to be very annoyed with the post-natal wards lack of support with feeding?

[feelingratheroverwhelmed]

Considered putting this in "feeding" but wanted a wide set of opinions, so here goes.
I've just had three days in hospital after having DS2. I began bf straight after birth and it seemed to go well. He spent a big chunk of his first day on the boob.
He began to get a bit sleepy after this, and feeding started to become uncomfortable. He was "nipple" feeding so I was experiencing discomfort at every feed pretty much. He was still feeding a fair amount, and he was more often than not on the boob when the midwives came in our room for this and that.
I expressed my concerns at the end of day 1/beginning of day 2. A couple of MW's showed an interest and had a cursory look at the latch, and said it was fine.
Now DS1 had tongue tie, and it took us weeks for this to be identiified. This was a really horrid time, I expressed loads and it took over our life. I told them about the history (tongue tie is often seen in siblings), of my experience, and concerns, and how I knew that bf was not supposed to be hurting like this. I also asked, lots, to see the BF specialist nurse. Each time I was fobbed off, told everything was fine, the specialist was busy etc.
Baby check done by paeds, another cursory check in mouth, no TT.
By yesterday, 48 hours in, I had blisters and sores on both nipples. I showed this to each MW who did things with me throughout the day, again asking for help, as it was getting worse. Same response. Finally, just as the day shift was ending, my asigned mw came in and said "as long as you can tolerate the pain, then we don;t advise you to stop feeding. There's no problem."
I was furious!
Thankfully this morning a nice mw told me she'd spent the night worrying about me, and would be referring me to the specialist today. I was seen, DS is tongue-tied, i was given advice and told what to do next. We are getting it sorted privately tomorrow.

Now, before you go in you are given lots of info about the importance of bf, ff not encouraged. There are posters covering every wall in every clinic / ward about bf, telling you about the support available. This is utter bullshit.

I'm now sat at home with my three day old DS with basically destoyed nipples. I have tears in my eyes each time I feed. It can only get better, thankfully, but no thanks to the majority of staff I had the misfortune to come across during my time in hospital. Apparantly, this is normal. And they wonder why people give up so quickly?!

I am going to send a letter of complaint, but what do people think? AIBU to expect support, or was sucking it up acceptable??

It's shocking how this is such a common problem. I'm quite bolshy and because I've been through it before I was not going to take any crap this time, but if I'd been a first time mum then by tuesday DS would have been on the bottle, no question. All the stuff around about BF is just paying lipservice to what is supposed to be the ideal. In reality, they don;t have a clue and really don;t care that much.
Each time a mw came in the room and saw me feeding I get a pretty patronising "you're doing so well!" Then i'd say welll actually no it's pretty painful and i need some help here they;d just continue with the "noooo, you're doing fine!".
Er, no, it f hurts!!!!

yes, why can't they check for TT in the same way they check for hip dysplasia and the other things they check (which escapes me)?

Totally agree on the TT...

I was told that my DD 'may or may not' have TT. It was like that game show on C4.

Also my paediatrician in A&E actively discouraged me from trying to BF. She actually said that once my DD had had 70mls of formula every 3 hours she could have a 'top up' of BM if I fancied it. Yeah right my non-latching, sleepy baby is really going to go for that.

Lingdelong - a friend of mine is a MW of 30+ years. My sons TT was the first she'd ever seen.
TT should be recognised by anyone who works with babies. It seems to be a real blind spot in this country.
We're all encouraged to bfeed, but as soon as it gets tricky, and we need support and expert help, it all goes tits up.

... as it were .....

Faverolls that's just terrible. The specialist today said a lot of people just don;t believe it's a problem. DS's (DS1's) are not visually that obvious, but it's definitely there. With DS1 the (great) communinity BF counsellor felt he was borderline but did the referral anyway. I was really worried that when we got the apt we'd be turned away but thankfully they agreed, he was snipped, and we were able to get on with bf without the heartache. It makes such a huge difference, I can't believe that some people just fob it off.

I had a similar problem with DD. She is toungue-tied but nothing was ever done about it.
She would only feed from the right nipple (still her favourite) and it ended up cracked and bleeding.
I did have a lot of support whilst in hospital, however it was once I got home that the problem arose. HV told me to go to a Baby Cafe meeting to get help, but I was exhausted and had had a C-section so wasn't up to it.
I expressed a lot because the pain of her feeding was making me cry.
I tried nipple shields but DD wouldn't latch on to them.

My mum told me to try Kamillosan nipple cream, it's amazing. It made a difference within days, so really try it.

YANBU to complain. I think with the amount of time and money they put in to promoting breastfeeding, they need to make sure there is the support available for those that do decide to take that route.

