To wish I could remain married but live in separate houses?

[JeanBodel]

I know IABU really.

So DH has been off work for a week and is driving me mad. Overall he's a good guy, a good father, we're married and he's done nothing to warrant me breaking my vows and leaving him.

I just can't live with him. I've struggled with this for the eight years we've been married. We've been together 15 years but didn't live together at first. We've talked about it, had counselling; he always promises to change but I believe he just isn't capable of it.

The problem is his laziness. He has to be begged, cajoled, threatened into every single piece of work he does. He would never look at a dirty child/pile of washing up and think, 'I know, I'll wash it'. He just steps over it. And he won't undertake any task unless he can be persuaded that this is the last available moment in which to do it. If he can put things off, he will.

He just seems incapable of self-motivation. I know he's the same at work. So I have to do all the thinking, planning, mental work, then bully him into his meagre share of it. And I've had enough.

I am committed to this marriage. Also, our children are very young and I want him to be an equal parent. I dream of a scenario where we are separated - live in different houses - but are still friends, maybe even lovers, we just don't have to share the same living space. I suppose like when we first went out, where we lived in different cities but visited each other at the weekends. We did that for 7 years and it was good.

Does anyone else feel like this?

Isnt that what Helena Bonham Carter does?

So if you had separate houses...you'd still be doing all the work but wouldn't have to see him not doing it or nag him into helping. Is this better?

My husband infuriating me for similar reasons. Worry that tension effects kids. A really BIG house would be nice... space would help..

See, if I had the money to live like HBC I think DH and I could be a truly happy couple.

I don't want to end my marriage. I want to take my vows seriously. Obviously if it was DV or anything serious I would immediately leave, but it's not. It's more of a clash in personalities. I am by nature a bossy perfectionist, he is by nature a lazy pragmatist. He resents me ordering him around, I resent his apathy.

There are good points to our relationship too. I don't want to give up on the whole thing.

Agree with lady in radiator that hbc issue different. Afaik they live next door with adjoining door and it allows tb to work later. Tbh that sounds more like expansive living arrangements than separate house.

Op- I know you are committed to making this work but what does your dh do? Doesn't sound a very great partnership if any house like stuff is only done under duress and the best days of your relationship where when you lived apart. How would you see things working in a way that would make you happier? And was this discussed with dh at counseling?

Marriage is more flexible than you'd realise. It's what you make it. There are a number of well-known celebs who live in different residences, and it works for them - as CatsAreEvil said, Helena Bonham Carter is one of the more famous ones.

However, you have other issues feeding into this post (laziness, having to do all the emotional wifework for the household) which makes me think that this solution wouldn't really work for you. Because it's not just about maintaining space or a practical solution - you actually have problems that really need to be addressed on their own.

So, I'm afraid YANBU to wonder about other setups away from the norm... but YABU to misdirect our attention onto the living apart issue, when that's not really one of the primary issues here.

Isnt the old adage you cant change someone, you can only change how you react to them

Of perhaps your H needs a timetable of what needs doing and when, on paper in spreadsheet form

If you are as you describe it bossy perfectionist what did you agree to work on? If going to stay together then it's not just your dh who needs to change

What is the understanding between you about doing household chores?

Are you a sahm? (if so, wondering if he feels home is 'your' domain?)

Would it make you feel better (and perhaps lessen the tension between you) if you got a cleaner in periodically?

Oh dear. I'm sure there are people like this - but perhaps they are not the one you should marry, if that makes sense.

I had a boyfriend I lived with for a short while - 7 months it lasted after we lived together, even though we'd had a passionate love affair that spanned 2 different sides of the world, 2 different cities and several years.

We really were in love with each other and from a companionship point of view, plus a physical point of view, just enjoyed each other's company so much. But he and I could just not live together.

I moved out, heartbroken, and he'd get on the train at the station after me once I'd moved out. My eyes would scan for him on the train platform. I started getting on the same place each time, he would stand on the same part of the platform each time. He'd sit next to me, we'd sit there linking arms and snuggling together and stealing kisses and just drinking each other in. THIS WAS AFTER WE HAD BROKEN UP AND I HAD MOVED OUT!!! I tended not to sleep with him (though I did on New Year's Eve one night admittedly) because I didn't really believe in giving the goods if I couldn't have it all.

I was in my "prime" at the time and was getting ALOT (!) of offers or interest for want of a better word from plenty of eligible bachelors around town, as you do when you are 22!!! and one day I said to him, out of the blue, "do you ever see a point where we might get back together?". He said, sadly, staring into space, "no, I don't think so, we can't live together, so where can we really go?"

I then co-incidentally moved to another part of London, and a week or two later started dating my now husband of 10 years. I'd still see him from time to time - with new boyfriend/fiance in tow - in fact he came to our wedding, with his ex fiance! How weird is that?!? But it wasn't weird, somehow.

Haven't seen him since I was pregnant with my first mainly because I am no longer London based but still in vague touch. He has become a father, though he never moved in with her either, and he had a flatmate/lodger at one point who moved out over an argument about the way she held the black pepper mill. Yes. That's kind of why we broke up really. And when I moved in with my husband, I realised it really wasn't my fault.

Some people just are hard to live with or can't live with people. But you can still love them?!? Its a strange world.

Gigondas is right I think. I am the same with DP - although I don't think we are quite as bad.

I have learnt to mentally let certain things go. Like, I will not freak out if there is mud on the floor if the cleaning lady is coming tomorrow. I will not get het up about one day's worth of washing up being left.

