to wonder why some primary teachers know very little about dyslexia?

[pleasekeepcalmandcarryon]

All the secondary schools I have visited seem very clued up about SpLD and provide decent support but imo it is a bit late in the day to leave dx and support until high school.

My DS has only just been diagnosed (privately not through school) at end of yr 5 and speaking to other parents I have discovered we are not the only ones. I also know children from other primary schools who have only been diagnosed in yr5/6 after parents have pushed or gone private (usually the latter).

The teachers at my son's school admit they don't know much about it. I am surprised at this as I would have thought it would be part of teacher training-I'm sure upwards of 10% of the population are dyslexic so it's not as though it is rare.

If dyslexia is recognised and understood it's not difficult to make adjustments/use technology and learning programmes such as toe by toe. Instead it seems that a lot of kids are still left to flounder in bottom groups without the right support unless stubborn and pushy proactive parents like myself try and get to the bottom of what is going on.

Most dyslexic children show classic signs (difficulty with timestables, can't tell time, spelling problems, poor handwriting) which to me stand out a mile particularly when the child (and all the ones I know are) is verbally articulate.

I don't understand why, when a fair amount of emphasis is put on testing for and supporting SpLD at secondary, there seems so little at primary level. Most of the damage to self esteem, self belief has probably happened by the time they are ten. I remember the dyslexic kids who were failed when I was at primary and not a lot seems to have changed in 30yrs.

I would be interested to hear POV of primary teachers as to whether this is normal across the country. Despite dyslexia being given a higher profile through celebs like Kara Tointon and this years Apprentice winner recognition still seems woeful.

All young children find telling the time difficult- "when the long hand points at 2 it means 10"! Sometimes the gaps only really start to show when they get older. There's also a deep fear in suggesting a specific difficulty in case you're wrong, so I think a lot of teachers are very cautious in raising issues.

corriefan- It's a bad thiing when as a parent you do know something is wrong and spend 3 years going in and out of the school expressing your opinion to have it dismissed because the understanding and knowledge isn't there.

I am far from alone in this experience but luckily for my DS I could afford to go private and he now understands he is dyslexic rather than stupid. He will have adjustments made for him in Yr 6 and hopefully will improve in confidence and academically. The school have been good about making these adjustments once an official report has told them.

What about the kids whose parents cannot afford upwards of £400 to see a private Ed Pysch? I guess they continue to believe they are stupid .

Ah, cross-posted please.

I may have answered your question now. But my worry would be, at an early age, many of those issues are hard to distinguish between normal development. I really think there's a problem with diagnosing dyslexia at the extremes - the over-average and under-average, who either compensate but get frustrated or fail worse than they should because no-one thinks to expect more. Some dyslexics aren't verbally articulate (it's actually more usual for spatial abilties and non-verbal reasoning to be high, rather than verbal scores).

I just don't think the examples you pick are helpful as 'classic signs' - too few, too general, too easy to misinterpret. Imo.

I think ideally the answer would be better systems for referring to ed. pyschs and other people qualified to test for dyslexia - not making teachers responsible, but making testing cheaper and easier to access.

I don't think teachers should be specialists, obviously they have too much other stuff to deal with but surely early intervention is better where possible.

Some schools have screening software they can do with a child in an hour but not all do. Some have Nessy or Toe by Toe that they might use with a child that is struggling regardless of a dx. All to often though nothing 'dyslexia friendly' is done at all.

Reading some of the posts above and other threads on here it does seem like a lottery as to whether a child will be picked up before secondary. I would like to see a change in government policy, funding and training to reflect this (ideal world stuff I know!)

LRD - yes it wasn't a comprehensive list, just some of the more common signs. Every child is different, I appreciate that.

I think you are right about the cheaper, better access to testing. The waiting list to see the ed psych at our school was about 6-12months. Unfortunately it means poor SEN kids are right at the bottom of the pile.

Yes, I totally agree about early intervention - I was just responding to what you said in your OP.

My brother failed to learn to read and write until he was 9 while his school insisted he was just lazy and I saw how upset and angry and frustrated he got while they set him tasks like colouring three ducks in a pond when the others were doing long division. I do agree with you.

I don't want to criticize teachers and I do think things have got much better, but I saw too much of teachers who insisted they knew what dyslexia was (based on little or no formal training), and this wasn't it. Fifteen years and several proper assessments would say otherwise!

And getting LEAs and Ed Psychs to recognise it in the first place would be helpful.

I didn't talk about whether individual schools would refute parental observations- that's a separate issue. I know how people have suffered having worked for a dyslexia charity for years. Nor can I comment oh funding for dx. I was talking about teachers being able to spot signs of dyslexia early on and the difficulties with that. I'm sorry to hear you've had a hard time with your school.

