to be amazed that something as psychologically manipulative as X Factor is allowed on air?

[moondog]

I've been watcihng it for the 1st time.
I can't beleive they are allowed to toy with people's lives like this, building them up, playing with them and then casting them aside.

What an unbelievably unpleasant concept.
I feel tainted for having watched it.

"We are not those"
Who is " We " - I love the X Factor, am well over 13 , have a university education and have a child with SN.
You are not my moral guardian peachy nor elected to speak for me. If you dont like the X Factor fine - but dont make out you are representing some campaigning movement.
the last time I looked this was a free country and I dont need some patronising mum to tell me what I should and shouldnt like.

I don't think she is thoguh.
I thought her comment rather amusing in any case.

The sobbing and tantrumming seems to get worse every year and there is less and less singing. To my mind, it's not about not preventing people with SN, it's that they seem to be deliberately picking people who are vulnerable (whether due to SN or not) and then encouraging them to make an exhibition of themselves for the entertainment of others.

Ooooooooooh!

No need to get your knickers in a twist.

Oh I am not telling anyone else to do, I most certainly am not your moral guardian. We means we are not 13 yeras olds; the rest is your choice but I am not reticent about mine on this matter. I will merrily support people's opinions to think whatever they wish but if there is a potentially vulnerable person on the end and someone is laughing I will think- meh, twat. Are we really that far from the first X factor suicide? Quite possibly not. Maybe they should televise that too?

I do however have very set opinions on this and anything else that makes ££££ laughing at people who bear a huge resemblance on occasions to my ds1 and will continue to voice those with emphasis.

And really it IS for 13 year olds, it's depressing when adults get into it. Their right, but my right to feel depressed by it.

Cory quite.

They can let people with Sn have a go, and reject them on the basis of no talent same as they would anyone who is a crap singer but ahs no 'ULP (unique laugh-at-me point)

Anyone who knows anyone who ahs been through the x factor system knows how it works, it is not random the audtions they show- by that stage they ahve been thorugh many and only talented people and 'jokes' get to that stage.

Yuck.

hmmm
Well I am conflicted.

I havent really watched it since 2006. I watched every week then and there were a few people in the beginning that were obviously there for 'entertainment' value only which made me a bit uncomfortable.

I went to some of the live shows and the support them was amazing. I dont know if they dub the boos on later but when you are there everyone is totally rooting for the contestants even if they are not their favourites. You get really caught up in the moment.

I was at the final and they did roll out some of the more eccentric auditionees for a special bit of the show which again was a bit but it was clearly their moment of fame.

If they are now filming people out purely because they are 'odd' and will make people laugh and point - well I can see how that is ok.

I have tried to watch a few times but one sight of Louie looking professionally sad or Cheryl 'trying to hold back the tears' and all that dramatic camera work and those bloody awful pauses - I cant bear it.

So in conclusion - I think that people with SN and MH issues should be 'allowed' to audtion in the same way that others are.
But no one should be wheeled out just to be mocked because they are 'weird'.

That is not nice.
The wider issue of encouraging youngsters to think they can become stars overnight - well I think X factor is a symptom rather than a cause tbh

YABU. X Factor is only following on from talent shows like 'Opportunity Knocks', 'New Faces' and is in the grand tradition of holiday camp knobbly knees and gurning contests. In the alleged search for talent we get to have a good old laugh at a few hopeless cases along the way. If you think X-factor and other TV talent shows chew perfomers up and spit them out, you should spend some time with real-life actors and singers who would give their right arm to be given the air-time & treated that politely. An actress friend that dragged herself to audition after audition to get a break was constant given put-downs that make Simon Cowell and gang look positively benign.

Its a lot fairer than the music industry you don't see.

I watch X Factor. I'm not 13. I have a high IQ. I enjoy music and listening to people sing.

I agree that the format is very staged in order to be more "viewer-friendly" and in later years I'm not enjoying it as much as I used to.

But these people know what they're getting into. The article that Madame posted earlier proves that if nothing else. The girl who the writer befriended had gone through all of the same rigmarole that the writer had, and instead of being put off, was determined to try harder the following year. That's clearly her choice. No one is putting a gun to these people's heads and forcing them to go and audition.

The SN issue is completely separate. I think we all agree that laughing at vulnerable people isn't big or clever. The laughs stem from people having terrible voices, regardless of their mental / physical wellbeing. The fault lies with a) the producers for putting obviously rubbish people through for comedic value; and b) friends and family for enabling and prolonging the false hope. Yes, some people go on without the knowledge of supporters; but one would think that if their vulnerability was enough that they could not make a well-thought-out decision, then they would not be entering such a huge competition without the knowledge of a carer / family member.

