To be sick of self-absorbed, self-pitying men!!!

[doradaisy]

Just had a row with DH and am on a rant.

He wanted to watch a football game last night and the twin boys (17 months) were up teething and he was fuming and annoyed! I told him to basically (in a reasonable way) to grow up and that unfortunately children can not be neatly packaged away so you can watch a football match.

We also have a DD, age 4. In fairness to my DH, he is a good father and is currently off hillclimbing with her. We have a good marriage apart from this recurring issue.

But since the twins were born, every now and then he says things like he is freaked out by having 3 children so suddenly, that there is always mess and noise in the house and he would love more time/quiet to himself.

He does have a busy job however, but I also work part-time (4 mornings as a teacher) and run to collect kids and have them in the afternoon. He comes home around 7pm usually, and TBH is often happy when kids are in bed so he can chill with a beer and watch TV.

Can I add that he was away in Milan last weekend with the lads to watch a football match!! I didn't begrudge it to him, as he is supportive of me having time to myself but I didn't have children to have a 'break' from them, whereas he is always going on about needing one.

He always says I'm 'better and more patient' with babies. As if I never get tired/crave attention to myself but it's my duty as a mother and am happy to do it. Someone has to be!!

We were trying for DC2 but the twins came along, was a shock and a change. I'm delighted with them and feel lucky to have 3 healthy children.

After the twins were born, DH was particulary self-pitying about how tired he was, etc. I think I still resent that time, as I needed him to be strong as it was such a tough time, but he just resented all the work he had to do with the boys.

I'm on the verge of tears now actually. On the one hand, feel furious that my husband is being such a baby, that I now have to be the strong one. But am worried that he is just unhappy to and is going through his own crisis. All he wants to do is watch DVD boxsets of the wire etc (I was thinking, in a cynical way - "Here Lies X and he watch the boxset of the Sopranos 3 times" Is that want he wants his life to be???) Am afraid we have totally different philosophies of parenthood.

I think men need to be minded too of course, but why can't they roll up their sleeves and get on with it!! Is own father has similar traits. Even my own Dad, who I remember as being a great father, my mother always says he couldn't handle when we were babies.

Having twins stretched me further than I thought was possible to go, and to me he sounds more and more self-pitying.

Have I lost all perspective? Should I forgive him feeling like this? Am I being unreasonable?

apologies, no insult in men in general

YANU at all - a relationship especially when you have children is a partnership not an unequal balance where one person can unilaterally decide that the other is so much better at childcare, so they're off to Milan for the weekend.

You both work. The fact that you are part time is immaterial, you are doing the lions share of parenting.

How about you have a nice spa weekend? you must beworn to a frazzle...

Can't advise as no DC, but I can say from the outside he needs to man up.

He should thank God/Allah/ Buddha/ the universe hourly that he has 3 healthy children and a wife who instead of stabbing him on the sofa as he watches football worries on MN that he?s unhappy

You have not lost all perspective, he's being very very UR you are not!!

This may be counter-intuitive but (if you've got the energy) you could try to bolster DH's self-esteem. Sometimes we just have to flatter men to get them doing their bit in good grace. Thank him for doing stuff which he shouldn't need thanking for etc.
I think most men go through a spell of wondering where their life/domestic status went after children arrive. They shouldn't but they do.

I'm sorry you're finding it so hard.

I agree with the others that he needs to start pulling his weight, but I think you need to delve a little deeper to find out what's going on here, as I suspect neither of you are having a good time of things at the moment.

I think he's perfectly entitled to say that he's finding it hard to adjust. So do many mothers, and this parenting lark would be a lot easier for parents of both genders if more of us were honest about how much of a shock to the system we found it and how much we missed some of the pre- or one-child freedoms. It is hard, especially with twins. And it is normal to want a part of your life that doesn't revolve around your children.

I get the impression that you have both fallen into the competitive tiredness routine, where you are both trying to get the other to recognise how hard you're finding it/how much you do. Now it's been going on for a while, he's rebelling against the responsibility while you've become a martyr to it because you know someone has to do it and if he won't it has to be you.

I think you both need to give and take a little and be more understanding of the others POV. It's ok to admit that you find it hard too, and that you sympathise with what he's feeling because you feel it too. Admitting that it's tiring, relentless and often mundane doesn't mean you love your DC less or that you're not coping. It's normal. Likewise, it is ok and healthy to want a break from your children to be yourself, rather than just mum. Try to get some time where it's just you and your DH so that you can reconnect as a couple. This will benefit your relationship and your parenting style much more than him going out with the lads and you feeling more and more resentful.

