to be appalled at this hospital's treatment of FIL?

[thisisdisgraceful]

NC'd because this is quite detailed and could out me, but I'm a MN regular.

FIL started having unexplained seizures towards the end of last week and was taken to hospital. They've done an X-ray and an MRI, both of which were inconclusive. Yesterday DP and I learned that they've sent him home from the hospital, untreated and without a diagnosis or any follow-up treatment plan because the neurologist is on holiday.

They've given MIL a number to ring, to make her own appointment with the neurologist. She's rung it hundreds of times and no-one ever picks up.

Meanwhile they've given him anti-convulsives suitable for treating epilepsy, despite not being diagnosed with epilepsy. DP has seen epileptic fits, and seen his dad's seizures, and says they don't look anything alike - his dad's seizures look more like a stroke (which he's also seen). FIL is still having seizures - sometimes several a day - at home, where there's only MIL to care for him (she's recovering from an operation herself). DP is desperately worried that without oxygen or proper trained care on hand he could end up oxygen-deprived, have a heart attack, fall down the stairs or something. Basically that they've just abandoned him and these seizures could finish him off.

It's like they've just washed their hands of him and sent him home to die. He's 65. AIBU to be shocked and appalled and furious?

Please if anyone has experience of getting proper care from the NHS, we'd welcome your advice.

If younthink he's have strokes, or mini-strokes (TIAs), then he needs to be seen urgently by the stroke team.

Was he onlynseen in A&E or in an acute medical unit. They tend to be crap.

Get thee to your GP, and insist on a same day referral to the stroke team. They're usually part of neurology anywY, so if it's something else then he's in the right place..

I agree with Highlander. An emergency appointment with GP, home visit if necessary (sounds likely), and insist on the Stroke Team referral today.

Great advice from Highlander. Nothing to add except for the fact that you will have to take a holiday from being nice and decent and get really really tough. Do not take no for an answer and get given the brush off. There cannot possibly be only one neurologist in the whole of your area. Demand to see another one. You are right - it is an utter disgrace to treat a 65 yr old man like this. Your FIL is lucky to have such a lovely and concerned dil as you - time to go into battle on his behalf.

We're not sure it's a stroke. He was kept in for a few days, on a high-dependency ward, and the scan showed up some kind of lesion on his brain. One possibility is that he hit his head at some previous point and there is scarring on the brain, which is pressing down on the brain and causing seizures. DP says that when he has a seizure the whole LHS of his face and body goes slack and sort of blue-ish. It's incredibly distressing for everyone - MIL is getting no sleep as she's constantly watching him and is desperately worried because she isn't strong enough to lift him if he falls over during a seizure. And of course the poor man is terrified.

I agree that it's completely mad to claim that there's only one consultant in the entire PCT who could see him and to tell them to eff off until he comes back from holiday. DP and I live about 300 miles away, which makes it difficult to make a sustained campaign on his behalf, though DP is heading up there this afternoon to do what he can to help. I'll pass on to DP the suggestion about insisting on an emergency GP appointment and stroke team referral.

I would be wary of insisting on referrals to stroke teams unless your dh is a medical professional and has had access to your FILs medical notes. You can't make a diagnosis because of what a fit looks like in comparison to others you have seen.

Contact PALS for the area that your FIL was in hospital, and tell them everything. In my experience that have been excellent, and hospital staff pay a lot more attention to the same questions being asked on your behalf by PALS than they do to you asking questions directly yourself. You will be able to find the number you need to phone on the Internet.

YANBU. The NHS is letting you down. Could you afford an appointment with a private GP, possibly with referral to a private consultant?

The worst thing is that I think they're being fobbed off because they're elderly and working-class, and don't have the ingrained culture of 'I deserve better than this'.

Damn right we'll be going into battle for them

Agree you need to get tough (sadly). Contact the GP and explain your concerns and also contact PALS at the hospital and state that you WILL make a formal complaint if you are not contacted and given a satisfactory explanation of the reasons for discharge and a plan for onward care. I had to do this when my DSis was being severely mucked about and I was called back by the Chief Execs office within a couple of hours. Makes me so mad but unless you are vigilant and keep on the case, poor and in my DSis case unsafe practice and treatment seems the norm these days .

KitchenRoll - many thanks for the PALS suggestion, I will pass that on too.

Popcorn - yes, we'll be paying for a private consultant if necessary.

Your FILs care sounds less than ideal & what a horribly stressful time for you & your family.

