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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that accupuncture is a load of bollocks

130 replies

Pakdooik · 21/11/2011 17:43

I've got a long term bad back - usually OK but every now and then it goes badly awry and I take myslef off to the physio.

The f**ng thing went as I was getting out of bed on Saturday so after a weekend of pain I got an emegency appointment this afternoon. My regular physio was fully booked so I had someone I'd not seen before.

In addition to the usual heat treatment and manipulation, she offered me accupuncture. Now I'll try anything if it'll aid my back so I said OK. But as I lay there for 20 minutes with 12 needles in my back, legs and feet having my "energy channelled" I couldn't help but think it was a load of old tripe.

Has anyone here had any benefit from the pin treatment?

OP posts:
PuffOfSmoke · 22/11/2011 02:23

I had such horrific morning sickness, by week 26 I had spent a month in hospital on a drip and lost 2 stone Sad

It took an hour to get the 10 mins to acupuncturists as had to stop to be sick so often. I struggled to walk from the car to the door of the practice.

One session later = no more sick! I managed a glass of water within an hour and never looked back! Took ages to get back to eating properly again but was never physically sick again.

Went back for another session a week later, the Chinese practitioner in broken English said "you walk better, you feel better, I told you!" He was right!

As it was DD came at 30 weeks but that man and acupuncture gave me 4 weeks of vomit free pregnancy and let me do normal things such as baby shopping that I hadn't managed previously.

So, after that essay YABU!!!!

annanymous · 22/11/2011 04:28

YABcompletelyU. Just cos it didn't work for you. My OH uses it quite a lot and always feels the benefit. He actually feels Western trained practitioners are better than those trained in China.

sunnydelight · 22/11/2011 05:45

YABU. I think that different therapies work for different people so you can never just dismiss things as being useless just because it doesn't work for you. Homeopathy never did anything for me or any of my kids even though I know lots of people who swear by it, acupuncture on the other hand made my injured knee practically pain free after a year of physiotherapy that did nothing. DD was breech at 38 weeks, I had a couple of acupuncture sessions and she turned - maybe she would have turned anyway, maybe she wouldn't!

itsalladirtylie · 22/11/2011 11:10

if homeopathy or acccupuncture had any actual therapeutic effect they would stand up to proper scientific testing, or at least not be so hit and miss that the phrase 'different therapies work for different people' would apply.

I used to be very into alternative medicine, having read more widely on the subject now I'm just not so sure.
Sure there are some persuasive stories here but I think it's good to remember that proof is not the plural of anecdote:)

crashdoll · 22/11/2011 12:21

^^ WRT 'different therapies work for different people', well, it's the same in conventional medicine too. The first anti-rheumatic drug did nothing for my RA, the second one changed my life.

itsalladirtylie · 22/11/2011 12:29

I agree crash, infact medicine in general can be very hit and miss, plus, the placebo effect plays a part with all and any therapeutic/medical intervention.
I'm also very sceptical of the motives of 'big pharma' and suspect that in a generation or two current medical practise will look like a crude & blunt instrument.

FreudianSlipper · 22/11/2011 12:36

i have an underactive thyroid (bordering) and undergoing treatment. after four treatments i already feel much better, i am sleeping much better and mentally i am more alert and no more heart papultations or shortness of breath. the dr is treating me for a hormone imbalance she also massages me and at times it hurts but feels so good after, but she does nag me to get fit too :)

it was the only thing that worked for my mum?s stomach ulcers and my nans migraines i think it is great, at times you need to do a course or a few sessions not expect miracles after one treatment

i have had it a few times for various problems (this is the first course) and for me it has worked every time and i would try acupuncture before medication

FreudianSlipper · 22/11/2011 12:44

after my first 3 sessions i felt great at first then terribly tired, i slept for hours after and had a terrible headache i was told that i may have side effects at first they have now gone

i can not reccomend it highly enough

itsalladirtylie · 22/11/2011 12:51

I had acupunture and it did nothing for the problem I had..I did have very vivid dreams though.
Freudian, are you having conventional treatment alongside acupuncture?

FreudianSlipper · 22/11/2011 13:09

no i am not as i am bordering on having an underactive thyroid though if i do not inprove within a few months the doctor said they would put me on a low dose of thyroxine though i feel it wil not be needed now

i have most of the symptoms and it has gradully got worse since havign ds (he is 4) of course i was told i had pnd, than it was anxiety related problems (could be and felt worse when i was stressed)

my course is 8 sessions, she really works on massaging my neck (ouch it really hurts) as the muscles around the thyroid gland are very tense and accupunture treats the cause not just the symptoms its working i am feeling better and have been told by a fwe people how well i look

my eyes are not as puffy either

itsalladirtylie · 22/11/2011 13:14

it sounds good Freudian, you must be pleased :)

youtalkintome · 22/11/2011 13:21

I was told i would never conceive naturally as my testosterone levels were so high my periods had completely stopped had acupuncture 6 months later was pregnant with dd have had a 28 day cycle ever since and am expecting dc3 having conceived ds a month after my coil came out and dc3 whilst using condoms Hmm.

clarabellabunting · 22/11/2011 13:27

I think when people are saying it works no better than placebo, they might be talking about studies which show 'real' acupuncture based on the energy meridian lines (or whatever true believers in it believe) works no better than someone randomly sticking the needles in with no reference to the proper ancient practice of acupuncture.

