to think that elderly people living alone in 3/4 bed council houses should not have a choice about whether they want to stay there?

[BlessYouToo]

In fact, they should be moved into one bedroom accommodation as soon as the kids leave home (this should have happened years ago of course). Having a 'spare' bedroom in case the grandchildren come to stay should not be an option when they are in state owned properties.

I have today been to view a council property with a friend of mine who has been homeless for 3 years (in temp accommodation) after finally getting to the top of the bidding queue! She was called to see a 4 bedroom house and it was absolutely rank, the smell made me want to heave. Plaster was hanging off the wall and the whole place was damp as the previous tenant either, did not or could not, heat and ventilate it properly Apparently the house was in a much worse than the state we saw it in today but the council had done some remedial work on it to make it safe so it was a bit better. The garden was also just a sea of brambles.

We were told that an elderly person had been living there and had just been moved into a nursing home. T

I was shocked that the council could rent out a property in this state. I would have expected that they would have made sure the property was up to a decent, clean standard before renting it out as any other landlord would have to do (all my friend will get is a paint allowance if she is eligible) but I am even more shocked that this elderly tenant was allowed to let the property get into this condition. Why do councils not carry out inspections to ensure their properties don't get into this state? Obviously the house was too much for the previous tenant to cope with and surely they would have been better off with a smaller property that they could keep clean?

We were told that many of the properties coming available after elderly tenants have either died, or gone into alternative accommodation, are left in a similar state. How many families with young children are left crammed into tiny flats while elderly people are living in houses much too large for their needs, letting them decay around them? I find it unbelievable that this has been happening.

I feel gutted for my friend as she has been desperate to get a stable home for her DCs and will now be going into a total shithole without even carpets on the floor, just cement. It's a bloody disgrace! AIBU?

Anyway council try to move anyone on with lifetime then there in breach of contract and leave themselves wide open

TheHumanCatapult - you live fairly close to me. I am in a HA property right now, on an assured tenancy (tenancy for life). I am waiting for a larger council property. When I move, I will have to sign one of the 'new' Tenancy agreements. I don't CARE that I will be losing the right to live in a big house forever - If I did, then I would take myself off the housing list and stay in a house that is too small in order to be able to stay here forever.

But, IMO, Social housing should be based on need at the TIME, so, right now, I need a 4-bed, in 10-14 years time, I will be able to downsize to a 3-bed, and in around 20 years time I will be able to downsize back to a 2-bed. I will never be able to downsize smaller than that, as DD will probably never be able to live independantly, but I am quite happy to downsize as far as I can when my other dc leave home.

WHAT on earth is the problem with that? I WILL be affected by the change - but I STILL don't care - because it is the right thing to do! If I was private rented, I wouldn't have a home for life, would I? OK I wouldn't be able to eat either if I was private rented, which is why I need social housing - but it shouldn't be for life.

Those of us that are IN Social Housing, whether we are 30 or 80, need to understand that there is too much need now for Social Housing to be for life, and will just HAVE to suck up the fact that a Tenancy is no longer able to be for life, it's the Socially RESPONSIBLE thing to accept. The country now is very different to the country there was when they were offered these houses - things change. OK so these people were told they would have their house for life - but there are many other things that have changed in the past 30/40/50 years because they were unavoidable. They are OVER-OCCUPYING a house, it's a HOUSE FFS - not a living sentient being that they are being asked to leave!

There SHOULDN'T be any 'concessions' for existing Council or HA Tenants - We should ALL be madeto sign the new Tenancy agreements. Right now IMO. And that includes me, who currently has an Assured Tenancy - which I have ALWAYS thought was wrong, as it prevents movement both up and down.

So there's no 'it's all right Jack' from me!

And only having a 5yr tenancy wouldn't stop me from decorating a Council / HA house, or putting carpets in, or looking after the Garden - I want to live in a nice home and area, whether I'm there for 5 yrs, 15 yrs or 50 yrs!

But I am not against offering finacial incentives to move if people choose to downsize so freeing up places. But if property's not there then they can not go

My mum stepdad want to downsize but don't have enough points to qualify/bid on where they would like to be , council did suggest studio flat they laughed

And there pretty open would like a 1/2 bedroom bungalow ( step dads elderly mum lives with them ) or would take g/f flat in older area 55 but the places are just not available

Has things changed so much, 30-40 yrs ago whole communities and towns were made up of almost nothing else but council houses. People worked, paid their rents and improved their homes. They really felt it was their home as much as a someone paying a mortgage. It was not just for the poor and disadvantaged, you were allowed a disposable income to sound it on what you wanted as it was your house and you paid the rent and that was that. Do we really want to chase out every older person and those who can pay rent or could even afford to rent privately - wouldn't this harm community ties and create more ghetto type places. Where is this idea that council housing is just for the poorest in society?

Could someone tell me where all the huge 3/4 bedroom council houses are please. The few I have been in are tiny with barely room to swing a cat. One of dd's friends lives in a lovely such house in a lovely road. The entire ground floor which has been cleverly extended is about the size of our kitchen. One of my work colleagues lives in an ex council house on the Dover House Estate in Putney - it is minute, she describes it as a doll's house -yet the family who owned it before brought up three children there.

None of my relatives who have downsized in old age have downsized to something as small as a 3 bed council house.

there OAPS leave them where they are unless the want to move.

A council house tenancy is a secured longterm tenancy...when the tenant signs the leasehold they do not sign a clause that says 'oh but when I get old and my children have left home please feel free to chuck me out this house'

And it's NOT easy for a Lone parent, with dc with disabilities, who also has a disability themselves, to move house either - it costs money I don't/won't have, including for carpets etc, it could easily mean having to move away from my current support network, away from the GP that I have used for years, and knows mine and my DC's conditions - but that's life, and needing to be a Social housing tenant.