If it were purely a talent contest they would show only the talent, not cue up unfortunates for everyone to laugh at, surely? That is nothing but cruelty, and I genuinely can't understand anyone who watches such tosh.

Tulisa makes music I can't stand. She is however a woman I admire greatly. She knows more about living with mh issues than most of us ever will, she has fought back from being excluded and using drugs. Her life was mapped out for her and it was not pretty. Bloody hard work and determination, oh yes and people in the music industry who liked her, have helped her turn it round.

X factor appeals to those who want to change their lives, who hope that they migh have talent and are willing to work and face disappointment. I watch it, i just wish people could have chances fit expert tuition etc without possible humiliation. That is nit feasible though, the adverts contribute to the money making that supports the entire thing (ok I did want to write circus!).

How dare people judge others as unable to cope on the basis of a heavily edited snippet on tv though? What right does op have to slate them for trying. Susan Boyle struggled to cope but choose to keep going, many people who do not conform to the norm do. What right have you to point and say 'not worthy'?

Let me see would I want my teens to admire tulisa or one if you with judgy knickers so high you think you are able to decide for others, that you deem less competent.

so who this series reminds you of your DS peachy ? who are the vulnerable ones ? I just really cant think of any who were laughed at and mocked, i havent watched every minute but I have seen nothing that looks like someone with SN being picked on.

It's not the put-downs that worry me- I had no problem with Jason being rude to contestants on Dancing on Ice. Those contestants had been picked among people who could take it and occasionally get their own back.

With this years X Factor I get the feeling that they have been going through and selecting people primarily on the basis that they won't be able to take it. In other words, the entertainment is not just that they make mistakes or sing badly- it's that they get hurt.

Good post shakti

As this show seems to be so popular, the producers have obviously copied / stumbled upon / invented a very successful format.

Do the British really enjoy humiliating the (lack of ) talent or is there something more sinister developing in the psyche of the average viewer?

Are the tastes of the 'common woman' really so base?

Or is it really just light-hearted entertainment that anyone can watch in a relaxed manner - even those contributors to MN who claim high IQs and University educations?

(And no, I have to confess , I have not watched the show).

Don't bother, it is tosh.

In other words, the entertainment is not just that they make mistakes or sing badly- it's that they get hurt.

I kind of agree with you there cory. A lot of emphasis seems to have been placed this year on building up the contestants' hopes and then dashing them, which has come across as a bit cruel. It's all a lot more dramatic this year, with shots of tearful faces and melodramatic music and it does make uncomfortable viewing at times. So I can understand the point of view of people who say the company is making money from misery.
But having Gary Barlow to look at makes it more bearable.

I'm not a tv snob by any means btw, I wouldn't judge myself by my viewing habits. Crappy American CSI type progs are my poison.

Does no-one remember the smash hit Saturday night game show of the 70's and 80's 'The Generation Game'? That whole show was predicated on laughing at ordinary people having a go and making a hash of it while Bruce Forsyth made wise-cracks about them. Yes it's pretty basic but no-one is frog-marched to the application process, everyone's seen what they're in for and it's largely harmless. The contestants are there because they want to be entertainers. And, intentionally or not, they are entertaining.

I think it's less justifiable when they get people on a Jeremy Kyle type show... people who clearly have mental health and/or personal/social problems... and use the problems purely as entertainment. But even then, participation is voluntary

:o Ralph Ghoul. Of course the main reason I'm watching this year is for Gary. :o

It is light hearted entertainment. If you choose to view it in a different way, that's your choice, and your perspective. It's very over dramatised with clever camera work and tension-building music. A lot of the clips are put together out of time to make the "story" run. Without all that, it would be a less dramatic show. Having watched it since the beginning, every year they ramp it up a bit more. The first series was quite dull normal in comparison.

cognito is right. When someone wants to be an entertainer, or indeed anything in the arts, there are horrendous knock backs all along the way. It is a hard hard road, and not for the faint hearted.

And I don't see any reason why having a MH condition or SN should mean you shouldn't go for it. For example I know loads of writers with MH problems. Should they not be allowed to put there stuff out there because people might critisise it, or deride it or judge it?

The production values are terrible, though. Terrible. You can't call it well-made TV.

This is what the music industry is like, the public humiliation just makes it worse.

I'm less concerned with the effect on the contestants - who are relatively few in number - than on the viewers, who are led to believe that cruelty to other human beings is enjoyable entertainment.