AIBU to think 'early scans' are not such a great idea?

[Rachtoteach]

Everybody seems to want an early scan and I can understand the need/desire to see your baby on screen for the first time BUT I have heard so many stories of things going wrong (myself included x 2) in between 'early scan' at 6/7/8 weeks and the 'safety' of the 12 week mark. I think it can create more heartache, can lead to people telling others about the pregnancy before they normally would and can get hopes up falsely. Not all the time, I know, but I think there is a lot to be said for waiting til the 12 week mark. Some things are just worth waiting for! On another board I go on (all about babies) people are constantly bashing their GPs for not referring them for an early scan (for no good reason) and I dont think this is really fair on the medical staff. Perhaps it's just me....

I had two miscarriages in a row and paid for an early scan, it was worth every penny. I knew the risks and afterwards I felt so much better, because even if I lost that baby I still had a picture of it.
I am 34 weeks tomorrow and the fear is still there that it could all go wrong, it takes away your innocence having losses and being aware of all the things that can go wrong. I would never begrudge anyone an early scan, who has had a loss previously or bleeding .etc Lying is an entirely different matter though!

I think they are good for those who need them but not women who just want a look, IVe gone though 3 pregnancies with early scans 2 of which ened up in MC 1 of which left me in hospital over night with massive bleeds and clots. I dont think they should give a scan just because My local EPAU will do blood tests for 2/3 days before they will scan you so you cannot get away with saying your bleeding when your not to get a scan

Do you think scans should be available on demand, Sooty? To anyone who thinks they might have a worry? Isn't that most of us in early pregnancy? And would a scan really tell most of us anything for definite or that needed to be known?

I think OP made it clear she didn't mean cases where there were clear medical reasons to scan.

Well I am 'made' to have them as have a high risk condition. Said condition means that my miscarriage risk never goes down so for my personal situation yabu!

I think yabu anyway tbh.

Oh - and I told close family and a couple of friends each time I got pg - well before 12 weeks. After the second time I thought that there was a chance of mc and that I would need all the support I could get if it happened. Everyone understood the situation and was quietly supportive whilst adopting a 'wait and see' approach.

I think there are also two separate issues - use of NHS resources and (as outlined in OP) the emotional impact. Prior to being referred to recurrent mc clinic I would have paid privately for early scans, just for peace of mind.

Also - because of early scans I now have a pic of my last baby (well not much of a pic, just a blob) and its hugely important to me. I can't really explain it but it shows me that it was real, even for a short time.

Ragged, you've made some really good points. I totally agree that m/c should be more of an open topic to those that want to discuss it. I always felt a bit like I would be embarrasing people if I bought up my m/c as they wouldn't know what to say. It would be nice not to feel like that as when you do raise it more often than not, either the person you are chatting to or someone close to them has been through it to. And yes you are spot on about the 'safe' period, it is just a case of taking each stage (or even each day) as it comes as nobody know what the future holds.

Bemybebe - so sorry for your devestating loss and congratulations on your current pregnancy. Hope all goes well.

SootySweep - I have NEVER met anyone who DOESNT have concerns about the pregnancy in the early stages. NEVER. But as I said how can the NHS possibly scan everyone that is 'concerned', they simply do not have the resources?

"From the Miscarriage Assocaition site: 'A heartbeat at 8 weeks increases the likelihood of a continuing pregnancy to 98% and at 10 weeks that goes up to 99.4%.'"

It is interesting as American Academy of Family Physicians quote different figure for second trimester loss - 1 to 5%.

"Rates of pregnancy loss decrease as the pregnancy progresses. Overall, about 10 to 20 percent of all recognized pregnancies and 30 to 40 percent of all conceptions end in pregnancy loss.4?6 Miscarriage that occurs at 13 to 14 weeks' gestation usually reflects a pregnancy loss that happened one to two weeks earlier.7 Approximately 1 to 5 percent of pregnancies are lost at 13 to 19 weeks' gestation, whereas stillbirth occurs in 0.3 percent of pregnancies at 20 to 27 weeks' gestation, a rate similar to that of third trimester stillbirth (Figure 1).1
"

12 weeks is a long time to wait! I had an early scan at 6 weeks and don't know how I would have coped having to wait another 6 weeks to find out if there was a heartbeat or not. I needed to know as soon as possible if there was a problem with the pregnancy so I could deal with it if there was, why on earth should I have waited till 12 weeks?

I can see your point about some women who are desperate to have an early scan so will tell their gp a lie so they can get a scan, that's a different situation though and a bit of an insult to women who have had genuine cause for concern.

Things can go wrong at any stage of the pregnancy and at any stage in life. I never took it for granted that I would get a full term healthy baby. Are there many people that think a healthy baby at a 12week scan guarantees a full term healthy baby?

