To tell everyone who goes cycling (and their kids) to wear a fucking helmet ?

[ApocalypseCheeseToastie]

Had a phonecall off my sis last night about eldest brother who's a keen, confident cyclist.

She'd phoned him to nag for something or other and found out he'd been laid up for the past ten days after flipping over the bonnet of a car, doing a here's Johnny moment through the windscreen (his head smashed the window) and flipping over the roof.

Luckily he's a bit of a cycling nerd, he wears a high vis vest, refelective strips on trousers etc and most crucially A DECENT FUCKING HELMET

The helmet he was wearing was smashed into little pieces, it protected him from major injury and ultimately saved his life. Leaving him with a few cracked ribs and a dodgy coller bone, without it he would have been killed, a 42 year old guy who has everything to live for. He would have left behind a family who love him, and a 12 year year old daughter who he lives for.

So please, do a shocked cheese a big favour and if you don't already have one, go out today, buy a fucking helmet for everyone, including the soddin dog if needs be.

I thank you.

Of course cyclists and horse riders should be hi-viz - that increases the stopping time available to any drivers significantly if they can actually see them (I am a driver, cyclist and rider).

I am prepared to accept that drivers are more careful around helmet-less cyclists, does that carry through to less serious accidents for those wearing no helmet? Or do they have fewer, but more serious accidents.

Friend of mine is presently sporting a "funny nose" according to his son, when a branch got tangled up in his wheel on a cycle path. Not a fast or ultimately serious accident. But a helmet may have prevented the concussion, night in hospital and cancellation of their holidays.

Good points VirtualWitch. Cyclists are doing everyone a favour by staying out of their cars and should be encouraged in any way possible.

I have to say I do wear a helmet but have so far in nearly 40 years of cycling more days than not, I have never had an accident involving a vehicle or hit my head. The two times I have come off as an adult have been as a result of pedestrians walking into me! I think dh who has cycled more in central London than I have probably has benefitted from his helmet once or twice.

Children do fall off more though and I think they should have to wear a helmet.

And of course drivers should drive better, never be distracted, have a perfectly operating machine. But just in case they don't?

My children always wear helmets when riding their micro scooters or bikes. No helmet, no riding.

If other children on the school run ask why I tell them a friend's parent was killed when he was knocked off his bike and was not wearing a helmet

The way I see it is that we are more at risk from not wearing a helmet than if we wear one

As a driver I have never treated cyclists differently if they are or are not wearing a helmet, and whilst I appreciate there has been some studies on this, I do think the real problem is the culture of aggressive/crap driving we have in this country. Whilst that culture exists any cyclist, whether they are good or bad, take risks or cycle safely is at risk and so we will wear helmets.

I think the cycle helmet debate has nothing to do with bashing anyone but a matter of common sense. I doubt those cycling the Tour de France ONLY wear them for aerodynamics.

On a different point, one of my relatives has a serious motorscooter accident and had they been wearing their open face crash helmet they would have been killed. Luckily they had a full face one. I think for higher speeds motorised scooters/bikes half face helmets should be banned.

YANBU. My DS doesn't go on his scooter or bike without a helmet, neither does DH.

My pet peeve is cyclists who go on the road holding up all the traffic when there is a perfectly decent cycle path. USE IT!!!! Tends to be 'proper' cyclists with all the gear on who think (I guess) that cycle paths are beneath them or something. So dangerous because people get frustrated and overtake too close when there isn't really room.

Sorry it's a bit of a bugbear of mine as I see it every day when I take DS1 to nursery.

"perfectly decent cycle path"

do you mean a line painted along the gutter with lots of parked cars

or do you mean a track shared with pedestrians?

cyclists are much safer in the middle of the road, where cars must actually overtake instead of whizzing by, oblivious

Horses too!

flowery I rarely use cycle paths and get a fair bit of abuse from motorists for being in the road. I totally disagree with you about cycle paths. They are rarely 'perfectly decent' and as I've explained above I narrowly avoided a very nasty accident because a pedestrian stepped out from a bus stop behind the cycle lane to flag down a bus in the road - and stepped right in front of me at the bottom of a steep hill.

I live near Oxford which is meant to be cycle friendly. Our cycle lanes are ill-kept with weeds and gravel pushing through the tarmac. They are interrupted by road signs, bus shelters, bus stops, laybys, driveways, roundabouts, and switch frequently from one side of the road to the other, or deviate far back from the road which adds extra distance. They're also shared with pedestrians, runners, buggys, dog walkers, parents with young children on bicycles etc. It's not that I consider them beneath me, it's that it is dangerous for me to cycle along them at speeds varying from 15-30 mph and I'm putting other cycle path users (like kids on bikes, which is a great use of cycle lanes imo) at risk. It's better for all concerned if I'm in the road.

Yes flowery, please use the cyclepaths yourself!

My pet bugbear is drivers holding me up on my bike when they could just as well be on a bike themselves!

The English go crazy about this helmet issue, but then they sell bikes with no lights, no side reflectors, no protection around the chains, no mud protectors.

The Dutch approach is to avoid accidents, by selling safer bikes and providing decent cycle paths, rather than make cyclists wear helmets so they're in a little less pain when they have an accident.

I've had this discussion with many British people but they don't seem to grasp the concept and insist it's the Dutch being callous for not wearing helmets.

