to wonder how well we'd survive if the police totally lost control?

[RedAmberGreen]

I've been thinking alot about this today. I've got 3DC and I've brought them up to respect other people, share, not to hurt people or steal etc.
I'm now thinking if the police lost control and those people rioting took over my kids would have no chance.

Survival of the fittest....well my kids wouldn't survive because they aren't streetwise. I work with alot of very streetwise kids who have been taught by their parents to behave in the way these people are on the news.

My nearly 6 year old was telling me earlier that it was ok because the police would get all the baddies and put them in prison. I agreed with him and reassured him it would all be ok. Secretly I wonder because in the real world I know that the morals and values I've tried to instill in my children probably mean that should there be complete anarchy they would be toast.

It would take a lot more than this for society to collapse, it didn't during ww2, people aren't actually any different to then.

Carnival maybe that is the solution, a MN army of Mothers with PMT!

I suddenly feel like a grown up, everything is very serious!

Maybe this moment in my lifetime will be my "during the war" old lady story I can bore my grandkids with.

Certainly makes you think

Nihilisticbunny society is collapsing because people have no fear of the law any longer - prison sentences are a joke, the law protects the guilty, loopholes in the law allow people to walk free and flout the law

The police are doing a great job within the the boundaries that they are allowed to but they will always be blamed when things go shit shaped

If you were a criminal during the war years, the chances are you would be imprisoned for life for murder - or less and be hanged by your neck til you you were dead- there is no deterrent now

Not saying that I agree with capital punishment btw - just pointing it out

RedAmberGreen my PMT could cause catastrophic effects to the UK - I think I should sign ma bad self up to 'The Mothers Who Give A Fuck Where Their Kids Are At This Time Of Night' brigade and give all the naughty little bastards a good arse kicking

If there were no police..I would get a huge dog & put up a sign saying, 'please break in - dog food needed'.

My family & friends are working class & don't have much money but everyone I know rightly considers stealing to be one of the most shameful things you can do - only scum do that. Same with vandalising other people's hard-earned property.

Yet there are people I meet from similar backgrounds who are proud of being criminals & bring their children up to join gangs & commit crime. One woman I cared for at work proudly told me about 'when the armed police searched my house, my son's girlfriend was scared cos she ain't used to that sort of thing, but I was alright - the police are always coming round!'

She didn't hate the police - instead it was like they were 'mates'! My friends & I find it really annoying that the local police act really friendly to the groups of druggies, the drunks & known local gangsters. We would prefer zero tolerance.
Respect to the Turkish men in Dalston who came out to protect their shops & chased the rioters away - this shows what can be achieved when decent people stick together.

Interesting discussion. Haven't had time to read it all and my point may have been made already - sorry. Did you see Kevin McClouds (sp?) documentary on the slum in Mumbai? It was really interesting. They have virtually no crime there. Over a million people living in 1 square mile and no crime at all. No police either. They asked a 15 year old girl if she was afraid as she walked 2 miles to school alone every day. She did not understand what there was to be afraid of. Little toddlers played outside on there own but nothing ever happened to them.
I think the police are the problem. They won't let us sort out our own problems and always try to impose stupid rules on us to show they are in charge whilst crime has got totally out of hand. The police and the courts use up a large proportion of our gdp and give us nothing in return.
For information I don't even know anybody who has been in jail and have never been in a courtroom in my life. (We ordinary people just pay for it all).

RedAmberGreen and ILoveTiffany, you are actually teaching your children to be streetwise when you teach them to steer well clear of trouble. Safety and responsibility are the ultimate in streetwisdom. Parents and families should be the first line in the battle for civility and civilised values, not police.

I was impressed by the Sikhs in Southall who gathered at their temple 'just in case' and their idea that the whole community should stand together against the lawlessness.

BBC Radio 4 wringing it's hands about people defending their own neighbourhoods being vigilantes. Interviewee "well, if the police would come and sort this out we wouldnt have to"