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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

...to think that tenants might hoover once in a while?

99 replies

silverten · 11/02/2012 19:41

OK, so if you rent a house it's your home, you have the right to live how you choose, etc. etc. etc...

However if you'd been given an immaculately clean house when you took on the tenancy, the landlord had pretty much left you alone for the duration of your tenancy, save a couple of phonecalls to check all was well and an inspection after a couple of years, you'd think that you might think to run the hoover around and give the place a quick wipe over before he visited again, giving you plenty of warning and a fairly mild request to try and clean the place up a bit from the last visit?

No? Just my little foible?

What IS it about some tenants that they are happy not to bother with this stuff?? I don't get it. It can't be a 'tenant' thing, surely- I know loads of people who didn't live in a tip when they rented.....

OP posts:
mousymouseafraidofdogs · 11/02/2012 20:24

yab very very u.
it is their home and as long as they are not breaking too much, beyond reasonable wear and tear you need to butt out. they are not your cleaners and it is not your home at the moment!

woollyideas · 11/02/2012 20:36

YABU. Everyone has different standards. Obviously your tenants' standards don't come up to yours. I'm sure you're still making a profit out of them.

MushroomMagee · 11/02/2012 20:38

To be honest, it really pisses me off when the agents say to tidy up before they come and inspect. And we are tidy! :o But why should I tidy up just for them to come and inspect?! Its my home as long as I pay the rent! And as long as it is left in the same state as I moved in as when I move out - who cares?! If there is damage more than fair wear and tear caused by my lack of cleaning then you would obviously take the cost of that out of my deposit.

If there is damage take it out of their deposit, job done!

raspberrytipple · 11/02/2012 20:51

I always used to look after our place and have a good clean but the landlord visits once a year, promises to get stuff fixed then don't see fuck all from him so this year I just made sure everything was tidy but not spotless. We asked if the kitchen could be painted, he said yes fine then 4 days later we got notice to quit. We complained to the letting agent who came to inspect and told the landlord he was being unreasonable. Notice to quit was withdrawn so said we could stay.

Anyway, we thought fuck him to be honest and have decided to leave, I hope the next tenants fail to pay the rent ever and trash the place. We've been here 10 years and have been very good tenants. My opinion of landlords is pitifully low, they are money grabbing muppets with an over inflated sense of their own importance because they are 'property owners'. YABU.

silverten · 11/02/2012 21:01

Yes we will probably have to take money out of the deposit, if they carry on in this vein. And they will probably feel aggrieved about it.

I don't expect the place to look like a showhome, that is unrealistic. They live with mountains of clutter everywhere- I haven't got a problem with that! Makes no difference to me, I don't have to live with it or look at it.

But bloody hell it's not as if I've been round there every month running my fingers over the surfaces! The only reason we do inspections is to give the tenants fair warning about stuff like this so they can do something about things like carpets that get knackered if you aren't basically careful, before the place gets into such a state that it is beyond redemption.

Maybe I should put the rent up to cover the cost of brand new carpets for every tenant??? Some people seem to think that stuff like that is disposable!

OP posts:
powderhound · 11/02/2012 21:04

YANBU but then it does betray you as an "amateur landlord" (my hunch anyway) - is this your old house that you kept and rented out? You always expect people to love it and care for it more or less as much as you did. We have been horrified by the state of our rental property in the past. If they can't be bothered to hoover, what must the bathroom/oven be like...
But you were never going to get a sympathetic hearing on here. Property/DIY perhaps better!

MoneyBunny · 11/02/2012 21:05

Oh, I thought inspections were to see if any maintenance was needed to be done by the ll.

evansthebread · 11/02/2012 21:12

A little tale that might help tenants see the other side of the coin and LL wake up a bit:

We rented to a woman who I thought was my friend (at considerably less than value) with the condition that she not have animals and keep it clean. A fortnight before she was due to move in she bought a kitten! Alarm bells should've gone off there and then but we let it go. The old house she lived in had been nice when she moved in but after 6 months, was black with mould. Alarm bells did go off but she said that the previous tenants had had a problem that the old LL had just cleaned up temporarily instead of fixing the damp.

