To think the NHS is bloody wonderful and that we're very, very lucky?

[ScaredyDog]

I know everyone will have had a bad experience (I know I have) but generally, I think we're so lucky.

I've been to one hospital today as an emergency and been referred elsewhere. I don't have to pay to see a doctor, the staff have been absolutely lovely (which I hope they will also be at the other hospital) and I was seen immediately. We even had a laugh about my ridiculously sized elephant foot :)

I know prescriptions can seem expensive, but really, that's the only bit we pay for upfront so to speak (and most people don't pay for their prescriptions, I'm told).

Hoping for another good experience at the next hospital anyway :) Yay for HCPs and the NHS.

For emergency and critical care I don't think it can be beaten.
Even with provision for my kids' needs it's often that they want to help (ie speech therapy) but they can't afford to.... that's the NHS' weaker side.
The admin side is a bit of a nightmare to negotiate too.

In preserving life though, I agree fantastic, and in terms of the people who work for the organisation I'd say the majority were fantastic, dedicated people who really care about making a difference.

It's bloody wonderful not perfect but it's given me my life back.
I have a long term chronic disease which has no cure but there are fab treatments which make life bearable and can prevent severe disablement and other serious complications. Main problem with this is the drugs cost serious money and take serious monitoring. I know of lots of other sufferers ( we have an active network) around the world in Europe, US & Australia who don't have access to these drugs/ treatments or ration them to when they can afford them (thus reducing there effectiveness) or go without education/ food etc to enable them to live their lives safely and not in agonising pain. The chronic nature of the disease means that any insurance based scheme or even contribution based scheme (Australia ) it can quickly fall down.
NHS bloody love it just hope the muppets in charge don't cock it up!

we are so lucky to have it, i've never had a bad experience (although i'm sure others have), but i think its wonderful that everyone can get treatment regardless of income

I completely agree, OP. I visited a relative in hospital in Africa and I was shocked. It was one of the better hospitals as well.

If I lived in the USA, I'd actually be better of as both dh and I work, currently have no children and have no major risk factors. We calculated our private premiums would be lower than the tax we pay for the NHS. But, and it's a big but, if my circumstances changed suddenly, I could be caught out in the USA. What if one of us is made redundant, and suddenly gets cancer through no fault of our own? It can happen. I know a number of people it has happened to. The number one cause for losing one's home in the USA is debt due to medical bills. At least on the NHS, I know I can afford to be treated. So even though it is a more expensive system for me personally, I still love the NHS.

cogito the problems you have mentioned have been human error.
Yes system do fail, but more often than not things go wrong as humans make mistakes, do unexplainable things.
You think privatising the system will reduce the likelyhood of human error or evil individuals???

laryg
national insurance contributions do not even come close to covering the full cost of the NHS and have not done since the early sixtys.
It is HEAVILY subsidised by the government
So instead of feeling honoured, perhaps grateful to Bevan when he decided that the people of Britain deserved a quality health service that was free at the point of use.
We are lucky that when we take ill, the paramedics first question is not 'do you have insurance'

LOVE LOVE LOVE THE NHS!

As for people like cogito saying things like: YABU... This week we've had the case of paralyzed teen Sophie Tyler - her life ruined after a routine op. Misdiagnoses are rife and thousands die needlessly each year.

Do you honestly think that in countries with private healthcare as standard medicla negliegnce doens't exist and mistakes never happen?! The US is a great example, it happens ALL the fucking time. Don't get me started on the private health care in the UK, it's worse than the NHS. It's ridiculous to assume that no one ever makes a mistake or misdiagnoses anything in the private system.

spam most people here (US) are one medical emergency away from financial ruin...you are right.

I am interested in your figures... unless your employer covers most of your insurance ...you will still have to take in to consideration high deductible plans.

For example, in our situation we have a 30/70 agreement ,visits to the Doctor (for the most simple thing) will normally cost about $50. That is with my DH paying $250 a month for insurance through his company.

Here my local Doctor (as much as I like him) will issue all kinds of testing to just cover his butt unfortunately.

I have had outstanding care here ,and diabolical treatment in the UK ...but I know what system I still prefer :)

YABU.

The German mandatory insurance model, or the French single-payer system, or Singapore's voucher system are all far more financially sustainable. Comparing to America or the third-world is stupid.

We are thankfully moving to the French model under the timid Blair reforms and Lansley's timid extensions of them though.

I am grateful for individual doctors and nurses within the NHS system (and within the private system) when they have done a good job with the health of family members and myself with compassion and care.

That doesn't mean I am grateful for the system, which I feel is deeply and fundamentally flawed. The only bright spot is that the flaws are being addressed, if only very slowly.

YANBU. My experience of acute need in the NHS has been nothing but incredible.

