to say no to more extra maths - and ask if the school are getting extra funding per student they do this with?

[cuddlymanatee]

DS (10), attends a good state primary school in a deprived area which is bordered by other deprived areas. I need to say now too that we are moving abroad this Summer.

He is good at maths - a little above average if taken nationally but a lot above the average of the kids in his year. Many of them have english as a second language, are new to the UK system etc so that's not surprising.

The LEA organises some extension activities for maths. We have enthusiastically embraced them and DS was delighted to be included in the extra-curricular programme (organised by the LEA and attended by children from all the state primaries in the area).

There have also been 'maths masterclass' days at a local secondary school which he also misses usual schooldays for along with a few children from each primary in the area.

There is also daily extra maths at school, which takes precedence over other lessons. It clashed with the guitar lessons we had paid for and we had to point out why this was a problem for us before the guitar lessons were rescheduled (they are group lessons so DS was moved into a different group with children who were learning guitar at a different level - he is now wanting to stop guitar lessons as they are so far ahead and he is struggling).

DS misses PE, too, which bothers me as he is a little overweight (we are dealing with this ourselves and making progress). But no big deal - he does karate after school. Though he used to do two sessions a week and one now clashes with the maths extension activity.

He also does football club after school which is a big deal because before year 5 he refused to participate in team sports at all. Increasingly, not being able to join in breaktime kickabouts became a social issue and he felt very isolated, especially as being a 'swot' and unsporty gave other children teasing fodder. So he took the very mature and brave (IMO), decision to join football club to learn the basics of the game and how to play etc.

Predictably he was hassled a lot by the other children in the club for being 'rubbish' and 'ruining their games'. But he tried really hard and the past couple of weeks has come home saying he's been praised for his improvement by the other children and is able to participate properly. He struggles socially and physically so this is so brilliant, so far as I'm concerned.

However, he brought home a letter on Friday saying there were two more maths extension events coming up, these to be after-school which would mean him missing football club for three weeks running. It also requires him to be picked up from the secondary school (a fair way away), which would mean DD missed her guide group as she'd have to come with me.

The letter makes no mention of an option to refuse, though. There is a box for 'I confirm my child will attend and be collected at X time from X place'. No option to say no.

DS wants to not go. As my personal concern is for his social rather than mathmatical development (I truly feel he does enough maths, plus we are moving soon), I'd rather he attended football club. Which by the way we have also paid for.

AIBU to tell the school he won't be attending? Do they get extra funding for this maths stuff and is that why it's taking priority over everything?

I think you would be right to tell them he won't be attending, it appears odd to focus him so much on maths which he finds easy to the detriment of skills which he doesn't.

What does he want though? As you've not said what he wants.

Right now I'd say ensuring he enjoys exercise is a lot more important than yet another maths class.

YANBU to not give permission for your son in the circumstances. But I think YABU to assume it's for extra money as though the head would get a bonus for it, extra funds would just mean extra funds to I prove education, not some kind of profit for the school.

It sounds from your description like the school as a whole needs more of a focus on maths to give the majority of the pupils the skills they'll need to succeed and they school is going about implementing their plan in a one size fits all maner. Somewhat understandable given resources, but not good for your son, and so not unreasonable for you to kick up a fuss if necessary.

Fred, I did mention at the end that he doesn't want to go. He does seem to be losing enthusiasm for maths a bit which is unfortunate as he is very able in that subject.

Such I wasn't implying anything money-grabbing, of course the school wants to benefit all its students. It's very proud of being the best primary in the area and I was wondering if having X children doing Y extra maths gave them some extra cachet or funding opportunities from the LEA.

The problem is though, there is literally no option to refuse permission on the slip - shall I send it in with a note saying he won't be attending, or not send it in at all?

Get it in writing that he won't be going - if you just don't send it you might find he's been whisked away regardless had this once when the school did something to my son against my express wishes, long story, yes am bitter - if he's not participating you need to make it crystal clear and leave them no wiggle room to do it anyway and blame "whoever" or do the "oh we couldn't find it and we asked if he'd given it to you and he said yes so we just thought...." type things.

There must be a permission slip. They can't take the kids off the premises without a signed permission slip. Did you sign one at the beginning of the year giving blanket permission for them to transport him to the secondary school for the masterclasses? If so, write a letter to the school, say he can't attend the activity on that occasion due to other family commitments after school on that day.

I think it's good that they are trying to extend him in his maths but they seem to have lost the sense of balance. He shouldn't be missing PE and he should get to do a range of activities for fun. All that maths overkill might make him end up hating the subject.

Sorry cuddly I missed the comment, absolutely then he should be playing football, I can't think of a single reason to do the extra maths class.

Also if he is being given work appropriate to his ability during the five hours a week of normal maths lessons, I'm not sure why they would need to do so much extra. Another whole hour of maths every day? Even if I liked maths I wouldn't want to do two hours a day of it.

Kat there is sort of a permission slip - it's more of a letter saying he's going to go and needs to be collected at X time from Y place and a box to tick that says 'I confirm my child will be attending' - no option on the slip to say no iyswim!

Fred it didn't make sense to me either really, hence wondering if there was something tangible 'in it' for the school. it's just now (year 5), all these extra maths things are happening, we've been arguing for more challenging work for DS for years but it seems all the extension work is for years 5 and 6.

I think it is great that they are stretching him in maths, but it seems bizarre that it should be to the detriment of all other activities.

Sport and music are really important for a whole host of reasons, not least the social aspect of it which you've highlighted as being a problem for your son.

I would be inclined to actually speak to someone about it so that there can be no confusion on the day.

Well then you don't tick the box and write a brief note on the bottom of the slip saying sorry he can't go. That is a very cheeky sort of permission slip as it just assumes you will say yes.

At the end of the day it's entirely up to you. They can't take him without your permission. If he doesn't want to go then you are perfectly within your rights to not make him.

Just write on the letter that your child will NOT be able to attend and will be picked up by you as usual from the schools premises. Send it back and keep a copy.

Your son has multiple needs, his maths ones are being met, his others aren't

YANBU, just send the form back with a note on it saying you don't wish him to attend as it clashes with his other extra curricular activities (if you feel like giving them that much information). Just because he's good at it doesn't mean he should sacrifice everything else to it, apart from the obvious points about PE and music being important, too much maths might put him off the subject eventually.

Sorry cuddly I misread the tone in your post. I would write a note on the permission slip, but also ask to be informed of what the alternative arrangements will be for him, or call and speak to someone, so you can be sure they have read it and not just collected them all in and filed them sight unseen.