Now I am 27 wks with dc2 I firmly believe there is such a thing as too much information, so I agree with you. But, with dc1 I had a scan at 8 wks and was glad of it. I had no symptoms whatsoever, but was working with a lady who had hideous morning sickness and everyone was telling her it was a sign of a strong pregnancy etc. I knew this was tosh, but freaked out anyway.

After miscarrying I was pretty neurotic when I got pregnant again. I paid for 2 early scans - 8 weeks and 10 weeks. True, seeing what was going on in there didn't guarantee me a successful pregnancy but the reassurance they gave me was worth it. Getting pg is such an exciting/worrying time, I can understand women being desperate to see what's going on.

Sorry to hear all the other sad stories.

I had repeat early scans with DS because I had had recurrent mcs and had been referred to a specialist. (I was also risky for a couple of other reasons). The consultant told me that in the scenario of a woman who has had repeat miscarriages (3+) and no live births that there is evidence that the reassurance from early scans actually leads to an improved outcome. Hence his willingness to offer scans. I would have grasped at any straw that led to a better chance of my baby surviving so was very grateful for this.

Also, I had catastrophic bleeding with 2 of my miscarriages that variously led to collapsing on the bathroom floor in a pool of blood/ being blue lighted to hospital/ emergency theatre x 2 because of haemorhage. So I was quite keen to know that the baby was alright also from the point of view to make sure that I wasn't about to have another life threatening emergency. This was also because of the effect that the previous 2 episodes had had on DH who was profoundly worried about me and extremely anxious he might lose me.

We were by this stage very well aware that things could go wrong up to 12 weeks and beyond. We had previously had a MMC at 12 weeks in the 1st pregnancy, then an 8 week scan in the 2nd pregnancy that showed a heart beat (but a small baby) and then a 12 week scan with no heartbeat. We had the opposite problem, that it had got to the stage where it was an effort to believe we would ever be parents! And we did not tell people till the 20 week scan because of that.

(amazingly, I am now due to have his little sister next month, fingers crossed).

My early scan was a private one, I wouldn't have gone NHS for it.

I had an early scan when I was 7.5/40 with my DS. I had two previous early miscarriages at 7/40 and 8/40 and another at just over 12/40, but I had to pay for the scan myself. It was only £65 and I was happy to pay for it as I just needed to know if there was a heartbeat. I was fully aware that there was no guarantee, especially as one of my mc happened AFTER the "12 week" scan.

I don't think it should be available on the NHS on demand. It should only be available when a clinician deems it necessary, how could the NHS cope with lots of women in the situation I was in, just wanting reassurance but with no real guarantee that it would all be ok. I would hope that if I was ever in the siutation to NEED an early scan on the NHS that I would be seen quickly, but unless that is the case, I am happy to pay if my stupid body ever manages to actually get pregnant again

I had an early scan at 7 weeks because I was terrified. I was told I would never be able to have children and after 7 years of trying with my exH I found myself pregnant with a very new partner. Took 3 digital tests that tell you how far along you are. It said 5 weeks. I went to the docs immediately as I had been told that sufferers of PCOS have a 42% chance of miscarrying but found him very unhelpful. He had no idea what PCOS was and just brushed my fears aside. Didnt even do a test because 'those tesco ones are reliable enough'. I was then told that I would have a scan at 10 weeks so spent the next 5 weeks terrified and emotional thinking the baby wasnt real and I would be getting my hopes up for nothing. I became quite depressed.

Then 2 days before my scan the docs informed me theyd made a mistake and I wouldnt have a scan til roughly 14weeks. I was so on edge that my DP booked me into a private scan straight away, just for peace of mind. When I finally saw that I was indeed pregnant (and heard the heartbeat through an internal scan) I was able to relax and look forward to everything the pregnancy had to throw at me. I never regret paying that £100 for my own sanity.

I do know what you mean. Of course it is different if there is a medical reason.

But when I had my 1st child early scans weren't offered. I had about 6 months previously had a period where I thought I was pregnant and then had a heavy period. I thought then either I had never been pregnant or it was very very early stages. Of course now I am quite clear I had a miscarriage. But it would have been much worse to have had a scan and see my baby and possibly tell others about it.

I think you are being slightly U. It does make me a little bit cross when I hear about people lying about bleeding etc. to get early scans as they are a limited resource and having one just for reassurance means that somebody who really is bleeding might not get one or might have to wait longer.

I think that bemybebe makes an excellent point 'That said, no outcome is ever guaranteed, there is always a risk (high or low) of things turning pearshaped ' It's always a sliding scale of risk and seeing a baby at 12 weeks is no guarantee at all that everything well be fine. And bemybebe I am so very sorry to read about the loss of your daughter.