In return, DP does certain things like clean the toilet properly, wash up a couple of times a week, etc. It is about compromise.

That said, one of the things that has really helped is getting a cleaning lady. It means I can stop taking responsibility for certain things because she will just sort them. And I find that when DP needs to do stuff - really needs to, like buying Xmas presents for his parents or similar - he will somehow find the wherewithal if I leave him to it.

You are right, Gigondas, I accept that. I do not enforce my perfectionism in any way. Really, this house is a complete tip. It is disgusting. Because I regulate my cleaning to his to make sure we are both doing a fair share considering the hours we work. That way I feel slightly less resentful.

I have read Wifework. The thing is, I knew he was lazy when I married him. I suppose I thought I wouldn't mind so much, and we both thought he would change when we started to live together. Then after the first child was born. Then the second...

I think a cleaner would definitely help. It is a good idea. We did have one when I was pregnant and it was great.

I have a cleaner leaflet on the noticeboard, actually. I will ring them forthwith.

You are a 'bossy perfectionist'. He is 'lazy, unmotivated and apathetic'. What is his response when you complain about this?

Can you simply hire help to do the jobs you want him to do? Maybe if he's unwilling to do them himself, he'd prefer to earn the money to pay for them to be done.

One other point: you say he's lazy at work too. Do you think his job is secure?

Maybe he needs to 'step it up' a bit at home, and maybe you need to lower your standards from perfect to 'good enough'.

We had similar issues and we got a cleaner, it really did the trick.

Jeanbodel Are you married to my husband? (fgrin)
If I ask him he will do a task (not well but still) but never does any self-directed work.
I feel as if I have three teenagers to cajole/boss/plan for.

Can you convert the loft?

Oh God yes Jean - totally see it. Have even dreamt of doing that if I ever won the lottery and yes Helena BC does it for exactly the same reasons...not cleaning cos she can afford a cleaner but so she and DP have their own space.
She has a corridor in between the two....
I am in an end terrace (not at moment cos am abroad) but my neighbour next door don't think will ever move and there's tons wrong with her house and it cost 40k but is now 120k even with the faults. Tis a nice pipe dream though.
I could have written your post.

Thing is even with rotas if your DH is like mine and it should be done by midnight he will still insist on leaving it til 23.59
I have no solution. I feel your pain. You sound less resentful haggy naggy and frustrated than me though.

Going on strike won't work-you will end up ina shit tip/squalor then the arguments fault-finding and blame will really start. Wish I knew what to tell you -i also have 2 kids - one is older and needs lots of support with school issues homework bullying sibling jealousy etc One is a baby and still co-sleeping breastfeeding on demand and won't let me out of her sight.

My DH is not lazy at work - he is working really hard and in control but at home he can't/won't help out. He hates housework and 'work gives him more than i do' and he is control at work 'cos i am not there'. He was always a lazy barsteward oon the home front though - even when i was working full time and DC1 was a year old. DC2 is water on the bonfire.

We get onfine if both ostriching and not pointing out the obvious chores. If I call him on anything or he takes the baby whilst i try and get us out from under we end up having a blazing row which usually ends up with him hitting his head repeatedly in a passive-aggressive method of trying to force me to back down/shut up.

Is this making you feel any better about your DH Jean?
It sucks.

Dh can't see things that need doing he would also step over dirty items but if I point things out then he notices what needs doing. I often email him stuff that needs doing so he can't 'forget'. It definitely helps having a cleaner, I now tend to let the little things slide.

According to the DM, the Burton-Bonham-Carters live in adjoining flats linked by a shared room. I've always thought this sounds like an ideal arrangement.

I've been with my DP for 15 years. We're not married and never will (a part possibly for pension purposes so mine doesn't die with me but that won't be for another 10 years). We live in separated houses despite having 2 DCs. It's a fantastic arrangement and a lot of friends actually think it's we do have the perfect relationship (although doesn't it always seem that way from the outside!!!) . It actually has it's own acronym. Apparently we're LATs (living apart together). Can't imagine living with another adult permanently. It would drive me crazy. He spends about 4/5 nights at mine and the big advantage is he will take the two Dcs to his overnight so I get some breathing space.

Thankfully DP is of the same opinion. It wouldn't really work if one partner was unhappy with the arrangement.

OkeeDoeKee, I'm assuming that most of the LATs (living apart together) family arrangements have the children in with the mums, though? So you still get to deal with the crappier parts of parenting (cleaning up after D&V, comes to mind, after this week with my lot - not a lot of fun in this household in the last 48hrs even if it has been Christmas!). Like a hareem, but with 1 woman?

Or is that just an unfair misconception? Genuine question.

I just can't imagine many families with, say, a mum and a dad where dad lives with 2 DCs in a house and mum lives alone in a house and it works well. I'm prepared to be told I'm wrong though!

My parents have friends who for most of their married lives had him live in London and her in Paris. The children went to school in Paris and lived with Dad in all the holidays - he was self-employed so that worked OK. Toddler years involved a lot of ferries, apparently.

Seems to have worked out well though they did say it was as well Eurostar opened when it did!
I know a few people who have done similar (usually dad moves to other place in same village - helps if you live somewhere where housing is dirt cheap!)

However, I suspect a cleaner once a fortnight or so, and a long chat about what is important to each of you in a household, might be more feasible. A weekly 'date night' where we ignore tasks that need doing, works really well for us and many other people we know esp with small children.