I'd already told her that she needed a venting hose for her tumble dryer but she insisted it was a condenser (it wasn't) and also asked her not to dry clothes on rads as it's an old house and would be prone to damp (we'd lived in it for 12 years without a problem).

6 months into tenancy she rang me (I live next door) complaining the house was black and she was going to the doctor to get a letter so I could put her up in a hotel while it was being fixed. Alarm bells should've been going off when she no longer invited me for coffee, but always came into my house. DH went round and was shocked at state of place. He took photos with his phone at her clothes drying on the rads, so wet that they'd rotted the laminate underneath. He took a pic of her tumble dryer and we looked the model up - vented. He went round with a spare hose, connected it and asked her to put it out of the door/window when she uses it. We found the hose rotted in the shed (had obviously been there a long time) when she moved out.

Not long after, she bought a dog. Then she dog sat for her father's dog who had constant diarrhoea. We had to rip the destroyed laminate up as it stunk of shit and we could not let it again smelling like that. Asides the damage, how on earthg do people live like that.

During the last year she moved the boyfriend in. He has to be the stupidest man I've ever met. Had no interest in anything except playing his guitar (badly and loudly all hours) and playing computer games. He refused to pay anything to his 4 kids from 2 previous marriages, was still married when he moved in and asked her to marry him and have kids with him within a month. The film, 40 year-old virgin? He's obviously the 40 year-old child!

The shower started leaking but the 40 year-old child decided he had the DIY skills to fix it. We ended up having a plumber look at it (on Boxing Day - you don't want to know what THAT cost!) because they knocked on door freaked out that they couldn't use the shower (refused to use the separate bath while it was being fixed). Plumber told us that it had started a simple leak that 40 yr-old child had hacked into with God knows what, destroying shower tray, tiles and plaster in room underneath.

A few months later, 40 yr-old child/world's biggest idiot came home in his car which was making hell of a racket. I told him it sounded like the exhaust had gone but he insisted on dragging friend's father out to "fix the plug leads" (was not amused when I laughed). Father turns up 40 minutes later, listened for a nano-second and told him his exhaust had gone. I was still outside so I just mentioned that it was indeed the exhaust and he went nuts! Alarm bells well and truly going off now!

After that, every time I was in the garden and my friend wasn't around, he'd come out and get nasty with me. I rang her one morning and he picked up. I had a call at the same time from a techie-minded friend who was sharp enough to tape what he started saying to me (very abusive) while he was on other phone. I thought that was such a good idea I started carrying a small tape recorder when I was out in garden and have him being abusive another twice.

In the meantime, friend's brother has moved house and offered friend to move into old flat. Our relief was enormous as we'd decided that we were going to ask them to leave - we were dreading it. It's also worked out great for 40 yr-old child/world's biggest idiot/utter prick(!) as he now pays even less rent in HIS name with the rent book saying he's paying 2.5 times what 3-bed houses around here go for, not 2-bed flats - very convenient for him as he now pays a lot less to CSA (who finally caught up with him).

Despite our annoyance with her, we both actually feel sorry for her. She's clueless at the kind of bloke she's involved with (but we have a feeling she'll find out in a year or two).

Maybe Karma will teach her a lesson in humility - I was admittedly sucked off with the patronising "I've got a degree" shite she's forever spouting. I think my "degree" from the School of Hard Knocks has served me better than her psych one ever has/will. I'm more than happy to admit I learn something new every day (especially when it comes to choosing friends better in the future!), but she knows it all. She also no longer bothers with me - I will eventually send her the sound files, just so she can finally see what her partner is like. No point until the rose-tinted glasses come off, though. (Hmm, might forward them to our mutual friend, too!)

