To think that pushchairs should have same priority as wheelchairs on buses?

[SparklyC]

Today - packed bus, I was in the pushchair bit on the bus, another mum got on with a buggy loaded with shopping. People sat in space that could have held another buggy in it didn't get up so both our pushchairs had to go in one space and my pushchair is one of those big all-terrain things! Then bus driver stopped bus for wheelchair user and asked us if either of us could fold down our pushchairs/move? Well, first of all, there wouldn't have been any room for us to sit down with our babies and also have our shopping on our knee or even stored on luggage shelf once pushchairs were on. Also the bus service I travel on has a bus every 4 minutes in the daytime. So the bus driver (who obviously has to be sen to be doing the right thing) got off the bus to tell the wheelchair user that the bus was full, and would he mind waiting for the next one, which he didn't anyway. What does everyone else think? Should we mums with our pushchairs be given the same priority as wheelchairs? Should bus drivers ask other passengers to move so that we can get on, instead of (sometimes) feeling like we are an annoyance and an obstacle to them?

Omg if you actually think it's safe for the baby to be carried on a moving bus or to be sat on an adults lap while bus is moving then you need to do some proper research! My god if that bus had an accident then that baby on the lap would either take the full force of the adults weight going into the chair in front whixh could seriously injure a small baby or the adult may drop the child ending in the same result! Babies need to be in their bigger pushchairs because it is what is safest for them. Safety of children and babies should be paramount.

Bollocks.
The safety of a person in a wheelchair should be paramount. A person in a wheelchair can not safely travel on a moving bus without the appropriate space and the bars being put in place, FOR SAFETY REASONS. If you're that bloody worried about a baby's/child's safety then get a car and don't use public transport at all. I had a double buggy on my own (easily foldable) with a young baby and a toddler and I have NEVER witnessed a bus pull off until a child with baby/toddler who has had to fold has sat down so your point is moot.

Was typing a post to the GF.
Really can't be bothered to waste my energy on the entitled.
YABU
Naive
Selfish
A bit stupid

Awaywiththepixies27
For me!?
Oh you shouldn't have!
(Did I come across as tired and cranky?)

No more tired and cranky than me. I've had a horrid chest infection for over a week and two DCs birthdays in the same space. I'm looking forward to tonight's cinema trip just so I can snooze upright for an hour whilst DS watches the Lego batman movie

BillSykes they've started another thread because you're all being mean on here y'know!

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/2862785-Buggies-on-busses

Sorry BillDoor and BillSykes I got your names mixed up somehow. Twice. Please accept my apologies. Tis what a week of no sleep does.

Have a coffee yourself pixies
Or, I'm sure it's lunchtime somewhere. So...

Oh fucking hell, someone's dragged up a thread from 2011/2013 to stir it.
FOTTFSOFAFOSM!

Oh, thanks Pixie, I need that!

Just got the rage and typed massive post on the other thread, only for the thread to go poof. So I am copying and pasting it here. I know this is a zombie thread, but clearly people are as selfish in 2017 as they were in 2011, despite a court ruling happening since then.

Every time one of these threads pops up I think I die a little bit inside at the realisation that there are so many people out there who are incapable of thinking outside their own little box, and unwilling to accept that their wants and needs don't trump those of everyone around them.

I have made this point about a billion times, but buggy users vastly outnumber wheelchair users. This means that, unless a buggy user happens to make the same regular journey as a wheelchair user (in which case the buggy user may want to think abut varying their travel time for their own convenience) they will almost never have be in a situation where they can't access the bus because the space is in use by a wheelchair user. But a wheelchair user could very easily find themselves in a situation where bus after bus goes past with the space occupied by buggies. This is particularly the case in some parts of London where pretty much every bus on a busy route will have at least one buggy on it.

I have seen this situation occur, with a lady with clearly complex needs crying hysterically in the rain because no-one would make space for her. She had been there for long enough for a fairly large group of people to have gathered, and it finished up with several of us trying to reason with multiple bus drivers to get her on the bus. No-one would move and the drivers wouldn't get involved. It took two PCSOs to get her space on a bus. It was disgusting and unacceptable, and the worst thing was that there were no guarantees it wouldn't happen to her again the next day. And the next day. And the next day.

Able-bodied parents of able-bodied children go through a relatively short period of their lives in which things are a bit tricky and inconvenient. That's parenting and we have to suck it up. We're not entitle to float through life in a squishy little bubble where everything is perfectly arranged for our specific needs, and we never have to actually think about the logistics of anything or put ourselves out at all. We have to work with what we have. Yes, it would be nice if everywhere was easy to access with a buggy, and if all busses could accommodate all comers at all times. But there isn't unlimited money to make instant adaptations for a group of people who can generally come up with a work-around if they apply themselves. Wheelchair users have to use their wheelchair in most cases. There isn't a work-around. So it is entirely right and proper that any available resources go, firstly, to making sure they can access facilities at all. Not to making things perfect and easy for parents.