When DH was diagnosed with cancer recently he had his diagnosis the day he phoned up for an appointment, a staging scan the next day and his operation the day after. This halted any growth instantly and prevented the need for chemo. Also had related fertility interventions very quickly. Looking at forums for the same cancer, people in other developed countries are waiting weeks and weeks post-diagnosis for their insurance to approve scans and operations. They aren't even considering fertility implications at that stage. Leads to a lot more worry, and a lot more complications.

I've volunteered in developing countries where there is one general doctor for 300+ miles radius and where people often die from asthma attacks. We are very lucky.

The ultimate question for all those who worship at the altar of the NHS (as a system I mean, rather than being grateful for individual care) is this:

If it is so wonderful, then why has no other country in the world copied its funding model, even slightly?

PIMS,

I did not mention NI but general tax. Other people made the mistake that NI is for the health service.

"It is heavily subsidised by the government".

Oh dear, where does one start when dealing with this kind of statement. Do you think David Cameron and the rest of the coalition dig into their pockets to personally subsidise the NHS? The government is your and my taxes. The taxes I have paid to ue the NHS over my lifetime are probably, at a minimum, 10x the benefit I have received from it. And the service has been (with the exception of one occasion) distinctly average, bordering on poor.

Why do so many people on this thread keep comparing the NHS with Africa? Is that really the benchmark the UK should be aiming for. Objectively, outcomes are poor compared with most of the developed world and it is not particularly cheap. And attitudes within it vary from the wonderful to the truly shocking.

If it is so wonderful, then why has no other country in the world copied its funding model, even slightly?

Because they're too tight fisted? No other country has such a generous beneftis system either.

longfingernails their governments are to greedy to make the financial commitment
And I could have sworn Obama was trying to push a bill for public health care through America...
And as for taking the piss out of people giving credit where it's due (worshiping at the alter) I don't see many people paying for long term health care in other countries singing the praises of their sympathetic insurers!
They are hoping to god their insurance will continue to cover them or they stay in a job that will provide otherwise they have to make the choice between health care and money/debt
Do you know how much ONE night I'm ITU costs in any country??? I pray you never have to find out

Some people just don't realise how lucky we are. We don't have to be wealthy to get the treatment we need. The NHS is not perfect but no system is. Having to pay private insurance for treatment wont make it any better -just more expensive.

PIMSoclock Obama's plans are for a mandatory insurance system. Nowhere close to the government actually running the majority of hospitals.

You haven't paid for it through your taxes, thats the thing. If you went through the costings and worked out the actual cost of all the care you have recieved since you were born, it wouldn't come close to being in the same universe as what you pay towards it.

And you wouldn't be complaining about the NHS if you lived somewhere without it. In the last few months I've paid out for GP's, A&E charges, bed charges for children admitted to hospital, Day ward charges for myself, procedure charges, full medicine costs, full dental costs for children......

You are SO lucky in the UK. You have no idea.

Larygyls, I think you underestimate the cost of health care. The cost of every consultation, investigation, hospital admission.
You had a child admitted to ITU?? the bed cost alone is £1500 plus medication, plus your wifes antinatal care, delivery an epidural in the Portland is an extra £3000!!
Plus you are still in good health!!
Your child will have been seen by hv, mw, vaccines etc.
God forbid that you require treatment and or even long care!!
The amount that you rack up in a life time will be value for money. Along with the security that your care will never be finite depending on what your cover or how much you've paid is!

A1980 Nothing to do with being tight fisted.

Check out % of gdp spent on health. We lag behind most European countries.

www.nationmaster.com/graph/hea_tot_exp_as_of_gdp-health-total-expenditure-gdp

What's with the constant comparisons to US and Africa? No one has suggested privatisation (on this thread) or that we should have a 3rd world Health service.

longfingernails
I asked that people were grateful for healthcare free at the point of use.
You asked why no one else had jumped on that band wagon?? Well they have! It's a very different system that realises the same principle.

I think the NHS is more efficient than good (ie does a lot for the price), but having used the French, German and Dutch systems I'd say they are definitely better, but they spend about 25% more per person. The US system is different again - very good, but very expensive comparatively and lots can't afford it.

Have any of you read the book "My Sister's Keeper" ?

The story of the child Kate who is ill with leukaemia and the paretns create a saviour sibling? It provides an insight too into what US healthcare is like. Even though they have full coverage insurance they come home to a door mat full of hospital bills when their child comes out from her first round of chemo.

When she has a relapse at 8 years old, her doctors decide she needs a bone marrow transplant. So her paretns call up the insurance company to see if they'll fund it. They keep cutting her off and in the end refused to pay for it. Her paretns had to riase money themsleves and emptied Kate's savings account also to pay for the treatment.

In this country if NHS doctors made a clinical decision and decided a child (or an adult) needed a bone marrow transplant, they would be placed on the list and would get one once a match was found.

We have no idea we're born.

(Have also used Greek and Turkish systems - kids etc - the little Greek hospital was marvellous, the people were very nice)