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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To expect my son's yr 4 teacher to be older

268 replies

katedan · 08/09/2011 21:17

I know it is like policeman and a sign I am getting older but WTF she is 22 and this is her first teaching job a class of 35 8/9 yr olds. She seemed so out of her depth and it is only day 2.

I am really worried she will not be able to keep the class interested and the standard of my son's education will suffer.

AIBU?

OP posts:
SoupDragon · 08/09/2011 22:16

Because "experienced" is meaningless. You can be experienced and shit. It's not that hard to understand.

I want my children to be taught by good teachers but that doesn't mean they have to be experienced. Perhaps the best teacher DS1 had was newly qualified, fresh and enthusiastic.

Feenie · 08/09/2011 22:16

You can do a whole phrase with a whatsit at the beginning and the end, southeastastra.

Fontsnob · 08/09/2011 22:16

Um no....same amout of time it took you to apply such wit in adding italics to my name!

Please do explain what you meant though, i'm very interested.

exoticfruits · 08/09/2011 22:17

Age is irrelevant to the children and should be to their parents.

Exactly. They don't see age in the same way. I remember a 5yr old being terrified of the fire alarm (just testing), he was on my knee in floods of tears, he was just about to go and do some work with a student, to cheer him up I said 'you are going to work with Miss x -she will look after you-you will be alright with her' to which he said 'why, is she older than you?' This was quite nice for me as Miss x was about 20yrs and I was old enough to be her mother! (luckily Miss X never heard Grin)
DCs seem to spot grey hair and wrinkles as old-everything else is equal!

SoupDragon · 08/09/2011 22:18

you do realise only need the italic things at the beginning and end of a sentence don't you?

I thought you were an experienced mumsnetter, SEA.

southeastastra · 08/09/2011 22:20

i want my children to be educated that same soup

i just think maybe a nqt should do an nvq rather than go straight into teaching a class

though i also know so many ta's that are more experienced than teachers yet earn a fraction of their wage

the system doesn't work very well

maypole1 · 08/09/2011 22:20

Sorry but its just my view I feel the age gap in secondary is too close, I work on social services and I really do think having social workers who are 22 don't have children know whats really invalid in running a family because they still live with their mum is awful

I had many rows with younger sw about their views of parents, parenting skills being they were wrong because they just don't have that understanding of running a family, being married running a home that I feel some of the older works do

But saying that some of the workers who have children are a little shocking.

southeastastra · 08/09/2011 22:21

hehe at a new teacher being 'fresh' Grin

acsec · 08/09/2011 22:22

I think what SEA meant to say was italicise. Ah I am glad I am an experienced teacher with 7 years under my belt so that I am able to correct grammatical errors. Just think if I were still one of those NQTs I would not have the experience to correct it!

Feenie · 08/09/2011 22:22

NVQ? You what???

Of course experienced TAs don't earn as much - they don't have anywhere near the workload and respnsiblility.

TheFallenMadonna · 08/09/2011 22:22

I want my children taught by a good teacher. Experience has it's plusses, but so does the enthusiasm and creativity that NQTs seems to have in abundace these days. I reckon over their school career, my DC will have a taste of it all, and that's a good thing!

southeastastra · 08/09/2011 22:23

teachers should be older

exoticfruits · 08/09/2011 22:23

SW also have to gain experience.

maypole1 · 08/09/2011 22:23

South to totally agree I thin primay its fine but I do think extra training for secondary I needed and judging by the amount of failing schools their are

TheFallenMadonna · 08/09/2011 22:24

They need an NVQ on top of a PGCE? You know a PGCE is heavily weighted to classroom experience, don't you?

Fontsnob · 08/09/2011 22:24

OKay, SEA, do you know that the teacher will have done one of two routes, either....gone to uni for a 4 year teaching degree with lots of classroom teaching time built into that or she would have gone to uni, got a degree then done an PGCE which involves LOTS of teaching time and now she is an NQT who is still getting support as she teaches.

I'm actually not being arsey now, i'm just trying to explain the path she has taken to become qualified as i'm not sure you fully realise what an NQT is.

Hulababy · 08/09/2011 22:26

NQTs don't go straight into the classroom fresh from university!

During their PGCE they spend most of that year in the classroom, gradually moving from supervised to unsupervised. It is a bit like an NVQ in some ways as they have a list of competencies they have to achieve as they go through the year, showing they can meet them on more than one ocassion, having work signed off, writing reports and keepingannotated records of evidence.

It;s different to when I did my teaching quals a few years ago but a friend of mine did hers just a year or two ago, she is just finishing her NQT year this Christmas iirr, so the new way is more like a nvq approach anyway.

Also, during NQT year they are monitored lots. They have a mentor and weekly meetings, keeping records of evidence, checking off targets and competencies, etc.

