and willing this is just a negotiating ploy to push up the claim or the landlord has redevopment of the site in mind. Or it could be that the cafe owners are not in fact good tenants in spite of the blog's claim.

HappyCamel - £40K to relocate is about right, having recently opened a new High St premises I know from experience the costs mount up quickly. By the time you do some building work, get a commercial electrician in, maybe a new shop front, signage, F&F, legals, plus factor in the time the business is not operating etc, you could easily hit this figure, plus some more. I've spent easily in excess of £60K and that was doing it on a shoestring.

Thank you for all of your comments. We are aware that there are two sides to every story and that landlords are just protecting their investment. We just want them to be aware that whilst they think they are doing the 'right' thing they are in fact completely ripping apart someones lives.

As a business owner myself i know that tough decisions need to be made every now and again, but this decision doesn't seem to have been thought through.

We had a great turn out yesterday in the shopping centre and got about 500 signatures on our petition and got the local press down to get photos and write an article.

If any of you lovely people would like to try and help us then we have created an online petition Save More Than Coffee

Thank you again x

But is the coffee shop actually doing a good trade?

Yes thank you lilacwaltz.

Do you know what it is that makes the other offer better on paper?

There must be more to this. Is the shop on a particularly busy part of the shopping centre and therefore worthy of a higher rent than the other empty shops?

They are a business and I don't see why they shouldn't make as much profit as they can, they arent in existence to support families, it's just very sad that this is happening to that family.

All o can are is that your coffee shop is opposite another coffee shop chain.... Could that be it?

*all I can see!!

The shop is in a prime location within the centre. We already have a well established Costa in the centre and Starbucks just across the road on the high street.

MTC is always busy, they pay their rent on the agreed date each month. The down side is that they have prime location and therefore the unit could reach a higher rental.

This isn't really about the landlords wanting to get more rent its more about the sneaky under hand way that they have gone about it.

They need to find a chartered surveyor to represent them, they will do a valuation on the rent and negotiate with the landlord's agent.

This happened to us a few years ago. They tried to tripple our rent. I refused decided to buy a property instead and the business that went into our old premises only stayed their 6 months.
Can they not buy a place prices are at an all time low?