My OP wasn't a criticism of teachers, I had hoped that was clear. My son has had some great teachers but without specifically targeted intervention their efforts have been largely futile. He will never be able to learn things adequately by copying off a board or listening verbally.

I really empathise with your DB, it was my DS's distress at being given 'rubbish, easy work' that finally pushed me into going to see the Ed Psych.

I am hoping he will really turn a corner next year. I also believe in supporting the school so I have volunteered as a parent helper and am going to try and strong arm them ask nicely about getting some volunteer groups going with Nessy or Toe by Toe.

I work with moderate to severe dyslexics. I'm so proud of one of my year 5s this year. He has gone from level 7 on the reading scheme, at the beginning of September, to reading Harry Potter. It has been very slow going as we've been working together since he was in year 2. But it has finally all clicked into place for him.

School are now getting together a bank of easier to read but more age appropriate books from a publisher called Barrington Stoke. I do love the ORT books though, in the early stages, as they give that consistency and repetition that is important.

corriefan- I realise the difficultly and reluctance for teachers to spot and refer early on and that some parents may not welcome the information.

It just seems unfair when you are caught up in the middle of it. I would like to see a more structured referral system in place, one that was the same countrywide not LEA dependent.

Perhaps there are just too many new initiatives and new theories and subjects being stuffed into the time available.
Perhaps the government needs to stop overloading the curriculum and the staff with shiny new goodies and allow teachers to consolidate and work on priorities decided by those at the chalk face. Like knowing more about sn and how to develop effective strategies for support.
You can't learn enough about dyslexia in a couple of days of theory.

I was trying to talk the school into getting the Barrington Stoke books last term (pointless considering the budget cuts). My 10yr old would be more motivated by reading that sort of thing.

My DS discovered the Wimpy Kid books last year and they have been a great springboard onto more 'wordy' books. Really grateful to that author .

Captain Underpants is very good as well - extremely short chapters.

Have you asked the PTA for funding for class library additions?
I bought my son's school several resources and books to support understanding of Asperger's Syndrome. Not a good answer, but the only one available at the time.

AnansiGirl- Maybe that's something I could try. I give my other DS's teacher a book on ADHD everytime he moves up a class- sometimes it's the only way!

The school have been great with him btw, partly I think because he was dxed before he started. I'ts weird that my children have had polarised experiences in the same school. I think this one of the reasons I struggle with the unfairness so much, if I thought the school was bad I would remove them and go elsewhere, but DS2 is doing much better than expected and I know there are good teachers in the school.

As Feenie says, not every LEA recognises dyslexia as a discrete SEN. Ours doesn't. Our Ed.Psych will not screen for it and the LEA won't allow our SENCO to, despite the fact that she is fully trained to do so. Dyslexics only get support if they are below the 1st percentile in both lliteracy and maths! So the it is down to the individual school to support as best they can. Given that our SEN budget for resources this year averages out at £10 per SA+ and above child, and that Toe by Toe costs a minimum of £20 per child, how can we justify that level of spend on those children when it would mean others go without resources they also desperately need?
And actually, in our authority, even having a private diagnosis will not get you support in primary education, though I don't know about secondary sector.

Toe by Toe is such a brilliant resource. It is absolutely shameful how much it costs though.

I'm a primary teacher and have had no training on dyslexia. We've asked the local dyslexia testing centre for advice on how to help pupils who they have diagnosed and had no response.

We get NO additional funding for children unless they have a statement of special educational needs of over 20 hours. There is no money in the budget for buying the necessary technology, books or screening programmes.

My school had to push for years to get specialist help for one dyslexic child. We probably spent thousands of pounds of general budget money to support this one pupil in the end. His poor parents were exhausted by the system that refused to help them, despite the school begging for the help and supporting them. It's not that we don't want to help, but banging your head repeatedly against the brick wall that is the LEA hurts.

Manicbmc - you would really recommend Captain Underpants books? Even though they are full of intentional 'funny' misspellings? Surely they'd be more confusing for a child who is struggling with reading and writing.

If they capture a child's imagination and get them interested, then yes I would. But only as a stepping stone to other things and, most definitely, not exclusively. I've found some of the children enjoy picking out the misspellings.

Fair enough manicbmc. I read the initial post as a recommendation for the books like Barrington Stoke IYSWIM. I agree that they tend to capture the imagination - drive me mad though!

Rapid readers have gone down very well with some of my boys also.

With some of the children I find it can be a means to an ends. I have the luxury of not being class based and get the chance to get to know them well enough to tailor what we do to their interests - up to a point.

I've no formal training in dyslexia, just the usual classroom assistant NVQs, but I've learned a lot over the last 9 years.

I'm a primary trained teacher and, not only did we get no training on dyslexia, but one of the main lecturers was one of the most eminent voices in the country for the 'dyslexia does not exist' school of thought - so I had no chance!