So, for all LL do your checks carefully and never let things slide and tenants, if you have a good LL who keeps your home in good nick and doesn't bother you very often, please don't take advantage. A lot of LL, like us, are "accidental" LL and for those of us still emotionally attached to our old properties, it's very hard to see them run into the ground.

issey6cats · 11/02/2012 21:18

im a tenant and despite hoovering my carpets every day, not wearing shoes indoors etc my lounge carpet after 18 months is starting to look not its best ,mainly because landlords put in mid to low priced carpets which are only designed to last a couple of years, one house i lived in was a brand new house with light beige carpets and it drove me up the wall i was on my hands and knees most of the time cleaning the ruddy thing because you only had to walk across it and every tiny mark showed, so landlords please put darker carpets in as they are easier for us tenants to keep clean

Ecgwynn · 11/02/2012 21:22

Can I also point out that landlords can be just as bad as tenants. A few years ago when we rented a flat, the oven broke in November. We repeatedly asked for it to be replaced. It took until GOOD FRIDAY to actually get us a new one. A lot of landlords only care about the rental income and cannot be bothered to do basic upkeep on their property.

ShagOBite · 11/02/2012 21:25

Have also had a horrenous (and some good) experience of being a LL. Not everyone has a shred of respect.

RevoltingPeasant · 11/02/2012 21:25

Erm what about LLs taking advantage of tenants, evans? It does happen, you know. Probably rather more than the other way round.

Renting from 'amateur' LLs is the worst. Our first flat together was the property of three siblings and it had been their dad's flat before he died. They were constantly 'just popping by' without notice on Saturday mornings to see about things - we could never just have a relaxing weekend morning. When we left they decided to sell the place and expected us to show people round!!

JerichoStarQuilt · 11/02/2012 21:31

RP - I agree completely. My old landlady was horrified when I objected to her turning up and letting herself in and really angry when I pointed out quietly it was actually the law she had to give me reasonable notice. I still remember her repeating in disbelief 'do you honestly mean to tell me you expect me to let you know every time I let myself into the house?!'

Nightmare.

evans, I know evicting tenants isn't easy but you were soft not to put your foot down about the kitten - not very fair to blame 'tenants' when you don't bother to enforce your own rules, is it?

nailak · 11/02/2012 21:35

Rented house get trashed because of the terrible quality fittings in them. Cheap poorly fitted carpets, cheap mismatched kitchen units, flooring and tiles not properly laid, wardrobes from a junk shop, ten yeast old cookery and washing machine etc.

suburbophobe · 11/02/2012 21:47

Surely it doesn't matter if they never hoover or polish while they are living there?

What's the bottom line, not taking the rubbish out?!

Well, if this was me while in my own home - whether owned or rented - I'd get a bit worried about my own hygiene standards.

Not that I polish - who gives a F* about that - but basic cleanliness, fridge, bathroom, loo, kitchen, bed, rubbish out....

Not exactly rocket science...

OP, they are taking the P*

alistron1 · 11/02/2012 21:55

We rent our house. We decorate it, maintain the gardens and have spent our own money improving it. We've lived here for 10 years and the LL have spent no money on the house -apart from replacing a VERY old boiler 8 years ago. We've painted throughout every 2 years or so, restored an original fireplace and uncovered/sanded/varnished some very nice wooden floors. The gaff is in better nick than when we moved in.

IBlameThatcher · 11/02/2012 21:57

I once visited friends who had been renting a house for over a year. While there, I spilled some red wine on the carpet Blush. I suggested covering it with salt and then hoovering it up. Oh we've never had a vacuum cleaner, said my friend. They had 2 dogs, 3 cats and didn't own a hoover. I never visited them again after that.

evansthebread · 11/02/2012 21:57

Issey - come and be our tenant! We've let the ones pick their own. Be over the moon if they just try to keep the place in a similar state that they've had it. We "live" in our own home and expect wear and tear. We only ask a little respect and some common sense.