I had 4 scans with dts. One at 12 weeks, one at 20 weeks and two further scans when an apparently minor problem with dd1's heart was discovered. Sadly they arrived early and dd1 passed away at three days old. dd2 was very ill but pulled through. So all that the scans provided in that particular pregnancy was false reassurance. There's always a chance that scans will do just that, no matter at what stage in pregnancy they are done.

In my two further pregnancies I did have early scans. First time to check that there was only one baby as I had so many difficulties with my dts. Then I also had bleeding in both pregnancies, one miscarried, the other progressed to my dear ds1. Although, strictly speaking, there was no medical reason to do those early scans I think I might have gone completely round the twist waiting to know how many babies I had and if they had a heartbeat. If you have lost a baby at any stage in pregnancy (and I think that this is far more common than many people might imagine) an early scan is a real sanity saver and I'm very grateful that I was able to have them. Although they are no guarantee of a good outcome it is very hard to live in a state of limbo if you are bleeding and frightened.

Well, if there is evidence (see my previous post) that early scans can lead to a successful pregnancy rather than another miscarriage, then they are a "great idea" - in some cases.

They are not always a great idea, but then there is no medical or technological invention that is a good thing for everyone in every circumstance. The scan can only show the state of affairs at the current time - that the baby is alive and all appears well at the time of the scan - and cannot predict the course of events for the future. How much parents understand this may well vary. I can see that it would be difficult for the sonographer to try and explain the limitations of the technique in the course of the scan! and they are often squeezed for time in any case.

Maybe we should be teaching better understanding of scientific techniques like this at school level in science classes so that we have a better informed population of young mothers?

I had early scans. 1st time as I was going abroad to a 3rd world ish country and wanted to rule out ectopic which given timescale would have presented during the trip. Second pregnancy as had lots of pain and felt something was wrong - not sure if pain had anything to do with it but it was a mmc - so glad I had the scan and could prepare myself for what was coming and manage it myself, plus speed up time to try again. 3rd pregnancy for bleeding early on. Only 3rd was on NHS. Each time it was not to 'reassure' but to make sure if there was anything wrong it could be dealt with asap. Imagine how awful to turn up at 12 weeks and find out pregnancy had finished weeks ago, especially if time is of the essence in conceiving as well.

By the way, I am aware that this is a difficult area for an AIBU in a way because there are so many tragic personal stories being recounted and I just wanted to acknowledge that.

herecomes That is a really interesting finding, that early scans are correlated with a higher likelihood of a successful outcome, I didn't quite pick up on that in your first post.

Although I don't fit into the category of women mentioned, I'm glad that you brought that study up as I've always felt vaguely guilty about the early scans I've had. Probably because my GP was quite dismissive and told me "if you are having a miscarriage there is nothing they can do so a scan is pointless" and yes, I suppose that might well be true. However this same GP also expressed surprise that I was 'still upset' about DD1's death, six weeks after it happened so I don't think he was the most sympathetic to how I felt during my next pregnancy! For me personally, the early scan was reassuring, just as I found it reassuring to use a Doppler to hear the baby's heartbeat. It stopped my anxiety getting out of control. But yes, certainly not always a great idea by any means.

Haven't read the thread, will do now. But an early scan would have saved me having to carry a dead baby inside me for 5 weeks when I suspected it was all over. Couldn't get a scan. That was the hardest bit about the mmc to come to terms with.

from my 12 week scan onwards i had a scan every fortnight, as they found i was expecting twins. it was a problem-free pregnancy until the 34 week scan where they found one of our boy's hearts had stopped beating. his twin was delivered next morning, fit and well (though small and needing ng tube feeds). even the large number of scans i had did nothing to stop us losing his brother. the fact the consultant has told us if we have any more DCs i will be scanned frequently, does nothing to help the fear and paranoia we would feel until after the safe delivery of that baby

I thought maybe we had had this thread before but it was slightly different

I do agree that there seem to be other people on other boards (Babyandbump is one) who want to be scanned very early and to have the photo and not always just for reassurance but just because they can't wait.

Usually the same people who can't wait to wean imo

You have (internal) scans from the first checkup here (in Germany), and at every consequent appointment with the gynaecologist thereafter. Completely normal here. My gyno was astonished that you have to wait until 12 weeks in the UK.

Same here, I'm in Spain. I had my first scan at 5+2 as that's when I first went to see my Ob-gyn.

Had a private early scan with DD after a MMC at 13 weeks which was badly managed and left me a bit of a mess. One of the consultants asked me if I was sure I had really been pregnant, and as I had not had the NHS scan and had not had a doctor see a line on a stick I began to think I might be going a bit mad and have imagined the whole thing. Didn't have morning sickness or any other symptoms. Ended up with a D&C so I definitely was but the uncertainty really didn't help!

As herecomes said, if you see a heartbeat you have, statistically, a good chance of a positive outcome. I was prepared that it may go wrong after that, but reassured to know we had at least got that far.