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Original poster

... in thinking Neil Kinnock was clairvoyant?

95 replies

woollyideas · 18/02/2012 13:19

It took a few decades and two Tory governments and a Tory-lite New Labour government but Neil definitely could see into the future. This is what he said in June 1983:

If Margaret Thatcher is re-elected as prime minister on Thursday, I warn you.
I warn you that you will have pain?when healing and relief depend upon payment.
I warn you that you will have ignorance?when talents are untended and wits are wasted, when learning is a privilege and not a right.
I warn you that you will have poverty?when pensions slip and benefits are whittled away by a government that won?t pay in an economy that can?t pay.
I warn you that you will be cold?when fuel charges are used as a tax system that the rich don?t notice and the poor can?t afford.
I warn you that you must not expect work?when many cannot spend, more will not be able to earn. When they don?t earn, they don?t spend. When they don?t spend, work dies.
I warn you not to go into the streets alone after dark or into the streets in large crowds of protest in the light.
I warn you that you will be quiet?when the curfew of fear and the gibbet of unemployment make you obedient.
I warn you that you will have defence of a sort?with a risk and at a price that passes all understanding.
I warn you that you will be home-bound?when fares and transport bills kill leisure and lock you up.
I warn you that you will borrow less?when credit, loans, mortgages and easy payments are refused to people on your melting income.
If Margaret Thatcher wins on Thursday?

  • I warn you not to be ordinary
  • I warn you not to be young
  • I warn you not to fall ill
  • I warn you not to get old.
OP posts:
Original poster
woollyideas · 18/02/2012 14:20

If we're talking about the 1970s: didn't Heath do a grand job, what with the three day week and all? Yeah, he was Labour wasn't he? Oh no, hang on a minute...

OP posts:
AnxiousPanxious · 18/02/2012 15:44

It isn't the 1970s now. We need something from Labour and a good rousing speech would be a fine start.
Unlikely to happen atm.

whirlingbetsy · 18/02/2012 15:50

For me, the only good thing about the Tories getting back in is the momentum it has given to the Independence issue in Scotland. I was a Unionist until all this kicked off but now think Independence is only right for us. I love England, I have many English relatives and friends and I am heartbroken at what this bunch are doing to your nhs and education system. Now, more than ever I am glad to have been born North of the border.

fullofregrets · 18/02/2012 15:51

Not a fan of kinnock. Always seemed exceptionally full of himself.

Original poster
woollyideas · 18/02/2012 16:06

Not like Shiney Dave and Gideon then, fullof?

OP posts:
fullofregrets · 18/02/2012 16:13

Not a fan of any of them really!

fullofregrets · 18/02/2012 16:14

Kinnock just in particular annoys me. Not sure why really, I just don't like him much.

sue52 · 18/02/2012 17:07

Cameron scares the shit out of me as did Thatcher. Neil Kinnock was an inspirational speaker, it was a shame so many people did not take the time to listen to the man and heed the message.

eurochick · 18/02/2012 17:15

It was a good speech, no doubt written by committee. However, I think Britain now is a better place and most of us have a higher standard of living than when old Labour was last in power and many of today's problems are rooted in the new Labour period.

And in general I think Kinnock is a twat.

alistron1 · 18/02/2012 17:22

The seeds of todays problems were sown by the tories ( privatising utilities etc) and tended by new labour. And now the coalition are picking the fruits and implementing tory ideology.

That is a fantastic speech, and he was right. As a child of thatchers britain I remember the under resourced schools, high interest rates, sitting in classrooms with leaky ceilings, hospital waiting times, mass unemployment etc... Under the tories this time round I fear that (a) things will be much worse and (b) due to the global economic climate that there will be no boom coming along to ease the pain...

TheMonster · 18/02/2012 17:28

If only people had listened. However, no point looking backwards.

WetAugust · 18/02/2012 17:30

If NK was a clairvoyant he didn't forsee the collapse of the Euro - a currency that he was (and still is ) committed to.

Failed politician in the UK who jumped aboard the EU gravy train.

alistron1 · 18/02/2012 17:40

To be fair, if it wasn't for the global financial crisis then the euro wouldn't be facing collapse. However tory ideology transcends such issues and even if the world wasn't up shit creek, gideon and dave would still be dismantling the welfare state.

Petrean · 18/02/2012 17:43

Haha.. I can't believe you are implying that had we listened to Neil Kinnock that we wouldn't be in the situation we are in today. Very amusing.

bringbacksideburns · 18/02/2012 17:45

And now look what we have. A cabinet full of Eton Toffs who tell us we are all in this together.

Too right about being ordinary.

alistron1 · 18/02/2012 17:49

If Neil Kinnock hadn't fallen over on that beach he would still be PM, we'd all have our own 6 bedroomed council house each and would be working a 2 day week. FFS Neil, why did you do it man??!

Haziedoll · 18/02/2012 17:50

Very good speech. Can we not have him back?

Nibledbyducks · 18/02/2012 17:59

If only John Smith hadn't died :(

Proudnscary · 18/02/2012 20:45

Anxious - absolutely. I don't mean we should be complacent/accepting off the erosion of this amazing humanitarian project. But equally we shouldn't be complacent or entitled about the freedoms and safety nets we still have in the UK. The NHS/welfare state has been mismanaged and diminished and underfunded and we have to fight that with campaigns and with our votes in local and general elections. But we cannot lose sight of the amazing quality of life, tolerance and support we still have in this country.

HillyWallaby · 18/02/2012 20:52

I'm not really sure how we can be expected to think it is 'scarily relevant' or that he has clairvoyancy skills when he was talking about something that would happen if Thatcher got re-elected in 1982? Hmm That's thirty years of getting it fairly wrong before he got it a little bit right, so no prizes from me.

WetAugust · 18/02/2012 22:33

If Neil Kinnock hadn't fallen over on that beach he would still be PM
Wrong.

He blew it when he stood up at the Sheffield Rally and did his infantile 'Are we allright?' chorus.

He thought he had it in the bag and up to that point he probably did but his arrogance killed his chances that evening.

He totally misjudged it then and has been ever since.

Agree about John Smith. He would habe won for Labour.

runningforthebusinheels · 19/02/2012 00:16

I think many politicians of that era had their careers influenced negatively by Spitting Image. I was a great fan of it at the time, but David Steele claims it ruined his political career.

Neil Kinnock's falling over in the sea was immortalised by the opening titles - the giant pair of scissors cutting the puppet string and Neil K falling over - anyone else remember that far back?

HoneyandHaycorns · 19/02/2012 00:55

Neil Kinnock was crucified by the Tory press. His face didn't fit.

He wasn't perfect, but we could have done a whole lot worse.

Actually, we did do a whole lot worse. :(

runningforthebusinheels · 19/02/2012 01:57

I think this country would have been better for having a labour government in 92 and no Tony Blair New Labour.

I remember some (unbiased) political commentator saying that Blair had introduced/tried to introduce policies that Thatcher's ultra right wing gov could only dream of.

cbem · 19/02/2012 02:06

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