RP - we're amateurs. Sad to say that we're just too nice, I suppose. I'm hoping we'll be a bit more "professional" with the next tenants. It's a shame, though, as we like to at least try to be good neighbours. Now we won't know if any "neighbourly" actions will be misconstrued as us being overbearing LLs.

Jericho - that's the problem with thinking you're being a friend and mixing business with pleasure.

silverten · 11/02/2012 22:02

OK then more details..

No, it isn't my old home. (It's my pension, FWIW.) I really don't care what people do in it as long as they don't wreck it. They have a problem with the place- I'll fix it. Otherwise they get left alone- no 'popping around' without notice! Stuff like the boiler breaking may mean a rent decrease if it is out of action for a significant period (this has happened; all the emergency plumbers in the world couldn't magic up the right bit to make the damn thing work in less than a fortnight.)

What qualifies you as a 'non-amateur' landlord? I've rented from some superb 'amateurs'- lovely people who really cared that their tenants were happy and safe (I try to be like them). I've known some absolute muppets of letting agents who are supposed to be the professionals. We used some once because we lived a long way away and felt it was unfair to our tenants not to have someone within a reasonable distance to call upon in case of problems. Said agents took the rent, took their cut, then passed it on- and did absolutely nothing else.

House has been rented for ten years or so, we've had a succession of tenants ranging from fine to totally squalid (current bunch are somewhere in the middle for what it's worth).

We've slowly but surely improved the house from 'basic' standard, to 'really quite nice'. Stuff like: new bathroom, easy care furnishings (eg, stone floors in the kitchen- easy to clean and really hard to damage), better furniture, better garden (was a total jungle when we first got it, is now low-maintenance but nice to look at), better storage, better heating and insulation, improved windows. Rent has been slightly increased in line with the improvements and is pitched at the point where it is very reasonable given the facilities and size of the house: essentially we could charge more, but we choose not to. (We don't expect our tenants to be pathetically grateful for this, by the way.)

I guess it is the combined experience of the last decade that leads me to be so cheesed off about this. Real effort has been put into arranging a house that people would actually want to live in and not have to work too hard to keep it nice (nice, NOT pristine!), repairs get done when necessary and the rent isn't ridiculous either. A bit of a warning that the level of wear-and-tear is reaching unacceptable levels and you'd think I'd proposed throwing my tenants naked into the snow, to listen to some people. I could get away with renting a mouldy shit-tip that is impossible to heat, (hundreds of landlords do in the place where my house is) but hey, that just isn't for me.

OP posts:
Tryharder · 11/02/2012 22:08

YANBU OP. Unfortunately, a lot of people have no respect for things they don't own and take perverse delight in spoiling things just because they can. How can they not hoover, ever? Skanks.

alistron1 · 11/02/2012 22:11

OP - I want you as my landlord!!

Serenitysutton · 11/02/2012 22:14

It's a difficult one; if they've damaged the place you can't do anything until they leave anyway, so not sure what the advantage of knowing is (serving them their notice I suppose?)

But a tenancy agreement means its their house. You can't tell people who to keep their home.

silverten · 11/02/2012 22:20

The general idea is to try and avoid the situation where damage gets done...

If they carry on neglecting the basics I'm afraid they will be given notice, cos I don't really want to do stuff like have to take thirty festering bin bags to the tip, or paint foot marks off the ceiling, again!

I'd much rather they just wised up a bit, ran the hoover round, and carried on living there without any more hassle though.

OP posts:
JerichoStarQuilt · 11/02/2012 22:20

evans - well, maybe. TBH I don't think it's in anyone's interests to try to be friends with your tenants. It puts both of you in a really awkward position.

IUseTooMuchKitchenRoll · 11/02/2012 22:29

YANBU at all. Don't feel bad about deducting money from their deposit, that's what it's there for. They have chosen not to keep the carpets well maintained, so they made a choice to risk losing their deposit.