Fontsnob · 08/09/2011 22:26

The TA's are experienced at doing the job of a TA not of that of a teacher i.e. teaching a class.

babybythesea · 08/09/2011 22:28

SEA - I think there are a fair few people who see younger children as easier, and needing to know less 'stuff', therefore easier to teach.

Have a think about your own experience of children at home though. Would you have said the easiest stage was the newborn baby phase, because they are younger? Have you entertained two toddlers at home, and then two eight year olds? I would have the eight year olds any day - they know basically what is required of them in terms of behaviour, and can get on with stuff themselves.

I have experience of teaching all ages from nursery up to sixth form (not in a school but in a place where school visits took place). I love little kids. But they are much harder work than the big kids. Big kids already know the 'rules' (hands up for speaking so we can all hear each other for example),little kids don't. So no, you are not delivering in depth info, but you are constantly interrupting the flow of the lesson with comments like:
Don't sit on his lap - well, because he doesn't seem to like it. Just sit on your own bottom on the floor.
Sit down, please. No, just sit down. Because we're all looking at this and we need to be sitting down to see it properly.
Don't worry, we can clean it up, but next time maybe try and tell someone that you need the toilet, ok?
And: Put your hand up... hold on, I haven't asked the question yet. Ok, I'm pleased so many of you can put your hands up. Put them down for a moment. Now, I'm going to ask a question and if you think you know the answer, don't say anything, don't tell me, keep it a secret but show me you know by putting your hand in the air. Ok?

Year 4s are much easier to manage. You don't need to 'parent' them in quite the same way (eg you don't need to ask them every few minutes if they need to go to the loo because you will be away from a toilet for 10 minutes - they understand concepts like 'go now because you won't have a chance for a few minutes!'). Largely, they can get their own clothing off and on (coats, trousers with stubborn buttons which cause accidents). They recognise their own belongings - amazing how many tiny children swear blind a coat isn't theirs and because they can't read the name label carefully sewed in won't have it that yes, it does in fact belong to them...

But mainly, in this early stage, they are being taught to read. The most fundamental skill in education. Get that wrong and what secondary school they go to will be the least of your problems. Getting a very young person to understand that the funny shapes on the page correspond to sounds, which build up into words, especially when a lot of those shapes sound different depending on what other shapes are around them, especially when said young child is more worried about when he's going to eat lunch, or whether someone else will play with the bricks he was playing with when you called him away to do this 'reading' thing - that's hard hard going.

SoupDragon · 08/09/2011 22:28

As an aside, the very young NQT DS had in Y1 taught the head's child that year. I rather think that is a seal of approval given the other Y1 teachers were more experienced.

LoopyLoopsPussInBoots · 08/09/2011 22:29

"i just think maybe a nqt should do an nvq rather than go straight into teaching a class"

Why? That's like getting a doctor to do a BTEC.

TheFallenMadonna · 08/09/2011 22:29

It's completely different to when I qualified. I had a 4 sides of A4 summary of my skills and competence, and I was good to go.

Hulababy · 08/09/2011 22:30

I am now working as a TA. I am older than the young, although not nqt, teacher I am working with this year. I have far ore classroom experience. Indeed I have far more teaching experience. I am also as well qualified as her. However I do earn a fraction of her wage. But that is because to do my job I don't have to have that level of qualification nor experience. It is my choice to work in a job that is lower paid than I could get if I returned to teaching. A teacher gets paid more than a TA because they do a different job, they have to have a greater level of qualification and training, they have greater responsibility, more work load, etc. Some TAs have no qualifications at all, they don;t have to.

cardibach · 08/09/2011 22:30

SEA teachers have a degree and a post-graduate qualification, so have already gone beyond NVQs. The PGCE doesn't give 'several hours' in the classroom, as someone said, but several months. BEd qualified teachers will have done more in all probability.

Experience is good, but can only be got by being given a job. That's why NQTs are closely supervised and receive even more training during their first yeasr - to ensure that their lack of experience does not affect anyone's learning. And as various people have said, they are more up to date with educational thinking and may have more enthusiasm and energy than older teachers.

Newbabynewmum · 08/09/2011 22:31

PGCE years are widely renowned to be the hardest year of people's lives. This is because of the time and effort that it takes from gaining a qualification.

Lots of students (ESP in highschools) enjoy having younger teachers from my experience. They feel they can understand and relate to them better.

IMO an NQT is highly likely to be a brilliant teacher. They will (mostly) put a huge amount of effort into the classes. Like others have said they will be fresh and new to the profession which is a good thing.

To gain NQT status as others have explained you do lots of teaching. I don't think she'll have a problem controlling your DC's class in anyway. The headteacher obviously thinks she'll be good enough that's why she was hired.