Poor op. The midwives at the hospital I gave birth in were bf obsessed but only getting the baby latched on. If baby was sucking they were happy and left you to it even when women were begging for help and guidance because it was hurting like hell.
What helped we was a local breastfeeding councilor who had no qualifications at all apart from she had bf her children and overcome all sorts of bf issues. She was the only one who had the time to teach me how to get dd latched on.
It will get better for you. Congratulations on the new baby.

I think this could be a long thread...

Yes, I guess it does often get dismissed even when it is diagnosed. Tongue ties run in my family, my nephews and nieces have them (my kids seem to have escaped it luckily) and lost loads of weight when they were babies, my SIL ended up having to bottle feed. They had to pay to get one of their babies snipped because he couldn't even feed from a bottle he was so tongue tied and was really underweight. I can't believe the NHS just won't perform the snip. My mum had her tongue done by the GP back in the 50s!

Dirty I have my trusty Lansinoh, I'm slathering it on like it's going out of fashion, poor little DS is very sticky!
Round here the comunity counsellors are fab, but you need to have the knowledge, and then the inclination, to get them involved. As you said, if you've just had major surgery, and likely no sleep, then going out to a group is the last thing you need.
I became part of a teaching session today as the specialist was doing some training with mw's, so it was a really good opportunity for me to tell them exactly why my experience had been so bad and frankly unacceptable, and for her to show them a real TT and the damage it causes.

Yup we're paying to get DS's done tomorrow as our "local" clinic (other side of the city) now won't take referrals till babies are 1 week old, then you have to wait for a slot. I would definitely had given up if I had to wait that long. The specialist today said she would love to set up a clinic at our hospital but as lots of them don;t even believe it's a problem she's got no chance.

DS2 had a TT that wasn't picked up until he was 4yo. Despite bf'ing my first 2 dc, I managed only 4 weeks of torture before I gave up with him. DS2's TT only got picked up when he was going through S&L therapy at 4yo.

Fast forward 7 years, I had DS3. BFing hurt, didn't feel right, and I was sure he had TT. No, no, no all the HCP's told me. Eventually the bf counsellor I saw checked, lo and behold, he had a TT. I was reffered to the local consultant - but because it was a posterior TT I was referred to Kings in London to get it done. (am on the other side of Essex). TT was snipped when DS3 was 10 weeks old.

BFing still didn't 'feel' right, and due to the neverending guilt I felt at not bf'ing DS2, I have been persevering, despite the fact that even now at almost 9mo, DS3 has NEVER gone more than 2 hrs without needing a feed. After reading another thread on MN, I discovered (with a little help from Dr Google) that he ALSO has a class 4 (the worst sort) UPPER LIP TIE too. So I have gone back to the bf counsellor, who has referred DS3 BACK to the local consultant, who will no doubt have to refer him back to Kings in London.

So despite me having asked the HV repeatedly for help (as DS3 cannot drink from ANY bottle or beaker), and getting told that unless I am willing to do CC them I should shut up, , no-one bloody thought to check for a labial tie.

So I have endured 3/4 of a year of painful feeds just because the HCP's don't give enough support - and I think it is DEFINATELY worse the more dc you have had!

So, OP, YADbloodyNBU.

Oh - and my previous problems with DS2's TT were TOTALLY ignored until he had S&L therapy - despite the fact that he couldn't even drink from a BOTTLE until he was 9mo - I was having to spoon feed him. Yet not one person checked for TT - even though DS2 & DS3's dad has an OBVIOUS unsnipped TT, AND I had had my TT snipped as a baby, therefore DS2 & DS3 have a genetic pre-disposal to TT from BOTH sides of their family!!!

I never ended up getting DS2's snipped - he still has problems with mispronunciation now at almost 8yo, but by the time it was picked up when he was 4yo, he would have had to go through a General anasthetic to get it done - but he has respiritory problems that make a general more worrisome, and I decided it wasn't worth the risks.

Am now facing the same decision with DS3's upper lip tie, because it IS causing issues, he cannot flange his top lip at all, which is causing me a lot of pain when I feed him, but when he tries to suck from a bottle, he 'collapses' the teats and drenches himself. And believe me, I have tried almost every bottle on the market. With beakers, he can't suck properly to get the drink, and even with free-pouring beakers, he cannot make a 'seal' around the spout with his lips, thus spills 99% of what is coming out of the beaker.

I need a break. I need my nipples not to hurt. I need DS3 to have the ability to drink from a bottle so that I can leave him with a friend and get some bloody sleep (am an LP, and Ex-P won't take DS3 until he takes a bottle, neither will my friends).

It has been a week and a half since DS3 has been referred to the local consultant about his upper lip tie, and I still don't have an appointment. My nipples are shredded. I want to give up bf now due to the pain, but I'm trapped because it is the only way he can TAKE his milk.