To not understand why a Btec is considered equivalent to four gsces?

[Ouluckyduck]

It just seems totally senseless to me?

I have a BTEC and an A level (studied at the same time in the same subject area) and got into a very good university to study on a highly competitive course with them.

I would argue the BTEC was harder than the A level because it was vocational and covered all areas of the subject rather than the purely academic substance of the A Level. It also put me ahead of my peers in my first year at university in terms of ability and knowledge as the level required to gain a distinction far exceeded that of an A at A level in certain modules.

Hope that makes sense!

I know that I would never turn my nose up at a person who has a BTEC they're hard to earn!

Oh mine was a National Diploma if that makes any difference

Well, I work in a Sixth Form, so we get people coming in with these qualifications.

As far as we're concerned, a BTEC First, if it's a Distinction, counts as 2 GCSEs. If it's a Merit, we count it as one. If it's a Pass, we count it as a grade D GCSE.

Having said that, we only count them if they've got Maths, English and preferably a Science as well. If it's a BTEC Science, it's not enough to go on to study A level Science.

What gets me is that schools tells their pupils it's worth 4 GCSEs, so we get students who were not allowed to take GCSEs who come in saying they have 16 GCSEs, when actually they have passed in BTEC First in Media, PE, Catering and Dance. Their bloody teachers just won't tell them the truth.

I've taught BTEC Applied Science (a variety of exam boards) for 9 years now and I cannot understand it either! I'm not being a snob either - for some pupils a BTEC is brilliant if they don't cope well with exams and don't want to go onto to do A levels in science.

However, the idea that a not-that-bright but hardworking pupil can get the equivalent of 4 As is just wrong. Remember that triple science which the more able pupils take will only net a pupil 3 As, yet these pupils are the future doctors, engineers or biochemists. It just stinks. It annoyed me so much that my poor ex-MP regretted knocking at my door asking for my vote before the last general election as I spent about 10 minutes ranting at him about it. Sadly he got voted out so my rant was in vain.

Anther thing that annoys me about BTEC is the inconsistency. I think the syllabus before last for edexcel was written by a chemist and so they'd included ludicrously difficult biology knowledge for Pass level tasks (protein transcription and translation for a supposed C grade task? I wasn't teaching that to GCSE pupils until they got to AS level!).

It's made a real rod for the back for a lot of Science teachers. The science results from BTEC have propped up the A-C stats for a long time now and we are expected to get 4 of their 5 A-C results for pupils who won't get English or Maths and just couldn't give a toss about education. Imagine trying to get that sort of pupil focused on their work in a subject they hate. It's not fun.

I despise the Coalition government but I'm glad they're downgrading the importance of BTECS as you CAN get them with no real understanding of the subject - all you have to do is reword a paragraph from the internet and it's not fair on the pupils who have to learn the information, understand it and then apply it.

Oh and Imperial Blether the only way the 'bloody teachers' can get the pupils to do the immense amounts of coursework is to keep emphasising the GCSE equivalence!

I ALWAYS use the word 'equivalent' by the way.

Oh, and the marking workload is godawful.

There are many levels of BTEC.

Level 2, depending on whether it is 'certificate', 'Extended cartificate' or 'diploma' are worth the equivalent of 1,2,or 4 under the new specifications.

Pass = c, merit = B, and distinction =A, Distinction = A

However the points equivalency is being stripped out next year and no vocational qualification will be worth more than 1 GCSE and only a maximum of two will be counted towards the 5 A*-C tally.

if you are wonder how it can be "worth" 4 GCSEs - its to do with guided learning hours. So if it's a fairly full time course it with have more weighting.

discolite has hit the nail on the head. They are pretty much worthless in employer terms.

shine- Why are the less able students assigned BTECs to do while the more able ones do GCSEs? My DDs school do this to protect their excellent GCSE pass rate.

Many schools have used BTECS to improve statistics.
They are the reason many schools have gone from say 30% 5 a-c to 60-70% 5 a-c in only a few years.
Less able students have been encouraged to do BTECS as it is a sure way for them to get 4 'GCSE's in one go. They only have to get one more and they have reached the magic 5 a-c.
When statistics stop using BTECs to pad out results, there will be a big drop in % 5 a-c for some schools.

Exactly trois, a BTEC at level 2 CAN be 'worth' 4 GCSEs, depending which programme of study the kids follow.

Personally I don't think it's worth very much, but there's no question of teachers "lying".

trois - "the points equivalency is being stripped out next year and no vocational qualification will be worth more than 1 GCSE and only a maximum of two will be counted towards the 5 A*-C tally" is not actually correct.

the exam boards are still offering the qualification at different levels of equivalent in the new spec (i.e. award = 1 GCSE, Certificate = 2 GCSE, Extended Certificate = 3 GCSE and Diploma = 4 GCSE). The change is in regards to the headline figures, i.e. schools can only claim a vocational as being 1 GCSE no matter which qualification they undertake. So if a student passes the new Diploma, although guided learning hours are the same as 4 GCSEs the school can only use it as 1 GCSE in their figures; and only 2 vocational qualifications per student. this means for a student to have 5 A*-C GCSEs they can have 2 vocational subjects, but they also need 3 GCSEs

This change will mean that very few schools will offer any BTECs larger than the Award as there is no point devoting the timetable to something that they can not use in the league tables.