Anti convulsants (also known as anti epileptics) are used to treat fits caused by lots of different causes, not just epilepsy. If he has has multiple fits these drugs sound very appropriate in the short term. They are a holding measure until things are addressed further.

Fits are an unusual way for a stroke to present.

I would personally not bother with PALS. Do you know the consultants name? If so ring the hospital switch & ask to be put through to their secretary (or even their mobile) If you don't know the name ask switch to put you through to the neurology secretaries. If this fails try the medical directors secretary. I also agree getting GP on side would be helpful.

It will being easier if your FIL is happy to consent to you discussing his medical details with the hospital/GP. Otherwise they will be able to discuss very little with you to prevent breaching his confidentiality.

Best wishes & let us know how you get on.

Sadly I think you're right about being elderly and working class. The gobby middle classes get much better healthcare IMO, and it's probably a huge factor in their improved life expectancy and healthcare outcomes.

toobreathless Thanks for the tip re consent. Do you know if it needs to be written consent? Is there any kind of format, or just a bit of paper with 'I consent to [name, name, name] discussing my medical details with hospital/GP' kind of thing? Or will verbal consent be accepted?

Have you got the name of the neurologist? If so ring hospital main switchboard and ask to speak to Mr X's secretary. Failing that google for neurologists at the hospital - it should bring up a list, then ring and ask to speak to the consultants' individual secretarys one by one till you get an answer from one.

In the mean time definetly get him seen by GP.

Don't bother with PALS, go straight to the CEO and look up Director of medicine. Email or write to them direct. Has a very swift effect.

If you can go to a GP appt with your FIL & he can give consent then the GP should be able to make a note on his file & have further discussions with you as & when needed. Written consent is usually not required.

Again he should be able consent over the phone for you to talk to the secretary or consultant although I very much doubt either will want to enter into a detailed medical discussion over the phone.

It sounds like he needs a very urgent appt with the neurologist. The response of the consultant being away is not good enough. Can another neurologist see FIL? Or the registrar? If they say the clinic is full, can he been seen on the assessment or day unit? Most hospitals have one of these.

Another thought:

Is it a small district general hospital? If so it may be a 'visiting consultant' coming over one day a week or so from a specialist centre. Not all hospitals have neurology departments. You may get an appointment by offering to travel to the larger 'base hospital.'

toobreathless The hospital is Fazackerley in Merseyside...a quick look down their website suggests they don't have a neurology department so you may be right.

Thanks again everyone for all your advice and suggestions. I'm collating them for DP, who is on his way to Merseyside at lunchtime to go into battle for poor FIL.

I'm almost certain your specialist centre is The Walton. They are absolutely excellent & I would be happy for a relative of mine to be seen there.

The neurology secretaries are probably based there rather than at Fazakerley (sp?)

HTh

Really, really does help toobreathless Thank you so much. Will pass this on.

Walton neurology is RIGHT next door to fazakerly hospital as far as I can remember?

I was transferred there from Ormskirk when I had a stroke caused my eclamptic fit after giving birth. I was in the centre for 10 days.

So unless its moved recently :( Your poor FIL

When my hubby was in hospital because they had found a lesion on his brain (nobody wanted to tell us anyone although they knew exactly what was happening as they were in contact with the neurosurgeons at the university hospital) one day totally fed up I hunted down his consultants medical secretary and explained not only would we be going private but to PALS and possibly the press on our merry way. He then turned up to chat to us a few hours later (they told me he was not in the building that day)
Kicking up a fuss is the only way tbh

Agree with above, Walton centre is where neurology in this region is based- lots of consultants- is ridiculous that he can only be seen by the one on holiday-

if he within this region there is a neurology hotline at the Walton centre that can be accessed by gp's- cannot recall the number, but switchboard will known it- is manned by a consultant/ senior neurologist during day - certain hours think over lunch- I have rung it and received instant advice and appt for patient within the week. Is worth seeing if GP thinks this is ness.

Thank you to everyone from me and DP both for your help and suggestions. I've forwarded them to DP who is on his way to Merseyside now.

Fingers crossed I'll be able to post a positive update in due course

It is possible he is being referred to The Walton Centre (neurology hosp directly next door to Fazackerly). Most consultants there do not have their own secretary anymore ie. there are a group of secretaries for the epilepsy patients, ergo there should be someone answering the phone. The main number is 0151 525 3611. Has your MIL been given the name of a consultant or just a phone no? Terrible situation.

Oops x post Hatescolds.