To think I could be an actuary one day?

[deepbreathandgo]

So... I pretty much f*cked up my education (totally my fault) and ended up doing a job that I love and enjoy every day but it's just not what I really want to do. I've been thinking about going back studying, but somehow it was never the right time, I didn't know what to study, excuses, excuses...

A few months ago I came across a thread where somebody mentioned actuaries - English not being my first language I had to google it and I just felt it sounds like my dream job. I thought it'll pass, but I kept thinking about it, looking it up and I'm more and more into it.

I know it's extremely hard work to qualify especially that I'd have to start at the very beginning, with a BSc (I'm thinking Maths at Birkbeck as I'll have to work too to support myself and also I think it's too late for the 2012 entry anywhere else) which would take 4 years and then I could actually start studying for the actuarial qualifications.

But I'm panicking a bit worried that I'm way too old now? I'm 32 so I'd be 36 when I could actually register as an actuarial student and, and, and I don't know what to do. Really it's my age that's making me think I'm being ridiculous but I also think if I don't start studying now I'll never do - and I don't want to look back at my life later and wish I'd tried.

So I'd love to hear your opinions - I'm afraid it's more a wwyd than an aibu, but hope it's ok. I really need either some support or a big slap to wake up...

(and I have namechanged, not that I post sooo much, but still :D)

DH advocates a good mix of economics and statistics and a good university for your degree. It's a very traditional profession and a "new" university probably won't cut it with an employer. Get as many exemptions as you can.

He has also worked with female students in their 40s who are still doing exams so it's not impossible.

I did a fair bit of statistics in my degree and have thought about doing the exams myself at times. His work is really interesting.

I'm an actuary and have been involved in recruitment. I don't think it's an impossible idea for you to be an actuary but I do think it will be hard. I don't think your age will be a problem - we've taken on older people - they often blow the 21 year olds out of the water on recruitment days.

The problem is that if you do a degree you are investing years before you ever get near a financial model which could be a huge waste if it doesn't work out. Also you mentioned Birbeck? college which I have not really heard of. Which may mean it isn't on our list of "universities we recruit from".

Finally your timing is not great. Right now, because of Solvency 2 there is a huge shortage of actuaries so we are recruiting like mad. But 4 / 5 years from now S2 will hopefully be over and there may be a bit of a glut.

Do you have A-level maths? One option is to see if you can find a non sponsored job in a company and just start taking the exams? Once you've passed a few you may be able to get sponsored that way.

deepbreathandgo I'm not an actuary - my closest call is that I have a ds (going to university this October all being well) who wants to be one, but I think you are in a difficult position.

Firstly, it's obviously an idea that is niggling at you and won't go away which suggests you maybe should try it, but it's a long and risky path with no guarantee of success and you would have to give up a job which as you say you love and are good at. You might end up in a worse position. Is it worth considering what else you might do with a maths degree if the actuary thing didn't work out that might be less risky? Then if those alternatives also appealed and were jobs you could see yourself in then you could go ahead in the knowledge that if you were unable to find an actuary trainee post or were unable to cope with the exams there would be a good alternative for you that you could imagine yourself enjoying.

I too have heard of these 'lists of universities that companies recruit from' and although I've never seen such a list also wonder if Birkbeck would feature. On the other hand maybe different rules apply to mature students, but you should definitely try to find out.

Perhaps MummytoKatie or one of the other actuaries on this thread could tell us more - is it a question of needing a degree from on of the universities on the list or is there a heirarchy? Can you tell us what universities are on the list and what the ranking is if any? I'm also interested in the solvency 2 thing (what is it)? Presumably they will still be recruiting some actuaries when it's finished, just not as many?

It's very interesting what you say about the timing MummytoKatie and you and Helenagrace are right about Birkbeck too - it's not one of the top universities at all. But it's supposed be a good one and pretty much the only one I can start this September. I do have A level maths (well an eastern-european equivalent) I'm just worried that it's been so long since I used my brain I probably forgot a lot. Also I've never did maths in English (actually I was even thinking doing an A-level course or similar just for the vocabulary).

What do you think about foreign degrees? I could return to my home country for a few years and do a bachelors degree there (it'd be much cheaper too)?

Or my other idea was a masters in actuarial science once I have a Bsc, but that would take at least an extra 2 years. It'd give me quite a few exemptions too.

gelatinous I was thinking about exactly the same, if I did the maths degree and couldn't find an actuary trainee post what could I do with it? I have no answers yet, but I still think I would be in a better position. Is there a 'hey if you have a maths degree you can do all these' list somewhere??

Thank you all for taking the time and effort to help me, thanks, thanks!

My DH is an actuary and involved in recruitment. He said that he thought your biggest challenge would be pursuading the companies that you apply to that you understand the intensity of the qualification requirements, and that you really would be committed to finishing them all. Once you managed that, then there would be no reason not to hire you compared with younger candidates.

He really enjoys his job, and it is well-paid, but the years when he was studying for his exams were very tough indeed!

On the Birkbeck thing - actually, it is a very good university, and consistently rated very highly for both teaching and research. It does not appear on rankings lists because the majority of its students are part-time and these rankings relate to the full-time experience. However, DH says that if an applicant had a good maths degree from there, he would be convinced by their academic achievement.

