To have not said/done anything when witnessing an abusive relationship playing out in public?

[Badtasteflump]

Because it's been playing on my mind since it happened yesterday.

I went into a garden centre yesterday lunchtime and was wandering around outside looking at the plants. In the distance I heard a man very loudly shout 'hurry up you f'cking stupid cow'. I looked over and saw the man shouting angrily at a woman who was rushing over to him, saying nothing. When she got to him he got in her face (not touching her) and started shouting a tirade of abuse - how she was 'f'ing useless, f'ing making him come to this f'ing shop again, better f'ng hurry up or she'd 'get it' when they get home....'

There were lots of people around - including a man working there and a few other men in couples, and me on my own. None of us did anything, and all simultaneously seemed to be deaf and blind. Most people walked away - some had children with them & I would have probably done the same if I had too.

Anyway, I was still there and she got quite close to me, not making eye contact. He came over, grabbed her roughly by the arm and said 'right, you're taking the f'ing piss - move - NOW!'. She just kept her head down and started walking away with him. Still nobody, including me, did anything.

I went back to work and felt like shit all afternoon. I wish wish wish I had said something to her, although I don't know if I could have said anything to help at all. And the truth is, I felt very intimidated and scared of this horrible man myself. But now I feel really guilty and keep wondering what the hell he must be like when they haven't got an audience and what kind of punishment she probably ended up getting. I feel really crap about this now

Oh yes, agree with jem, you can ask to report anonymously. Also, like rhubarb says, the police are always interested in anything, however small, which adds to their knowledge of someone, the more the better.

I have the local number of the police in my phone so I don't have to call 999 if I'm unsure about whether it's an emergency or not, I can call my local police station directly. You'll be amazed how often that number comes in handy!

Sorry but I think we all know that if a man is such a b that he will abuse someone he's supposed to love in public, in front of strangers, then attacking those strangers will be as nothing to him and that's why we don't intervene. Stepping up might make him stop in that moment, but it isn't going to change him - nothing will.
YANBU, but its understandable that you feel bad, anyone would, but remember, the abuser made you feel like that, he's the bad person, not you.

I think calling the police is a good idea. Intervening yourself could put you in danger.
There was a guy, who's in a band I like (Madina Lake), who intervened when a woman was getting beaten up (in the US) and he got put into a coma buy the other guy :(

I know how you feel I saw a 'man' threaten and swear at a little girl then smack her around the head once in front of the mother and smaller brother. This was right in frontof a major mainline rail station. I followed them to their destination (he was a big guy and, like you, felt to afraidto intervene on my own) and then went back to the station to try to find a police officer. I told the station guards what I had seen and asked them to call the police. One went off, presumably to find an officer, and I gave a description, contact details, a brief statement of fact and told them I would be willing to testify. He said he would pass the info on and that I could go on my way and wait forthe police to contact mefor a statement. I never heard anything.

I often think of that woman and those kids and wish I had done something different. Like has been said on here, if thats what they do in public ....... :-(

Most men who attack women are cowards (huge generalisation coming up here just to warn you) and they know that those women are not going to fight back. If you stand up to them they know that if they touch you, you are going to report it and get them arrested.

Now I feel much more comfortable tackling bastards than I would if my dh did so. Because I still go by the premise that they are less likely to hit me than my dh. Also because I tend to stand my ground and leave them with no doubt at all in their minds that I am more than willing to take it further.

I have never ever walked away from a situation where someone is being abused or bullied and so far I have never ever been hit. I have been verbally abused, threatened and so on, and I am only slight, but I've never once been hit.

And yes I have male friends who have been beaten to a pulp for interfering. So I do feel very lucky. But I would still never ever just walk away. It's not in my nature to do so.

I don't really see what you could have done.

You are right that you would have been phoning the police just to say that there is a man shouting at a woman, and while you can see clearly that it is abuse, the police can't turn up every time a couple has a domestic arguement.

If you had got a manager, the most they could have done is told him that he needed to keep his voice down or he would be asked to leave, and the woman would have probably got the blame and the beating for it when she got home.

