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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to be really really upset about DMums decision?

26 replies

msfallaway · 01/11/2011 21:07

I come from a Catholic family (very very catholic truely) and I am non-practicing as our most of my siblings (lapsed or nonpracticing), 2 are practicing. My DMum though was and still is very active in local church and is devoted to her faith.

Anyway my DDad died about 10 yrs ago now and for the last 3 years or so me and my siblings have noticed that she has become secretive around her home with letters and the such - but figured if it was bad she would tell us and if not she would tell us that she when she was ready.

anyway she told us all tonight that she is going to become a nun, an even more so in a closed order.

For the last 3 years she has been in contact with the order (hence the secretiveness)

I think I may still be in shock.

I think part of it is that she wants to join a closed order, so would never when she took her vows see her again and she wouldnt see any of us or her GrandChildren again

I'm really upset.

OP posts:
hwjm1945 · 01/11/2011 21:09

I would be devastated to think my own mother would choose the church over her children etc. Religion is deadly

slavetofilofax · 01/11/2011 21:09

Did she say why she wants to do this?

YADNBU btw.

IneedAbetterNickname · 01/11/2011 21:11

:( I don't know what to say really, I guess it's your DMs decision, but I, also, would be devastated. Feel really :( for you.

IggyPup · 01/11/2011 21:13

YANBU. but I wonder if your Mum finds herself unable to cope with her grief.

An enclosed order is pretty extreme, the Church has loosened up on a lot of Orders rules regarding enclosure. Have you checked it out? Will it definitely mean no contact? Not even one day a year?

This must be very hard for you, I am sorry.

HecateGoddessOfTheNight · 01/11/2011 21:14

three years? wow.

Do you feel like she is trying to escape something? loss of your dad? loneliness maybe?

Or maybe this is a true calling.

It must be very hard for you, to think that you may never see her again.

Could she not join a different order, so that you can still be part of her life?

You need to ask her why she has made this choice, so that you can understand why she feels she wants to join a closed order and if she truly understands what this means for her and for all of you.

Maybe it's been easy for her to plod along with this because it's been a secret. Perhaps when it is 'real' - ie you are talking about it, she may change her mind?

But, at the end of the day, heartbreaking as it must be for you, if this is what she wants, you are going to have to find a way to live with it.

I feel really sorry for you. This must be such a shock.

Just talk to her. Get her to run through what her life will be like. Ask her if she wants to write messages for the children, to be given to them at various points in their lives - exams, leaving school, uni, getting married, children, you know, the major events that she will never even know about.

Either she'll do letters or she'll realise exactly what this really means.

Original poster
msfallaway · 01/11/2011 21:14

I know that when she met DDad she was talking about taking her orders but I figured that was her at 19.
She does feel that this is her calling - that was put on hold i suppose - too truely dedicate herself to God.

OP posts:
IggyPup · 01/11/2011 21:18

Ooooh, letters! What a brilliant idea!Well done that HecateGoddess one!

Tortu · 01/11/2011 21:19

Erm, PM me if you want (just because if I say too much then I will out myself. There really can't be that many people in this situation). My cousin has just become a nun and, in my very very Catholic family, it turns out that this is the most controversial thing anybody could have done. People are devastated and her mother has been crying every time I've seen her since she took her vows. It is genuinely talked about than the cousins in trouble with the police/ teenage pregnancy/ drugs etc.

Cousin is 26 and we really don't like the order, either (it is not recognised by the Vatican).

OP, I'm really up on nuns at the moment (seriously, the people you meet on mumsnet!) and have to say that I can't think of any orders where they'd let you enter a closed order immediately. My cousin has gone for one of the most extreme orders and even they wouldn't let her take her vows for six months. She still wants to go into the closed section of the order, but she is having to sit a year's probationary period first.

I have her most recent letter here and can give you snippets from it, if you're interested. Have to say, she is managing to convince me that it is not entirely a crazy idea.

p.s. I have five other relatives in religious orders, so do know a bit about different ones.

potoftea · 01/11/2011 22:11

Op, I feel really sorry for you, because your mother choosing to do this is like a death in the family, where she will be as absent from your lives as your father is.

I recently saw a tv program following some young women who were considering joining the convent, and one was going to an enclosed order. And I felt really upset thinking how I'd feel if it were my daughter. She'd never be here for Christmas, miss family parties and occasions, not be on the other end of the phone for a chat, never again eat a meal I cooked for her. But if it was what she wanted, I'd have no choice but to give her my blessing to go. Even thought I know I'd be heartbroken.

And unfortunatly I think thats the only option open to you too. Your dm has obviously thought this through for a long time, and as an adult with no responsibilities is now free to make this choice. But she does need to hear how upset and abandoned you feel too, so she goes knowing the full facts.

2rebecca · 01/11/2011 22:21

I agree I'd be very upset, but if it's what she wants then I'd rather she did it and be happy even though I have to imagine her being happy than didn't do it out of "duty" to her family and be miserable and resent us all.
Still very sad for you and your sibs and kids though.

lovethislife · 01/11/2011 22:26

Potoftea I saw that doc and it made me kind of sick - all the talk about if they do not choose the order they may miss out on being a mother and a wife. I thought it was awful and I tell you what I would do anything to try urge someone not to join an order. I think offering yourself to God in that way is deeply deeply sexist and just horrid. I found that documentary really really awful. I think I would fight it if it happened to someone in my family.