Hunty but that is the thing the fact you need a larger house could be colouring your views and opion could change once your in and settled , especially if means change of schools / Drs shops or the area

If people could downsize and stay local to where they currently live then I'm sure more would consider it . I know I would

Just obviously our needs and experiences can cloud our views . I knowine have varied widely depending how desperate I am

Btw I'm no longer in same area I high tailed out of there

I just fail to see why some people who have lived in their properties for 20/30/40 years will have their HB cut if they are underoccupying, simply because they are working age claimants, and thus run the risk of being evicted if they can't afford to top up, yet if you are an OAP, and have lived in your property for exactly the same amount of time, you are perfectly entitled to live there as long as you wish with no such sanctions placed upon you??

I'd like to see no one facing these sanctions due in April 2013, but if we are in it together, then we should all face the same sanctions surely??

Example: I live very close to an OAP couple who live in a semi detached 4 bed council house. They have lived in it for 20 years and refuse to downsize. (They were offered a 2 bed semi detached and a bungalow in the same road, both of which they refused.) Why should the family living next door (also in a 4 bedroomed semi detached) face sanctions (father and son are disabled and mother is carer) but OAP's face no sanctions?

Their joint income is almost the same, in fact the OAP's have a few pounds more a week) so the family with disabled father and son can ill afford to top up their rent. Their 4 bed house has been adapted for the disabled son, and there is nowhere suitable at present.

Why should the family with disabled people have to make the choice when the new rules take effect either to squeeze their finances or downsize if they can find another suitable property, yet the OAP's face no such choice??

So hunty if they said here you go there's a 4 bed but it is 2 hours away your move without s thought ?

, marriedinwhite. I am in a new build '3-bed' HA property - which has such a small square meterage that my Local Council DO NOT CLASS IT AS A 3-BED HOUSE!!! They say it is so small that it is only a 2.5 bed house. I have 1 Adult and 4 dc in here. My Last 2-bed private rented flat - the Front room was larger in size than my ENTIRE HOUSE is now!

You dont get carpets in council properties, you have to supply them yourself, you just get an empty shell, if she turns down too many places she goes to the back of the queue.

If you leave a council property you have to remove carpets.

I lived in a council house for 13 years, paid 10k to put a new kitchen in, I left it and moved to portsmouth where I now rent privately which is a pita, but the area within which I lived is now horrible and I'd not want to live there even if the rent was only 65 a week. When I left I left my husband he got the council house I signed it over, so he now lives in it alone. He is only 40.

because people should have respect for their elders! Is that really so hard to comprehend?

Yep. Done it before, and I'll no doubt have to do it again. The ONLY reason I can't do that currently is because there is a prohibited steps order over me for DS1 preventing me from doing so - which has frustrated me because I have had to turn down the PERFECT house for my family that was a 3 hr train ride from my house - my Council is part fo the Greater Haven Gateway, I am in a very Southerly Council in that group, the house was in the most Northerly. Would have taken it like a shot - it was the right SIZE for my needs.

What is the problem with that? I have, in 30 years, lived all over Essex, in Kent, in Suffolk, in Devon, in the Highlands and islands of Scotland, in over 7 areas of London - what exactly is the problem with moving??

Trust me I have had house envy . I admit it I got really peed of when was seeing adapted properties on open bidding going to highest points even when no need for those expesive adaptions

When I been without hotwater or heating private rented

Depending how desperate I have been I admit it coloured my views and I suspect I am not the only one . So there is always going to be lots of string opions one way or the other

My c hildens father has a 3 bed council flat, he got it because he said he had the kids at weekends, he never has. He is also single and alone.

Hunty I want to live in a community where I knowy neighbours where my kids do .

I did the moving thing as a child and not something I wish to do anymore . This next move will be my last one for a very long time thankfully.

Yes technically it is infact to small and will break the councils own rules on overcrowding but is the best fit in my situation

My Granny is in Social housing, she is 82 yo and becoming infirm. They had 5 dc. They at one point were in a 4-bed, they downsized to a 3-bed after 2 of their dc had left home, around 30 years ago. Then 20 years ago, when all but their youngest dc had left home, they downsized to a 2-bed. They have been in their 2-bed for 20 years - and have now just downsized to a 1-bed bungalow. At 82 and 84. What exactly is the PROBLEM with that?? It's the SOCIALLY RESPONSIBLE THING TO DO, and even my Granny obviously agrees - she voluntarily gave up her lifetime tenancy on her 2-bed house in order to downsize to a 1-bed bungalow as the stairs were getting too much for her and my Grandpa.

fabbychic a bet it's in a rough hard to let 'area' as the council put it though

Oh and I am greatfull that I can make it work size wise am fully aware that is not possible for everyone due to personal situations

Hunty read my post my parents want to downsize but for several personal reasons they wish stay in similar area but there's nothing available

My dc know their neighbours - you soon get to know them, you just have to be pro-active about creating a new community for yourself and your dc. My dc still keep in touch with their friends from previous places they have lived too...I've been in my current house for 7 years, I love the area, will be sad when I have to move further out, but needing a 4-bed leaves me no choice, and I will still come back to the area - it's not that hard to jump on a bus and go and see friends from there, even when it is two buses, and you are disabled. There are phones, and letters, and Skype, and Facebook - it's not that hard to keep in touch with people. My 82yo Granny lives a bloody long way from me - we keep in touch by Skype.

@huntycat there's nothing wrong with that I'm hope your Granny is happy and settled.

But what about other peoples Granny's who really don't want to move ?