If you had said something directly to the man, there is every chance the woman would have defended him, because that's often what abused women do, leaving you feeling even worse.

Re the comment about intervening if it was a child, not a woman. I have intervened a couple of times if I have witnessed what I feel is abuse.
However, with domestic violence it is difficult. As one of you has said, you could be attacked yourself. It is so hard.
In the past I have been in a similar situation and made my disgust known to the abuser by my facial expression. I have in the past notified staff to monitor a couple and use CCTV or call the police if it escalates. I think that's all you can do if you are vulnerable yourself.

Agree with Rhubarb0s post above. In general I feel safe confronting anything like this. I like to think I would always intervene as if I were ever in trouble I would hope someone would do it for me.

I've intervened in the past - my next door neighbour was beating up his missus - and I went in there and dragged her out. He couldn't get away from me fast enough - absolute coward.

I saw a man once shouting at his wife/girlfriend in the street and being aggressive, they had a child in their car as well who he was yanking in/out of its car seat :( I was quite near the police station at the time and was dithering over going in and saying something and then they seemed to calm down, so might have been a one off thing anyway.

DP works in hotels and once had a guest phone down to reception because the couple in the room next to them were having what sounded like a violent argument. DP went up and asked if everything was okay and they both said it was fine. I am glad he was brave enough to say something but can't help thinking he may have made things worse :(

The thing is there isn't much you can do in a moment, especially because most other people aren't going to step in. You can't possibly give someone the amount of help and support that they need when you're just a witness. The most you can hope for is to stop the immediate incident and hope that other people seeing you react encourages them to either help this time, or another time. And put hope into the mind of the victim that actually this isn't normal and there are people out there who are on their side.

It's understandable that you didn't, but I probably wouldn't have been able to stop myself from saying something, even though it's probably stupid and risky to do so.

When my ex-h attacked me, then stormed off leaving me trying to comfort my hysterical 3yr old DD, a man who must have seen (it was at the side of the road) stopped his car and asked if I was ok. It made such a difference to me that someone had thought to stop and ask. To intervene directly when you don't know how the abuser will react is risky but bullies rely on people not wanting to get involved.

For me logic goes out of the window when it comes to bullies, it makes my blood boil.

I have intervened in the past.

Once when my friend was being hit by her boyfriend in the street, I stood between them and called the police. She told the police I was mistaken, and actually thought it was funny I had 'over reacted' in this way. She's no longer a friend funnily enough.

Another time (slightly different scenario) in a shopping mall I helped up a boy who was being pushed around by 6 other lads- all about 14/15- told them they should be ashamed and to leave him alone, to be fair they all mumbled excuses half-heartedly and wandered off and the boy stayed with me til they'd gone. (I also called the school I thought they were from afterwards)

More recently I called the police and tried to talk to my neighbour about all the violence I hear from her house, nothings changed except she looks at me with utter disdain and refuses to even say hello

I would still intervene though, always. I honestly couldn't not.

Sometimes as well the prescence of another person will snap the abuser out of their "red mist" - this happened with XP, he was about to hit one of his friends and I was attempting to calm him down and failing, this scared me so I was steeling myself to call the police and then our next door neighbour came and knocked on the door. One second turn around - XP was suddenly "normal", charming, invited him in for a drink, etc.

My ex intervened when a bloke was hitting his girlfriend outside a city centre pub. The woman went batshit and said to him "Thanks a LOT. You've just given him another reason to kick me about when I get home."

It's a hopeless situation. You intervening there and then won't stop the abusive relationship. It'll still go on when you've finished saying your bit, and you'll have (inadvertantly) made it ten times worse (probably). But then human nature tells you it's right to help.

Really, it would be nice if a fifteen stone brick shithouse happened to be passing and took umbrage to little twats like this and punched them into next week. I would love to see that happen.