Parenting can be inconvenient. That's how it is. We'll live. It is utterly shameful that people are so incapable of empathy and consideration that this even has to be a debate.

I would expect a pushchair to either be folded when the space is needed by a wheelchair, or for the parent and pushchair to leave. If you don't like that then take a taxi.

As others have said this topic has been done to death. People with buggies have options people in wheelchairs don't. People with buggies will struggle with a buggy on public transport for a very very short period of their life. People in wheelchairs struggle day in day out all their lives. People with buggies can walk through the streets of most major cities and towns without much hassle. People in wheelchairs can't most cities and towns are not fully accessible for wheelchair users due to the poor pavements lack of ramps on kerbs etc etc so buses are really their only option for getting around even short distances. Accessible buses are part of law and enshrined in the Disability Act they were not brought in for buggy pushers but for wheelchair users. People who push buggies should be grateful because the vast majority of the time the space is free for them to use. I travelled on buses in Dublin with small children many many times and only once in all the journeys I took did a wheelchair user need the space. I had the pram folded, baby on lap and luggage under my feet before the ramp was even lowered for the wheelchair user. Not all buses have accessible ramps (in Dublin anyway) a person with a buggy can fold buggy and get on most buses so getting off and waiting for next bus isn't much hassle a wheelchair user can only get on the bus with accessible ramp so their wait for another accessible bus to come along could be a very long wait.

Finally when you are planning to travel on public transport with a small baby expect to have to fold buggy/pram up so plan for that. Don't carry too much unnecessary baby crap, have a buggy/pram that can fold easily on public transport and always vacate a wheelchair space if a wheelchair user gets on. It is their space not yours.

Some peeps are complete arses aren't they? We had a situation a few years ago, having come out of great Ormond Street hospital, where none of the buses would let us on because of little man's buggy. It was tipping it down, he has a brain condition and none of the arse wipe public would move out of the buggy area so we could get on. I called into the bus asking them to move and nobody did. So my sleeping, disabled baby and his parents were forced into the rain again. What is it with people being so awfully selfish and mean?!

Nannygirl, how often do serious accidents involving babies on buses actually happen?

Very, very rarely is the answer, the reason being that buses are rarely involved in accidents (being large and easily spotted) and even when they are, the passengers on the bus are highly unlikely to be propelled with anything like the force that would happen to people travelling in a car. This is why seat belts are not compulsory on buses: they are far, far safer than cars.

I was on a bus with my young ds when it collided with the car. We were sitting in the end that actually took the hit, heard the noise but barely registered the bump. The whole front of the car was crumpled.

Nannygirl1990 Fri 24-Feb-17 04:19:12

"As a nanny and a mother myself the children and babies I care for come above and beyond ANYTHING else."

So can you just explain briefly to me how you would keep a disabled older child safe on the bus? Or do you simply refuse to nanny for disabled children?

Reverse

Bollocks.
The safety of a person in a wheelchair should be paramount. A person in a wheelchair can not safely travel on a moving bus without the appropriate space and the bars being put in place, FOR SAFETY REASONS. If you're that bloody worried about a baby's/child's safety then get a car and don't use public transport at all. I had a double buggy on my own (easily foldable) with a young baby and a toddler and I have NEVER witnessed a bus pull off until a child with baby/toddler who has had to fold has sat down so your point is moot.

WELL - YOU CERTAINLY DONT LIVE IN LONDON THEN!

Get off the bus for disabled people as they have less options.

However what about those big shopping trolleys people drag around with them? Do they have priority over buggies?

Empty one on bus yesterday taking up huge chunk of space. Lady refusing help to put in luggage rack and second buggy couldn't use area. Trolley user shouted at buggy users for trying to let people off the bus.

I have commuted on the tube for the past 8 yrs with my 2 DCs, one for 4 yrs then the other one for 4 yrs.

I have never used a buggy - not practical, used a sling or they walked, scootered were carried. These were not small children.

I watch people using buggies and expect the space etc in rush hour - they do not fold their push chairs and I have been told by other parents that because they have a pushchair they need to nearby seat - as I sometimes sit there with DC on my lap. i have never seen a folded buggy on the tube in rush hour - just selfish.

Wheelchair users have no choice, my DC have sat on many a wheel chair users lap when we have been delayed. Asked some pretty embarrassing questions as only children can do about wheel chairs and learnt why and what it means.

I have commuted because I am a single Mum who needs to provide for her children. I completely agree that occasionally it would have been nice if someone offered a seat at the end of the day but it has not been horrendous. I have survived.