That said, he's clearly getting adequate time to recharge his batteries and it seems a bit as though his attitude is: you are a mother and should do everything, whereas I am a father and should therefore be allowed to pick and choose what 'help' I give and I expect massive thanks whenever I do 'help'.

It is impossible for a parent to 'help' with their own child. A parent has 50% responsibility for their child, not a minor obligation to 'help'. If your DH's attitude doesn't change after some good long discussions, you could have deeper problems than struggling to adjust to life with three DC. He should definitely be helping you more than he is.

FWIW I am a (lone) parent to DTs. I personally found it a lot easier once I was single because I wasn't running around after a man child as well. I suspect (hope) that your DH isn't like my X though, and he's probably just struggling to adjust. Talking and supporting each other, rather than fighting against each other, will hopefully get you past this.

Good luck. It does get easier.

"Self-absorbed, self-pitying men" is a tautology. Just saying, like.

I don't think either of you ABU, but he is when he tries to palm off his responsibilities onto you because 'you're better with babies'.

He's obviously trying to tell you it's freaked him out a bit, which is fair enough, and you seem to be listening to him and trying to be understanding when you say 'But am worried that he is just unhappy to and is going through his own crisis.'

Him trying to 'zone out' I can understand, but he has to keep a check on it and not be selfish by making it all about him whilst he ignores you struggling under the weight of having three children.

You need to both talk, and he needs to listen to how he makes you feel.

(sorry if that sounds prescriptive I didn't mean it to)

I think your post comes across in a way that shows you both have a good marriage, and this is just one of those bumps. If he gives your feelings as much consideration as you give his, then you are on to a good thing.

Does he know how you feel about all of this and understand you too?

Thanks all for the advice

sunshineandbooks particularly like the competitive tiredness insight, your post was full of good advice/insights.

I guess if he says he is stressed and finding things hard at the moment, doesn't mean he is not a good father as well.

So easy to get resentful about what one/the other does in role as parents.

Thanks mrsshortfuse for the helpful, grammatical point. I would seriously reconsider the use of the comma in the final line of your post. Is there a need for it with such a short sentence?

It does sound as if you need to have a conversation about how you feel in general, and how his behaviour is affecting how you feel. It is too easy to fall into the "mother does everything, father does what he wants" way of working when that was the type of household you grew up in. We all, when tired, fall back upon familiar ways; even when we know that's not how we see ourselves. He may not be aware how his woe-is-me routine is bringing you down, you should tell him.

I would also beware the "He always says I'm 'better and more patient' with babies." People tend to say that as their excuse for you to do something and them not to do it (not just regarding babies - I've witnessed it in work environments too). Do not allow him to keep thinking that your 'skill' is natural, emphasise that with practice he will be just as good .

Nawwwww Dora, I wasn't making a grammatical point; what I mean is, ALL men are self-absorbed and self-pitying, that's the tautology. Not that self-absorbed and self-pitying are the same thing. Like saying a three sided triangle or a delicious doughnut. I think. I might have my ologies mixed up, I will consult pedants' corner.

Don't worry mrs shortfuse your point was a good one and well made .

I really feel your pain. My DDs are 5 and 2 and while I cannot say they wd be on a par with twins. i really understand that loss of self feeling. what makes it worse is that DH thinks he is entitled to breaks when he has had enuff, but as a mother you just don't get the chance for that break so easily. But I have to say he has improved over the years - it just took him longer to get things and understand what I was going through. I would suggest writing things down - for some reason men get that more. and i have started acting more like a man - demanding praise for doing household tasks and patting myself on the back around him. i can't pretend it is equal but it helps to vocalise without accusing. admittedly hard tho - when tired and rageful

i think that if you are almost deliberately taking a counter point to him to 'balance it out' - you say you didn't have children to have a break from them but really??? seriously??? you don't want any time for yourself or for you as an adult couple?

it strikes me that if he says he needs a break, you get all defensive on behalf of the children and say YOU don't want a break, he would then feel that you really didn't understand him at all, so the cycle is self perpetuating...

admit that you both SHOULD have time away from the kids, divide the week up into family time, work time (including solo childcare), couple time and personal time and make sure you both take equal amounts of all types.