HTH

For us at least there is a list of suitable universities and you are either in or out. Although I work for a big company so we have over over 100 applicants for the grad scheme each year so initial sifting is done by a recruitment company.

I suspect the list varies between companies - I can think of at least one where the rumour is that they only take Oxbridge. I think we take all the Russell Group plus a few others - pretty sure I can remember graduates from Durham, Lancaster, York and City.

Not sure about foreign degrees. We do have a reasonable number of non-British but I don't know how the universities are rated.

With Solvency 2 (big legislation change due in 2014) there is currently a huge shortage of qualified actuaries. you can't magic qualifieds out of thin air so we are taking on the next best thing - trainees. When S2 is over I guess there will be an over supply of those with a few years years experience. So there will still be jobs for new grads but less as most firms prefer to stop recruiting rather than make redundancies.

Other careers I considered were accountancy, logistics, teaching, civil service / treasury. Do any of those appeal?

I was involved in recruitment in my old job. It was a much smaller firm than MummytoKatie's (took on approx 5 graduates per year). The HR department was responsible for going through the initial CVs and deciding who to interview, so I'm not 100% sure how this part of the selection process worked, but AFAIK there was not a specific list / hierarchy / ranking of acceptable universities. However, obviously some universities have a great reputation (for maths or in general) and a first or 2:1 from them would look impressive on a CV. Where is your DS hoping to go, gelatinous?

I'd hope that there would also be some allowance for personal circumstances. Although Birkbeck is not a common choice for actuarial students, it's clear that the OP has good reasons for choosing it (ie the part time aspect). Also, completing a degree while working would be excellent evidence that you could cope with studying for the actuarial exams while working - you should point this out at interview, OP.

I think it would be much harder to gain entry with a foreign degree. We had quite a few foreign applicants, but they had all studied in the UK (usually London).

My company would not have interviewed a candidate with a 2:2 or below.

I agree there will be less of a shortage of actuarial trainees when companies have finished implementing Solvency 2, but I don't think this should put you off it as a career. I'd say there is currently a desperate need and this will reduce to a more normal need.

I have also been involved in recruitment in a couple of companies and there was never a list of preferred universities. We also wouldn't have interviews anyone with anything less than a 2:1 as we had many impressive CVs to pick from.

I agree that working and studying part time will show you can combine the two as long as you get the grades.

mumofthree he's hoping to get the grades for Oxford, but is slightly tempted by Southampton as they offer a scholarship which will pay all his tuition fees and he could graduate debt free (if he had a holiday job). I wonder how much difference in employability there is between the two? Both are straight maths but he could switch to maths with actuarial science at Southampton and get lots of exemptions.

Birkbeck is part of London University (along with Imperial, UCL, KCL, Royal Holloway etc), and we are happy to recruit BBK students.

OP, if you do go that route, you can easily spin having done a degree at Birkbeck into a massive plus as it shows you can time-manage, are dedicated etc. And being a London Uni student could help if you wanted to do the Imperial MSc.

Gelatinous - as an aside it seems a real shame that a lad like your ds is considering not taking up his Oxford place because of tuition fees - reminds me why I have always been against them.

Both Oxford and Soton are universities that we would accept. Would it make a huge difference - probably not but it may a little. And some of the consultancies are more Oxbridge focused. (I work for a life company.) I have worked for the same company for years and have just moved departments. When my new boss told me why he had given me the job (rather than another more obvious candidate) he mentioned my degree (I did maths at Cambridge) so it looks like it still helps a little.

But whether these things are worth 40k worth of tuition fees I really don't know.

And just to make life really complicated as the others have said he must get a 2.1 or no-one will look at him. It is probably easier to get a 2.1 from Soton.

The 2:1 is a must. DH has a 2:2 in maths from Bristol and, even though he's been a qualified actuary for 14 years and has outstanding experience, there's still at least one big company who won't interview him because of his degree.

A scholarship offer must be a huge temptation. I don't envy him having to decide between that and Oxford.

Hi all, this is a really interesting thread, I've read it all this morning.

My situation is not dissimilar to the OPs: I'm knocking on 40 and looking for a career change, having spent 15 years in IT off the back of an Engineering Degree (which was sadly only a 2:2, curse the stupidity of youth!) but I am a Chartered Engineer. For the last 10 years I've been contracting, which has allowed for regular breaks to spend time at home and have juggled parenthood with my DP who mostly works from home.

But I'm bored with IT now and am looking for something new. It seems to me if I'm going to retrain, getting a well paid job in an area I have some interest and abilities in is a good idea, hence actuarial work came up.

Realising I have no financial experience, and a poor degree, I'm thinking of taking 6-12 months off to do as many of the exams as I can. I reckon 4 exams per 6 month session should be doable, so will have 8 of 12 exams complete in a year's time. I'm hoping that show of dedication, plus my Chartered Engineer status, plus 15 years general business and consulting experience, will be enough to persuade a company to take me on.

What do you think, is that reasonable or do you think it unlikely? Do you think that's a good approach or is there a better one?

Many thanks for your time.