For a trial to be a fair trial, the placebo has to be administered in a similar manner to the thing being tested and this is very hard to do with acupuncture (ie how can you administer a placebo similar to needles in your back without actually sticking needles in the subject's back?). As the people taking part in the trial cannot know whether they are receiving the real thing or the placebo. If that makes sense?

So there may be a physiological benefit to having needles stuck in an area that requires treatment which is over and above any placebo affect - and there are various theories as to the mechanism of this. But the real theory behind ancient acupuncture (ie qi and energy flow and meridian lines) appears to be rubbish as 'sham' acupuncture works just as well.

youtalkintome · 22/11/2011 13:39

Most big trials are funded by drugs companies, this goes someway to explaining why big trials aren't undertaken for alternative medicine, who would fund it?

In Germany they ave done studies on acupuncture turning breech babies and it was found to be 90% effective, likewise the US military have carried out small trials (only what they can afford) on treating pain with acupuncture and have found it to be very effective but there isn't the money available to undertake the sort of huge research to prove effectiveness.

FreudianSlipper · 22/11/2011 13:41

i am very pleased

my dr works on the tradional meridian line energy flows, not sure it is a load of old rubbish. last time the needles were placed in a slightly different position and one in my chest. the session was not relaxing at all my heart was racing i wanted to pull them all out and had visions of myself running out with needles sticking out of me it was very uncomfortable before it has always been relaxing and i have often fallen asleep but what every it was releasing it is working. was very strange though

FreudianSlipper · 22/11/2011 13:45

exactly drug companies are also informing us after much research that antidepressants are not addictive and that long term use of the pill is good for us

NotJustClassic · 22/11/2011 13:54

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

itsalladirtylie · 22/11/2011 14:53

notjustclassic that's a very good phrase!
I mean the idea that acupuncture can be used as a way of accessing the placebo effect.
I've had thoughts along those lines but that phrase really seems to capture something.

I guess it's kind of another way of saying that acupuncture stimulates the body's own healing ability..which is pretty much what alternative medicine claims to do anyway.
Thanks :) :)

I suspect that some believe that if you are 'susceptible' to the placebo effect that means that you're gullible/easily persuaded and that may be one reason people are quickly on the defensive if their chosen therapy is accused of being just placebo.
My understanding is that this is absolutely not the case, the fact of responding to placebo does not mean that you're gullible.

Rational · 22/11/2011 15:01

I'll quote Tim Minchim here, he says it so much better than I

"?Alternative Medicine?, I continue
?Has either not been proved to work,
Or been proved not to work.
You know what they call ?alternative medicine?
That?s been proved to work?
Medicine.?"

DazzleII · 22/11/2011 16:06

Horses are gullible though. Especially racehorses. You can tell them anything and they'll believe it. If they're really sick and you give them acupuncture, they jump up off their straw and go "I'm healed!" when actually it's all in their minds.

crashdoll · 22/11/2011 16:12

DazzleII, how can you argue with facts? People have said they couldn't become pregnant, had acupuncture and become pregnant. Hardly all in the mind!

valiumredhead · 22/11/2011 16:20

Utter crock of shit. No evidence to suggest it works.

Not true according to my GP who referred me for physio on the NHS - worked incredibly well and I was not at all sure it was something that I 'believed' in.

I walked in with a foot so swollen it looked like a balloon and by the next day the swelling had virtually disappeared ( it had been swollen for over 3 months due to a break) so much so that the skin was wrinkly where it the swelling had just disappeared.

OP I would give it a day or two and see how you feel then - it doesn't work instantly.

Wasn't there something on the news recently about the NHS prescribing courses or dry needling/acupuncture for back pain as it was so effective?

DazzleII · 22/11/2011 17:10

Crashdoll, I was being ironic! There is plenty of research which shows acupuncture works - someone has linked to a ton of it above!

Grin
DazzleII · 22/11/2011 17:11

I do like your MN name, btw, Crashdoll...

nevergoogle · 22/11/2011 17:25

Hi
I use acupuncture to treat pain and I was as sceptical as the rest prior to my training. In fact, even after my training I wasn't convinced.
However i've used it and it has worked.
My most successful treatments have been for muscle spasm.
I don't channel anyones energy either.
There are a few theories on why it might work but meridians and chi are not my thing. i'm more of a pain gate theory/trigger point kind of person.