OP the only person in the wrong here is the evil bastard treating his wife like an animal. If you had have said anything it could have made it a lot worse for her, as we all know that these controlling/bully types would not like being confronted or shown up. He clearly is a complete arse. I often think about what goes on, the stuff you DONT see.
As a child my sister and I witnessed a woman with a tiny baby being chased, kicked and punched by a man. She also had her two young daughters with her who were terrified. I was very upset by this. It has stayed with me. I knew the two daughters, they were at our school. I pray for this woman and her children, I hope they are living in peace and are happy.
I also pray for countless other women and men, stuck in the confines of bad relationships. We are all human and have needs. I was once needy and married a man (term used loosely) who mentally and physically abused me. He vitrually brainwashed me. He did the same to his next girlfriend.
My point is, its not as easy as it sounds to get involved.
Back in the 70's my mum and dad were out in our home town. At the end of the night they were waiting at a bus stop when a man in the queue began punching his girlfriend savagely in the face. My dad (by no means a hard man or confrontational and only 5'8") challenged him to hit a man like he hit his poor gf.
Next news the abusive man was knocked out and thrown over a small wall into a local park. Yep, my dad lost it there. Then he and my mum took gf to be seen at hospital. My dad is quite the feminist. I am proud of him for giving the bastard a taste of his own medicine.
I kept it from him about violent xh, as did not want dad to wade in.
He would have done, and could have got hurt, as he is disabled now.

These violent twats infuriate me.
Sorry for my bad language

bupcakes you are bang right.

Just the point i was trying to make.

LeQueen does it worry you that your H would always step in, though? I ask because my H is much the same - ex rugby player, 16 stone, 6ft 3 etc, so he's not worried about getting hurt. I do worry though. Because it doesn't matter how big and strong someone is if some nutter pulls a knife out.

Now we're getting old and craggy our nights out are few & far between, but when we used to regularly go clubbing I would dread seeing anyone getting set upon because I would be terrified H would jump in and end up getting hurt himself

I've got involved twice. Once a guy was shouting and pushing a woman around in the street, I stopped and asked her if she was okay, she said yes, the bloke then muttered evilly as I walked on 'now see what you've done, you...' and I was really worried I'd made things worse.

The second, a girl was actually running away from a bloke, he caught up with her and pushed her into the wall right next to me, then turned and glared at me asking what I was fucking looking at. I replied "A bully" and asked her if shewas ok. She said no, and I asked her if she wanted to come with me and get away for a bit, the guy started dragging her back down the road. As it happened, by the grace of God there was an ambulance van parked up on the road there (there's a little layby there and they often park there on breaks) and the guy had the window rolled down. I asked him if he could help the girl and as he got out the bloke ran off. I don't know what happened after that as I had DD with me, but hopefully whatever the hell was going on, the girl was ok.

I hate bullies. I do tend to intervene.

(think I'm being a bit kind with the '16 stone' guess BTW )

What you're describing reminded me of this

Le Queen will you teach me the death stare please?

On a more serious note, the story you tell first off is probably very common, these women have a sort of skewed loyalty to their partners so will jump to their defence, when in reality, they need defending themselves

When I read stuff like on this thread it makes me genuinely grateful for my quiet life, others arent so lucky.

LeQueen I think I'm developing a bit of a virtual crush on Mr LeQ.

Only a virtual one, though so please don't death stare at me.

Very upsetting to witness this OP . I wonder what Womens Aid would advise re how to tackle public violence/abuse? If we all did it, if there was a format we could all follow, then possibly.... but, then, perhaps it would drive the abuse underground iyswim

I think you could call the local police and tell them about the incident, the exact date and time, and ask them if they can follow it up via cctv - they could follow the incident from the garden centre to the carpark, and could get the reg no of the car. Is that possible ie is the resolution good enough to get the reg no? Even so, this man may be known to them and they will anyway be grateful for any evidence they can stack up against him.

I'm a great 999-er. I don't hesitate and always apologise in case it isn't appropriate but I have never once been told it was - on the contrary, the police are always grateful. Better to be safe than sorry imo. I think you can call the local station now OP, even after the event, and ask for a follow-up ie for them to let you know how they will be following it up.