I would be surprised if a closed order would allow someone to join as quickly as they OP suggest but maybe the mother has been groomed for this for quite some time during the 3 year period.

OP I think it would be very useful if you PM the person in the know.

ChippingInAutumnLover · 01/11/2011 22:31

I would be devastated, you have already lost one parent and now your Mum is choosing to no longer be a part of your life or your childrens lives - to me it would be like her choosing to die. I would have to have it out with her to know why she would choose this.

I am really really sorry :(

FairPhyllis · 01/11/2011 22:35

Hi OP

I don't have any experience of this in my own family, but I know it can be devastating when one person in a family decides to become a religious. It is awful that she didn't tell you she was thinking about this and give you time to prepare - I suppose she thought you would try to talk her out of it.

If she has been preparing for this for three years sadly I think it will be difficult to persuade her out of it or to get her to consider a different order, because she will have built up a relationship with the community and will have decided that her particular calling is to an enclosed life. I don't think they let people join now unless they have a pretty good idea of what it is like, so unfortunately for you she will probably have thought through the implications already. A friend of mine joined the priesthood a few years ago and he had to go through many interviews and assessments which included talking about the impact on his family, to make sure he understood it. It's likely that she will have done something similar. But being confronted with the reality of everyone's distress face to face might make her think again, so I would definitely make her do the letters thing.

I would also check what the rules would be for visiting: a friend of mine's sister is in an enclosed contemplative order and she is allowed to visit her twice a year and write. I would be surprised if it was truly no contact with family ever. She may in fact be assuming that you will be willing to stay in touch and visit - have you asked her if she has thought about the possibility that this might damage the relationship with you and your siblings to the extent that everyone may break off contact with her?

If the order follows the normal way of doing things there will be a probationary period of about 6 months before she is allowed to become a novice. And - I know it is small comfort - but people do leave, even after the probationary period. I know one person who was a monk and left after taking life vows.

My best wishes, and I hope you get support from your siblings. As a Christian from a Catholic background I am sympathetic to people who really do discern this as their calling, but it is very, very hard on everybody around them.

lovethislife · 01/11/2011 22:36

Got to say I agree with Chipping have it out, fight for your mum, let your mum know how much this will hurt and that way, when she is in she might be able to reconsider. I don't meant to offend any Catholics but a closed order does seem so outdated and awful.

Fight for your mum, do you think she has been brainwashed?

What freaked me out in the doc that I saw was that one of the nuns had friended one of the young women through facebook. It was awful.

AnonWasAWoman · 01/11/2011 22:44

Oh, love, you must be feeling so shocked.

I would say though, my cousin was a nun. She was just the loveliest, most calm, happy person ever. My dad is a staunch atheist and still he admitted there was something very special about the way she was.

I think it is important you get to the bottom of what your mum's thought processes are - it's only fair to her, because if she is going to become a nun it will be a long process and she will keep needing to check she's sure. It may be she'll try and change her mind (quite common I think). Or it may be - sorry, I know you don't want to hear this - that it's what she genuinely wants.

AnonWasAWoman · 01/11/2011 22:47

Btw, loves, you've succeeded in offending me and I'm not Catholic. I'm not being pissed off, I do see you don't want to offend people, but ... well, it is offensive. It's really hurtful.

squeakytoy · 01/11/2011 22:51

Would it be possible for you to talk to her priest at the church, see what his views are on it. See if perhaps he can come up with helpful advice.

MumblingAndBloodyRagDoll · 01/11/2011 23:04

You haven't begun to make sense of it all yet and must be in terrible shock and of course very sad about not seeing her....but is it possible that you could understand that she may have found a place and a way of being which gives her something that those of us who are not that way inclined, can't understand?

Nuns, as someone else said, are very special people. In your DMs mind, she won't lose you because she will be with you through God.....I know that's a hard concept for us to grasp but she won't be grieving like you will be....it will be a wonderful time for her as her faith will be giving her peace.

MumblingAndBloodyRagDoll · 01/11/2011 23:07

I fnd it hard to imagine breaking off contact with a family member....especially a parent....because they take vows. It seems bizzarre...I am even sitting here, trying to imagine my non religious Mum becoming a Nun and if she did I can honstly say that I would be happy she had found a place and a way of being which was so good, that it transcended even family.

MumblingAndBloodyRagDoll · 01/11/2011 23:10

I agree that speaking to a priest can be very useful at times like this.

Maryz · 01/11/2011 23:11

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MumblingAndBloodyRagDoll · 01/11/2011 23:12

loves many religions have forms of closed orders. It's not only Nuns and it is not only women who choose this way of life. For some deeply spiritual people this is the only way of being happy.

troisgarcons · 01/11/2011 23:14

I think part of it is that she wants to join a closed order, so would never when she took her vows see her again and she wouldnt see any of us or her GrandChildren again

Her choice. We cant live other peoples lives for them.

auntiepicklebottom2 · 01/11/2011 23:15

it must be something you feels a huge disire to do.

as much as i love my mum and would be very hard never to see her again, if my mum made a big discion like this i wouldn't guilt her in pleasing my emotinal needs.

yandu to feel upset

Xmasbaby11 · 01/11/2011 23:23

I couldn't understand or accept her choice, personally. I would fee devestated and shunned. However, I hope as a fellow Catholic, you can find it in you to understand her reasons for doing it. I really don't think you would be able to change her mind if she has been considering this for so long.

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