LieInsAreRarerThanTigers Thu 21-Jul-11 11:03:55

"Yes flowery, please use the cyclepaths yourself!"

Eh? I'm a driver.

Cycle path I'm referring to is perfectly decent, and cyclists on that particular stretch of road are dangerous. Better?

How do drivers hold you up LieIns? And how do you know which ones could be using a bike?

"you should be equally vociferous about car occupants being legally required to wear properly-fitting helmets too, as well as horse-riders, motor-trike & motor-quad bike riders."

As a horse rider & driver myself, you hardly ever see anyone riding on the road without a helmet on (I in fact never have), and more often than not, wearing hi viz which is equally important. You get the odd dickhead who will ride their horse at home without a hat because it 'looks cool', but this is just as dangerous (as no doubt Courtney King-Dye will attest to). It is also a legal requirement for any child aged 14 or under to wear a riding hat.

As for Motor-trike & quad bike riders, why it is the law to wear a helmet on a 2 wheeled bike but not 3 or 4 I will never understand, again, I think it goes back to being cool looking like a dickhead

flowery I was suggesting that perhaps you could choose not to be a driver? That never crossed your mind, did it. Sigh.
I delivered both my children to nursery/childminder (in London) on bike seats.
Have you actually used the cycle path at all?
And although you use this specific example I believe you may feel that cyclists should just use the cyclepath generally, and it alsoseems your main concern was not the cyclists' safety but 'holding up all the traffic' i.e. you.

Well not knowing anything about my personal circumstances you are not in a position to judge whether I could choose not to drive, are you?

My concern is the cyclists safety and holding up the traffic, which are linked.

Cycle path I'm referring to is perfectly decent, and cyclists on that particular stretch of road are dangerous

But nonetheless the vast majority of cycle paths aren't fit for purpose. Does it still bother you on other stretches of cycle path or road?

And I still disagree - surely it is the motorists who are dangerously overtaking, not the cyclists? Therefore it's actually the motorists who are behaving dangerously? I was nearly clipped by a car which squeezed past me right inside a bollard in the road - when I was signalling left and about to turn off. If he'd waited another 5-10 seconds to go by he would have been in the clear. Apparently some motorists think that a few seconds of their life is well worth the safety of another human being - that's the real problem here...

So you haven't used or examined the cycle path then.

Not personally, no. DH cycles to the station daily and I trust his feedback.

Yes I think generally where there is a cycle path cyclists should use it. If it's not useable, ie not looked-after or whatever, fine don't use it and complain to the council or whoever.

And yes motorists overtaking dangerously is obviously wrong, but acknowledging that some drivers just are overimpatient and take risks, where there is a decent cycle path that reduces the chance of those risks being taken, so cyclists should use it imo.

cycle paths have speed limits and bicycles are traffic. Not holding up traffic. They are traffic.
Motor vehicle drivers need to remember roads arent just for them.

"cycle paths have speed limits"

I'm not sure I understand what point that is making.

Yes of course motorists need to accept cyclists are also traffic. But imo where there is a decent cycle path it is there for a reason and it is to both cyclists and motorists benefit for it to be used.

because cycle paths are shared spaces with a 15 mph speed limit. Thats too slow for the average commuting cyclist and dangerous for walkers.
Roads are where traffic should be.

Cycle paths are a nightmare for anything but a Sunday afternoon pootle at the speed my 7 year old goes on a bike. We have shared paths round here now so no lines marking off the walking and cycling bits, which makes it a real hazard for cyclists. I run on these paths and always look behind me for cyclists before moving across the path but most walkers don't do that IME.

I like to cycle at a decent pace too and you can't do that on a cycle path either. They are often not well maintained either so can be a hazard for road bikes which have very skinny tyres.

For those that have said most accidents with bikes involve cars MINE DIDN'T! I skidded on ice and knocked myself unconscious. I still have the scars and a lump on my leg from the accident, 18 months ago now.

There is an old man who rides his bike locally ,he wears a helmet , he also has the most terrifying riding tecnique i have ever seen ,he kind of wobbles/weaves along . I thought this was really dangerous until i mentioned it to a policeman i was chatting to , he said ' yeah but everyone gives him a really wide berth' and its true they really do , you have to overtake him as though he were a car because his wobble can take up as much room ! I have to say i like to give cyclists plenty of room when overtaking them anyway ,but this guy ,you are practically in the ditch on the otherside of the road .

flowery I've only just noticed your other question 'How do drivers hold me up?' I see you really never have cycled! As you say I am not familiar with your personal circumstances, so I won't comment any further on that, but here are a few examples:

When they overtake me just before a junction then stop and sit there spewing exhaust in my face.
When they overtake me then slow down and turn left in front of me.
When there is a queue of traffic and no room for me to get past.
When I am waiting for someone to manoeuvre into a parking space or to see what their behaviour is going to be (especially at times like school pick-up where the many dangerously and illegally parked cars cause a hazard for cyclists, children and pedestrians)

Of course I can't tell exactly who could cycle but I do have a fairly good idea that probably many of them could. I know people, and always have known people, who drive when they could cycle, for example, so presumably this is a similar pattern throughout the population.

I do drive and am not anti-motorist per se, just don't like the kind of attitude your post represented.

Good for your dh though.